Music Education Degrees and searching for a college

College Majors Music Major
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<p>We have visited a few colleges this week and found that they offer a couple different degrees for a Music Educator. Not all offered a Bachelor of Music of Music Education. Some offered only Bachelor of Science in Music Education and others Bachelor of Arts in Music Education. One of the music department heads we had an appointment with suggested that there are few enough jobs in Music Education and a graduate would want a Bachelor of Music (BM) of Music Education and that job applicants with the other two degrees would be placed at the bottom of a pile of resumes.</p>

<p>We don't know if he just passed on that info b/c that is what their school was offering or if it is, in fact, the truth!</p>

<p>Comments??</p>

<p>Also, through our travels we have heard that Potsdam is not as 'attentive' to Music Education majors and there is a feeling that the Music Performance majors rule there while the Music Education majors are treated as not as important or serious.
Anyone have any knowledge of this?
Thanks in advance to anyone who replies!!</p>

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<p>I cannot comment firsthand on Potsdam’s treatment of Music Ed majors as my D does not attend Potsdam. She did audition there and while we liked the Horn professor very much the rest of the music school was not to her liking. We left audition day saying that even a full ride would not convince her to attend. However, many who attend Potsdam/Crane do love it.</p>

<p>Ultimately my D ended up at SUNY Fredonia, something we did not expect. We almost did not even attend the audition but thankfully we did and from the minute we got there we loved it. At the info meetings the staff of the SOM there kept saying that they take they take Music Education seriously and that even for those students that insist on doing Performance majors they try to encourage them to double major in Music Ed or to major in Music Ed bc the difference in the two majors at Fredonia is very slight (a couple of classes, both Music Perf and Music Ed majors at Fredonia get hour lessons every week). The atmosphere at Fredonia is warm and friendly. My D does not notice any difference in the way she, as a Music Ed major, is treated from the way the Performance or Music Ed majors are treated.</p>

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<p>Are you interested in Music Education because you really want to teach children? If not please consider another path. It should not be an economic fall back to a performance career. Children deserve someone who really wants to teach. </p>

<p>That said, I think more important than what degree they confer is the success of their students, beyond the placement rate on graduation. Where are the students placed? How may are still successfully teaching 5 years after graduation? Those education schools that are worth it know. Research each school you are interested in and do not be afraid to ask detailed questions.</p>

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<p>Some general background in understanding the differences:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/561184-help-understanding-ba-vs-bfa-vs-bm.html?highlight=understanding[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/561184-help-understanding-ba-vs-bfa-vs-bm.html?highlight=understanding&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/412685-bm-vs-ba.html?highlight=bachelors[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/412685-bm-vs-ba.html?highlight=bachelors&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>In general, a BA is more liberal arts centered, and the graduation requirements will include a large percentage of liberal arts rather than music specific or education centered coursework. Depending on the institution, private lessons may be a half hour, rather than the typical hour per week for BM students; ensemble requirements may be less, requiring 4 semesters of participation, rather than a typical 6 for a BM in mus ed, or 8 for a performance major.</p>

<p>A BM is heavily weighted to applied music coursework, and will also include more semester requirements in music theory, history, piano skills, potentially additional small ensemble participatory requirements, as well as the mandated courses in applied specific music and general teaching methodologies.</p>

<p>The BS in music ed tends to be a more educational methodology focused curriculum with greater concentration on applied education theory and practice, less liberal arts requirements than a BA variant, and normally a bit less music insofar as theory, history, and participatory ensemble requirements.</p>

<p>The devil is in the details. For a nuts and bolts comparison, you need to compare the course outline and requirements for each type of degree. This information is detailed within the undergrad handbook, typically found in a link off the institution’s academic webpage(s).</p>

<p>If you look at a range of offerings, and study the detail, you will begin to see the patterns.
One school’s BS may be very similar to another’s BM. What is important is to understand what the end result will be. Most BM and BS are pre-professional programs geared to allow a successful student to achieve initial or provisional k-12 public teacher licensure in the state the program is offered. Some BA programs are overviews, and may not fulfill ALL the necessary coursework to prepare a graduate for provisional state licensure. Many BA programs will, so it is important to fact check exactly what the differences will achieve.</p>

<p>If she plans to stay instate, it’s also important to realize that some state (and private) programs tend to serve as feeder schools for specific districts. Many programs have extremely high placement rates and are happy to share where their new grads are working.
Talking to local & regional public school teachers and administrators will also get you insight as to what grads/schools they tend to favor.</p>

<p>You might want to pm euphgal, a current performance/ed major at Potsdam for her assessment. I believe I had posted some links in one of your earlier threads, with some of her comments. </p>

<p>Son has peers that graduated from Hartt, Crane, NYU, and Ithaca with music ed degrees. None had issues with obtaining job offers prior to graduation. It’s not the degree, nor the school, but what the student achieves while earning it.</p>

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<p>Our son graduated this Jan Music Education from Rutgers University, music ed.
He takes his music VERY seriously and did not find that education majors were slighted or treated differently. He had same number of lessons and was in MANY ensembles. The course requirements for the two tracts were not so different, mostly he did need to satisfy a few education courses and indeed spent an extra semester to complete his student teaching.
He was approached by quite a few contacts about job openings upon graduation. He is picking up quite a few days subbing in our public schools and enjoying it thoroughly. His music education degree is not hindering him from pursuing a performance masters that he will begin this fall. Like said above, it’s highly individual and our son certainly wouldn’t let a few details stand in his way when it comes to music.</p>

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<p>solved the mystery. i did speak to our district music head and she said much the same and that she would put more emphasis on the school and person than on the exact degree of Mus Ed.</p>

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<p>we visited Fredonia and although i didn’t want to like it ( we live on long island and it is very far!), my D, husband and myself were very impressed and did find it to be a warm, friendly place!</p>

<p>Is your daughter a freshman?
how was her 1st year there??</p>

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<p>My son will be starting at Crane in September. He will Double Major in Performance and Music Ed. Ultimately my son’s decision was based on several factors, the teacher, area and other students. We had our choice of several schools (my son wanted to stay in NY) and chose Potsdam because he felt he really meshed there. He likes the small town and campus, and really felt at home with the studio he was joining. he also really had a learning experience during his visits there and found the studio prof to be excellent, extremely supportive and insightful. He also made no bones that he wanted my son in his studio. The other funny thing about his decision was the music building. I am completely happy with his decision. No second thoughts. </p>

<p>As to whether Crane treats Music Ed students differently than performance students, I have not found this to be the case based on my experience and conversations with many current Crane students and graduates. Crane’s bread and butter is music ed, they don’t give it second billing. Crane has been in the Music Ed business for a long time and there aren’t many school districts in NY that don’t have a Crane grad on staff. That said most Crane grads are very proud of their school. </p>

<p>His impression of the other schools was that the prof at Hartt would be away to often, he didn’t like Ithaca (the college, not the city) and really did not have a learning experience at Fredonia at all, he just wasn’t a good fit with the instructor.</p>

<p>One thing I found interesting about Music Ed schools in NYS. They ALL seem to have some bizarre tales to tell about the other schools. Three in particular, Ithaca, Potsdam and Fredonia. Kind of unnerving.</p>

<p>btw we are on LI as well, Crane is an 8 hour drive from here and you really have no other options.</p>

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<p>From our experience visiting a number of schools, it depends on the school and the instrument. At University of North Texas-Denton, for example, we were told that music majors are frequently relegated to graduate students for their voice lessons. For other music schools, this is not the case. It’s a question to ask of any school the student is considering applying.</p>

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<p>car, I noticed on thread in a different subforum you were interested in PA schools. As your d is both a violist and a potential teacher, you may want to look into Penn State’s program.</p>

<p>Tim Deighton is a gifted and sought after teacher, many sing his praises, and the Penn State program is well known and respected. Historically, there is no “discrimination” between ed and performance majors within the program. Con’s may be size of the school (although the music school encompasses 300-400 ish students), and talent/academic aid offered to oos applicants.</p>

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<p>I have to agree with Sagiter, Our D is going to Crane this fall for a double major (ED and Performance and possibly a French Minor). We did a lot of research before she applied and accepting and we found very little negative from present students and former students. We are lucky to have had many contacts within the music and education field with first hand personal knowledge of Crane both for Ed and Performance. I have heard nothing to support the idea that Crane is not as attentive to the Music Ed students but I have heard the exact opposite. It is another one of those things depend on who says it and why.</p>