My daughter does not want to pay back her college loans

Parents Forum
21

<p>She needs to pay the piper. Certainly she knew that loans mean payback and that her employment opportunities would be limited with a bachelors degree in anthropology. And if she didn't completely get it at 18, she had four long years for reality to dawn on her. I don't know how disabled she is by her medical condition, but if she was well enough to live away from home and go to college, she is probably well enough to hold a job. Do not let her now lean on the "patient role" to get out of working (I have a family member who did that, which started out badly and only got worse over the years.) </p>

<p>I'm wondering why you are uncertain of her job hunting status. I think you have a right to know how hard she is looking, and for what kind of jobs she is applying. Actually, you might even be able to offer some helpful guidance in this area. Another idea is to use any job placement services that were available at her school. </p>

<p>If you cannot force your daughter to get a job (although I would say get a job or get out), you could at least barter for household help. She should not be allowed to sit around doing nothing. If she continued to live in my house, my list for her would immediately include all grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning, family laundry and yardwork. I bet she will soon go out and find an easier job!</p>

<p>You are not still paying for her clothing, car, phone, recreation, etc, are you? Where does she get money for those things?</p>

22

<p>I haven't cosigned any private loans, but the ones I've seen seem to imply that after x amt of time (2-3 years) of on time payments, the cosigner can be removed. So at worst that is the time frame you may be looking at.</p>

<p>perkins and stafford are ENTIRELY in your daughter's name. I'd worry about the your credit rating before hers. If she is being selfish, so should you.</p>

23

<p>You need PROFESSIONAL HELP ASAP. You first need to receive counseling. Ideally, this needs to be the three of you, but at a minimum it needs to include you and your husband. You need to learn how to gain control back in your relationship with your D, and it will only get worse if you do not call today. There will need to be a little tough love, and there will be tears. But unless you want to be asking for help on this or a similar board in 20 years, asking about how to get your very adult D to get a job and move out, you must go ASAP. It will be such a relief to begin the process, and everyone will benefit. </p>

<p>My H and I began this task with one of our D's, when we felt like we had lost control, and we all are happier, even D.</p>

<p>THen, you need professional finanacial counseling on how to deal with the financial aspects of the situation. I do think that your D needs to feel the real consequences of not paying back the loans. And it may hard, but I would think the "healthiest"approach is to NOT be too quick to begin writing out the check. You cannot protect her and support her forever. You may be wise to let the process go on until you "have" to pay, and let the credit consequences affect her personally first. It is NOT a bad thing for her credit to take a hit. That will protect you from her running up credit card bills for which you might then feel obligated to pay. Things could still spiral out of control. </p>

<p>There will still be lots of tears, but she can still learn responsibility, and you can learn how to say no.</p>

<p>Internet posting does not allow me to show my emotions, and this is not a HARSH post. This is a "I feel deeply for you and I want to offer my advice" kinda post. I wish I could hug you. But I can't. But I can tell you that you need help, as does she. So call and make some appointments.</p>

24

<p>The OP posts about the practical situations she is dealing with. I think these are tough enough to deal with, but I think the more difficult thing is likely the disappointment one would have to feel in this sort of situation.</p>

<p>My eldest had a very non productive 2nd semester this year. Nothing horrible happened but he completely underworked and he still didn't have time to take internship-advancing steps. I felt disappointed in him. We work very hard so that he doesn't have to take loans, etc...But now I wonder if- unless a family is truly wealthy- all kids should have to contribute something (he does and always has earn money for everything that is 'optional'). I told him that had I known he was going to 'take it easy' I would have had him do it on the merit-dimes he was offered, and not with us paying 100% as is the case. </p>

<p>As for the OP...when I finished college I had heaps of loans and was accumulating more every day for med school-- I asked and they were willing to defer the loan repayment for 18 months. This is not a solution, but it is a holding pattern that might be feasible (if clearly perpetuating the issue).</p>

25

<p>I'm going to be a devil's advocate here and suggest that the D may be in need of counseling more than the parents. Some people freeze with panic when faced with situations like this. If she went to a top LAC, then many of her friends are likely off on a great adventure by now-- fellowships, grad school, a consulting job that pays 60K a year. She is home with mom and dad. That may be because she has been frozen by anxiety the whole year because she doesn't know what "the next step" is. This is the first time in her life when she isn't going back to school in the fall-- she has to decide for herself what to do, and it's scary. I agree fully that a few months working a menial job wouldn't hurt her, nor damage her long term career prospects, but she may be the kind of person who would feel like she "failed" by taking a job at Walmart or whatever. A 22-year-old does not have the long view of things, necessarily. The "going ballistic" may just be the result of terror about the future.</p>

<p>But I agree she should get a job, any job. She may just need someone to help her understand that it's ok to not know exactly where you're going, and it's ok to get a menial job for awhile.</p>

<p>Another note: Starbucks provides health insurance for its employees.</p>

26

<p>I agree with Weenie. I say this as the mom of a 23-year-old son, a really bright guy who had been proudly and responsibly employed since age 16 (responsible for buying his clothes, entertainment expenses, etc.). However, after he dropped out of college, and had a 6-month job not extended, he moved in with my SIL who allowed him to stay in her very nice condominum for free while not working, something my H and I would not have allowed because we feel that unless adult offspring are in college fulltime, they need to be paying rent even if living at home. Unless they do that, they get a very unrealistic idea about how to manage their money.</p>

<p>Anyway, my son then decided that he didn't need steady work, but could devote himself to his punk rock "career," which earned him about $40 a week. It wasn't until SIL retired and moved away and S had to live on his meager earnings that he found a fulltime regular business job, one that he has now kept for close to a year. He is now proudly supporting himself again.</p>

<p>Anyway, yes, you need to pay for the loan since you co-signed, and out of concern for your D's health, you need to pay for health insurance (something that we did for S until he finally got coverage on his job).</p>

<p>However, you need to tell her that she needs to get fulltime employment -- even if that means working 2 parttime fast food jobs if that's all she can find -- before you finish packing her things.</p>

<p>You also need to tell her that she will need to repay you for anything that you paid on her loan. Spell out to her that she can not duck out of obligations. Her owing that money means that she may have to delay buying a house, a car, etc. so she can pay back her obligations.</p>

<p>I am writing also as a person who did take out loans to go to an Ivy, my dream school. I never missed a payment even though sometimes I was repaying that loan out of my unemployment check. I also did things like work temporary clerical jobs to help make my payments.</p>

<p>I feel very fortunate to have been able to go to the school of my dreams. The least that I could do was to pay back the loan as I had promised to do. I also have been very involved in alum affairs in order to give back even more to my alma mater.</p>

<p>And there was one really nice guy who had wanted to marry me. One reason that I said "no" was that he was living a comfortable lifestyle while defaulting on his student loans. I believe that those loans help students attain the education of their dreams, and it's imperative that those loan earners have the integrity to pay back those loans as they had promised when they signed on the line.</p>

<p>I agree that the D may also need counseling. However, she can get counseling while also holding at least a parttime job. There are plenty of depressed people who work. Indeed, I was one of them. The fact that the D made it through college also indicates to me that she has the ability to work a job. If the D refuses counseling, the parents need to go to figure out how best to cope with the situation. They seem to have been enabling the D in not being responsible.</p>

27

<p>Can she even get a job that will pay $1,000 a month? I don't think Walmart would pay that much even at 40 hours a week (I could be wrong)? (Someone suggested Walmart)</p>

28

<p>
[quote]
I also would never cosign anything (credit card app, car loan, or birthday card) for somelike like your d.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Birthday card? LOL. Sorry, but just thought that was hilarious!</p>

29

<p>She may have to work one fulltime and one parttime job. That's what people do when they have debts to pay off.</p>

<p>If she still can't pay $1,000 a month despite living at home, she may be able to negotiate with her lender or ask her parents to pay the difference now, with her repaying them later.</p>

30

<p>She could even just go through a temp agency. If she graduated from a top LAC, professional offices would love her. My recent grad has worked in law, engineering, and other offices through a temp agency. $15/hr allowed him to work a second, low paying dream job.</p>

<p>Dressing nicely, getting out of the house, and coming home with a paycheck might be a step in the right direction.</p>

31

<p>I'm guessing now that the medical issue is depression? Or no?</p>

32

<p>Substitute teaching doesn't offer health insurance, but does pay fairly well and might enthuse her more than some of the other suggestions, which can seem depressing to someone already feeling helpless or overwhelmed or incompetent.</p>

33

<p>Getting a job, any job, would help her feel competent.</p>

<p>When I was working temporary clerical jobs with my Harvard degree, some of my coworkers were people like Ivy grads who were awaiting taking their bar exams. One such person was a Smith grad with loans to pay back.</p>

<p>A Harvard grad friend of mine who's now a surgeon worked for a while after college in a photo shop developing pictures. </p>

<p>Someone else in my Harvard class worked the year after college cleaning houses, and included that info on our first class report.</p>

<p>Virtually no one -- including Ivy grads -- walks into their dream job right after graduation. Particularly for people who have loans to pay back, you accept whatever legal job you can find that will help you get some experience and repay your obligation.</p>

<p>Sitting at home feeling sorry for yourself or waiting for a dream job to fall from the sky is what will make someone feel depressed and incompetent.</p>

34

<p>Not that anything can be done about it now, but what did she do every summer while she was in college? Did she have summer jobs then, or paying internships? Assuming she did, she could try to rekindle those contacts. (If she didn't, well... water under the bridge. Did she do anything during the summers that she could turn into a job opportunity she's interested in?)</p>

<p>She needs a job, immediately. The best thing that ever happened to my younger son's self-confidence was the job he got at the frozen yogurt shop. Totally not a career job, and minimum wage, but the people and organizational skills he got from that experience, and the recognition of his competence and abilities, have spilled over into all parts of his life. The money he earned was not unimportant, but it was more the icing on the cake, in some important ways.</p>

<p>Are you feeding her now? Are you giving her spending money? Are you letting her use your car, paying for her gas, paying for her auto insurance, paying for her cable TV/Internet usage/cellphone....? She is old enough to be required to pay for these things herself. If you have not set that standard in your household, now would be the time to swallow hard and stick that stake in the ground. Stop enabling her to take advantage of your kindness and love.</p>

<p>Have a family meeting. Set a realistic timeline for her to get a job while living at home or find somewhere else to live, and offer your support and help during her job search. But let her know once and for all that she is a young adult now and needs to start acting the part. And then be prepared to act at the end of that time if she hasn't met her responsibilities.</p>

<p>And good luck.... clearly we all feel for you, and hope that things will turn out well.</p>

35

<p>
[quote]
Sitting at home feeling sorry for yourself or waiting for a dream job to fall from the sky is what will make someone feel depressed and incompetent.

[/quote]
Oh, I completely agree (and have worked such jobs myself when in waiting for that dream job)! I suggested substitute teaching because some young people may feel that their degree is supposed to pay off right away, and it's easier to see that it does in substitute teaching than in the burger flipping biz. As well, subbing may light a fire under a previously undecided kid who finds he/she enjoys the challenges and rewards of teaching.</p>

36

<p>It can be hard to say not to a kid you love, even when that kid is officially a grownup, but my initial thought for the OP would be at this point to avoid doing anything (further) to jeopardize your own credit rating.</p>

<p>Less charitably, my second thought is that it is too bad that the "top ten LAC" education didn't also create some residual sense of responsibility and striving, but the OP's daughter is hardly unique in that respoect I fear. There seem to be a lot of 20-somethings still trying to figure out what to do when they are finally ready to admit they are grown up.</p>

<p>One thing I would add though is that if the young woman in question is sufficiently unconcerned about the ethics of repayinbg a loan to want to ignore its existence and if she has sufficient medical and/or mental health issues to warrant her parents having had to provide such a solid emotional buffer for her all these years, why sugggest she be a teacher? Subbing (as one poster suggeted) or otherwise, teaching ought to be viewed as an honorable profession that requires ethics and character as well as intelligence. Maybe it would be a nice sourc or money for the OP's daughter, but why expose children to an unproven teacher with questionable values. She may well much to offer but until she grows up or "recovers," I don't think she's the kind of role model our educational system ought to be promoting. There are enough promise breakers in public and private life--there is no need for them in a classroom.</p>

37

<p>If there ever was a time for parental guilt, you need to do it NOW. Guilt her about her younger siblings. Does she not want them to get an education? Aren't THEY entitled to go to the school of THEIR dreams? etc. etc. Have that family meeting, let the siblings know what's going on, what's at stake, and have them take part in your daughter's intervention. Let them plead their case, just as you would yours.</p>

<p>Give her a list of things to do around the house. Get her to clean the house, run errands, and so on. Everyone in the household should be working -- the siblings go to school and the parents go to work. Next time she talks about getting her own apartment, tell her to go ahead and find out just how hard it is to get things done without a parent to cosign for you forever. Get her a psychologist. Hire one of those career assessment agencies that will find work for her. She simply has to tell them about her work history/skills and show up for interviews.</p>

<p>I don't mean to sound as if I'm giving orders. I'm just trying to show you ways how to be proactive in this situation.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

38

<p>"Less charitably, my second thought is that it is too bad that the "top ten LAC" education didn't also create some residual sense of responsibility and striving"</p>

<p>I don't see that as the responsibility of the university. I see that as initially the responsibility of parents and ultimately the responsibility of the person themselves.</p>

<p>Presumably, the student demonstrated a lot of responsibility and striving to get into a top 10 university. Unfortunately, many students think that just because they worked hard enough to get into a top university and to graduate from one, they are owed access to their dream job and a cushy lifestyle. They don't realize that they won't start at the top, even with, for instance, an Ivy degree. Unfortunately, some parents also encourage this kind of thinking.</p>

39

<p>don't all student loan applications require a co-signer? Surely I can't be the only parent in this situation.</p>

<p>My daughter only took subsidized Stafford and Perkins loans- no co signer-</p>

<p>Additionally before college she volunteered for a year with Americorps who pay a living stipend and volunteers receive a voucher at the end of their committment that is to be used for tuition/loans
( actually that might not be a bad idea- you don't need a degree, she could have a stipend to live elsewhere- as well as helping the community it teaches volunteers responsibilty and effectiveness & it would defer her loans as well as giving her money toward them)</p>

40

<p>what do you do when she goes "ballistic" do you back off when she has her tantrum?</p>

<p>how does she eat? what about clothes, laundry, etc....</p>

<p>and her health issues, she needs to start owning that side of herself- she seems to have used that as an excuse to get away with bad behavior, poor choices, etc</p>

<p>yes, people get sick, but many don't use that as a crutch for not taking care of themselves or their responsibilites</p>

<p>it doesn't matter if she gets a job that brings in 1000net a month, it is that she does SOMETHING</p>

<p>is there a suppport group for her ailment? even something online?</p>

<p>I would immeditately call the loan people and find out exactly what you are dealing with, find if there is a way to change payments to less a month</p>

<p>this going ballestic is not good</p>