My H.S. Valedictorian Was Deferred From.....

[QuantMech]

<p>Intro “real” physics at Harvard was hard 40 years ago, from what I hear, and I’d imagine it’s still hard.</p>

<p>Whether the summer physics course at the public land grant university is easier than the course with the same number during the academic year, I not sure, but it easily might be. The summer course will have a different enrollment, possibly including public school teachers, and it might not be taught by a regular member of the faculty.</p>

<p>Re summer courses elsewhere: Stanford has actively advised its Questbridge pre-meds to take organic chemistry elsewhere (Santa Clara) during the summer, to ensure an A.</p>

[oldfort]

<p>MIT is a public land grand university. Is that the school sewhappy is referring to?</p>

[MomofWildChild]

<p>Penn requires advance approval be obtained before a Penn student can be assured credit for summer courses taken at a different school. They can be picky. The local community college won’t work. Vanderbilt will. On the other hand, Miami Ohio lets the kids take courses anywhere, even online from a state school in the middle of nowhere. TCNJ is the same. My nephew graduated early from TCNJ and I swear half of his classes were from the local community college!</p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p>

@MiamiDAP

There is no such thing as premed physics

</p>

<p>At many schools, most pre-meds take “physics for biology majors” (many of whom are pre-meds, at least initially), which is generally considered less rigorous than “physics for physics, chemistry, and engineering majors”.</p>

[sewhappy]

<p>I think the easier physics was full, lol. Being such a “trickster” my son, the slacker, no doubt would have taken it!</p>

[texaspg]

<p>What if someone wants to retake the class in a summer program after getting a B at HYPS in order to get an A since med schools specifically look at your GPA from a core set of classes?</p>

[MiamiDAP]

<p>"Summer classes are NOT recommended for premed requirements, not even at your own school, let alone at other UG. </p>

<p>Hunh? People do it all the time"</p>

<p>-Not any more.</p>

[MiamiDAP]

<p>"What if someone wants to retake the class in a summer program after getting a B at HYPS in order to get an A since med schools specifically look at your GPA from a core set of classes? "</p>

<p>-your summer class will not erase your 'B". As I have mentioned, summer class is not a good option for Med. School required classes. You can take all other classes in a summer. However, no re-take will erase your previous grade.</p>

[texaspg]

<p>^ now that we have established it wont erase a B, what if it is well known that a specific class at Harvard like Organic chemistry (from what I have heard/read, this could be very true) is frequented by premeds who are all trying to oneup each other to make sure they get one of the few As awarded in that class and one kid decides it is easier to take it outside to get that A.</p>

<p>Let us assume the goal is to get into a medical school (can be ranked 125 or even unranked).</p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p>Well, there are 134 MD schools in the US and 26 DO schools in the US; getting in any MD school still requires a very high GPA and MCAT.</p>

[CrewDad]

<p>

"Summer classes are NOT recommended for premed requirements, not even at your own school, let alone at other UG. </p>

<p>Hunh? People do it all the time"</p>

<p>-Not any more.

</p>

<p>Sure they do, but it’s unwise. And if the student attends a top college, it’s ill-advised to take a much easier summer course at a lesser institution. I imagine a summer course at a land-grant school such as Cornell or M.I.T. would be an exception. ;)</p>

<p>

Medical schools in principle will accept summer science courses taken at any accredited institution in fulfillment of their requirements, and they will let you count the grades in those courses when you figure your “science GPA” for your applications. However, remember that the medical schools have to decide to accept not just the courses you have taken, but also you as an applicant. Although many Amherst students have been accepted to medical schools with summer courses on their records, in general we believe it does not help students’ chances. Remember that much of medical school training is science-based, and at most medical schools it comes in a more concentrated form than you will experience even while taking two lab courses simultaneously at Amherst. You must show medical schools that you can do a heavy load of science and do it well, and taking summer courses may raise questions in that area.

</p>

<p><a href=“https://www.amherst.edu/campuslife/careers/students/gradstudy/health/guide/part1/questions#summer[/url]”>https://www.amherst.edu/campuslife/careers/students/gradstudy/health/guide/part1/questions#summer&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

[JHS]

<p>I’m not certain I know anyone on a Med School admissions committee right now, but I know a bunch of med school faculty, and many (most) of them are deeply ambivalent about med school admissions and the admissions requirements. They view calculus, physics, and organic chemistry as largely irrelevant to anything doctors actually do involving patient care, and in some sense as artificial barriers and a form of hazing. They worry that they are admitting people who lack breadth and true commitment to service, and rewarding a bunch of negative qualities. Of course, they want people who are smart, careful, and prodigiously hardworking, but they really don’t give a hoot if the students they like cut corners to get their organic chemistry ticket punched.</p>

[CrewDad]

<p>

but they really don’t give a hoot if the students they like cut corners to get their organic chemistry ticket punched.

</p>

<p>Maybe not, but admissions committees do.</p>

<p>

They worry that they are admitting people who lack breadth and true commitment to service,

</p>

<p>I agree, as do my friends and relatives who are physicians and med school professors.</p>

<p>

For decades, the medical profession has debated whether pre-med courses and admission tests produce doctors who know their alkyl halides but lack the sense of mission and interpersonal skills to become well-rounded, caring, inquisitive healers.

</p>

<p>

Ms. Adler became one of the lucky few in one of the best kept secrets in the cutthroat world of medical school admissions, the Humanities and Medicine Program at the Mount Sinai medical school on the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

</p>

<p>

The program promises slots to about 35 undergraduates a year if they study humanities or social sciences instead of the traditional pre-medical school curriculum and maintain a 3.5 grade-point average.

The students apply in their sophomore or junior years in college and agree to major in humanities or social science, rather than the hard sciences. If they are admitted, they are required to take only basic biology and chemistry, at a level many students accomplish through Advanced Placement courses in high school.</p>

<p>They forgo organic chemistry, physics and calculus — though they get abbreviated organic chemistry and physics courses during a summer boot camp run by Mount Sinai. They are exempt from the MCAT. Instead, they are admitted into the program based on their high school SAT scores, two personal essays, their high school and early college grades and interviews.</p>

<p>The study found that, by some measures, the humanities students made more sensitive doctors: they were more than twice as likely to train as psychiatrists (14 percent compared with 5.6 percent of their classmates) and somewhat more likely — though less so than Dr. Kase had expected — to go into primary care fields, like pediatrics and obstetrics and gynecology (49 percent compared with 39 percent). Conversely, they avoid some fields, like surgical subspecialties and anesthesiology.

</p>

<p>[Getting</a> Into Med School Without Hard Sciences - NYTimes.com](<a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/30/nyregion/30medschools.html]Getting”>http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/30/nyregion/30medschools.html)</p>

[jc40]

<p>I realize bio, physics, Gen Chem, and Orgo shouldn’t be taken in the summer, but what about biochem? I don’t believe it’s required for most med schools but have heard it’s helpful.</p>

[GA2012MOM]

<p>Posted by JHS #384</p>

<p>

What may well be meant is that Amherst won’t provide an endorsement from its Health Professions Committee or other support for the application if the core science requirements weren’t taken at Amherst. I believe Amherst is a school that explicitly screens its medical school applicants, and achieves a high admission rate in part because weak candidates are strongly discouraged from applying, and it is clear to medical schools who has the college’s imprimatur and who doesn’t.

</p>

<p>Not true JHS. Amherst will not refuse to write a committee letter for any student wanting to apply to med school, but will write “with reservations” for a few. The following is taken from the Amherst Premedical Guide.</p>

<p>

By the way, the Amherst Health Professions Committee supports almost all applicants without reservations even if they are “less-qualified” by our definition. We take no account of MCAT scores in making recommendations, and we support even those whose grades give them little chance of acceptance, as long as we believe (1) they can do the work of medical school, which means getting grades at least in the “C” range in Amherst science courses; and (2) they have the integrity and maturity needed to be a physician. Only three of the applicants from 2000-2004 who applied through the Amherst Health Professions Committee didn’t meet these standards and so were recommended with reservations.

</p>

[CrewDad]

<p>GAMOM</p>

<p>JHU said “Amherst won’t provide an endorsement from its Health Professions Committee or other support for the application if the core science requirements weren’t taken at Amherst.” </p>

<p>JHU is partially correct. Amherst will not support a med school application if the student took a core science requirement at another institution.</p>

[GA2012MOM]

<p>CrewDad, I was referring to this part of the statement by JHS. Sorry for the confusion.</p>

<p>

I believe Amherst is a school that explicitly screens its medical school applicants, and achieves a high admission rate in part because weak candidates are strongly discouraged from applying, and it is clear to medical schools who has the college’s imprimatur and who doesn’t.

</p>

<p>I just wanted to clarify that Amherst doesn’t screen at all to boost their numbers, they will write a committee letter for any student applying assuming they did fulfill their premed requirements at AC or another school in the 5 college consortium.</p>

[CrewDad]

<p>

I just wanted to clarify that Amherst doesn’t screen at all to boost their numbers

</p>

<p>I’m thankful you did. I wish all schools did the same.</p>

[texaspg]

<p>UCB - MCAT is not a requirement in most combined programs.</p>

[CrewDad]

<p>

UCB - MCAT is not a requirement in most combined programs.

</p>

<p>Yes it is.

Applicants to the UCB-UCSF Joint Medical Program must meet all of the requirements of the UCSF School of Medicine and should apply through the regular admissions process.

</p>

<p>

The Medical College Admission Test, required of all applicants, must be taken within three years of the date you plan to enter medical school and, at the latest, by September of the preceding year. We will accept scores from 2009, 2010, and 2011 for applications submitted by October 15, 2011.

</p>

<p>[Getting</a> Started | How to Apply | Office of Admissions | UCSF School of Medicine](<a href=“http://medschool.ucsf.edu/admissions/apply/getting-started.aspx#mcat]Getting”>http://medschool.ucsf.edu/admissions/apply/getting-started.aspx#mcat)</p>