Not really.
Your score is sent to med schools and it’s supposed to be one and done, although you can take it once more a few months or a year later without penalty if your score isn’t good enough. But for best odds, you take it in early Spring when you’re sure you’re ready, in order to be able to participate in the earlier rounds of application.
However, unlike the SAT or ACT, you cannot take it twice junior year to see, again August senior year, once more if needed… and there’s just ONE test, not two you can try out to see which one would “fit” you best.
Also, the test is 7hours and 30mn so it’s not something you just take casually.
I know I shouldn’t get carried away, but it seems as if all my peers are so ahead of me information wise, so I want to try and learn more about how premedical reqs and colleges work in general.
At the moment I was planning to go to University of Miami for my 4 year and New York University for med school. Or, just New York University for 4 year and medschool. Would that be a good idea?
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Thank you! I am already doing this with AP Chem (Staying after school for help and learning for mastery) and I will continue to do so! Thank you so much for all the help!
I would be very, very wary of considering AP Chem = 1 year of college chemistry with labs = ready for Ochem. At most 4-year colleges, the material (depth, pace, way it’s taught) for Gen Chem +Lab can be different from AP Chem - professors aren’t HS teachers, college labs aren’t HS labs, the students aren’t the same either. Even students who took AP Chem and start in Gen Chem 1 can find the material difficult - especially at colleges that assume students in Gen Chem took AP Chem (or at colleges that have a special section of Gen Chem for students who too AP Chem in HS).
Starting with General Chem 2 Fall Freshman year is hard enough, starting with Ochem Fall freshman year is one of the fastest paths to no longer being premed. The fact a student could really doesn’t mean they should (and at many selective colleges, they couldn’t, because AP Chem wouldn’t grant enough credit. This really depends on the university).
You’re right, many, many physicians have majored in biology. However, major isn’t taken into account for the first cut and for the “human eyes” stage, it doesn’t help, especially when it’s chosen as a “default” major; biology is a very competitive major to get into; being a biology major doesn’t give any specific advantage for med school admissions (all an applicant needs is a record of excellence in the premed pre-req science courses) because the med school curriculum is so fast-paced that there’s no difference between majors; for the vast majority of bio majors who don’t get into med school, the current oversupply of bio majors on the job market means poor job prospects. It doesn’t mean one cannot find a career by majoring in biology but that odds aren’t good in relation to other science majors. This has become even more pronounced in the past few years. (There’s an official government publication with this information but don’t know the link off the top of my head).
Therefore, if OP is interested in Biochemistry and chemistry as well as math, these would be better choices than Biology.
Experts will chime in: @creekland, @WayOutWestMom
@spaceterrors : consider all the medical professions beside physician. All will require the same qualities (empathy, communication skills, time management, ability to work under pressure…) and will require similar classes but most will not require you to spend another 12 years in school. At this point, you may be saying “doctor” as short-hand for “medical professional”, and that’s ok. Use your time in the hospital wisely, talk with NPs, PAs, Occupational therapists, etc. Make sure you consider all the different medical professions, their role, the courses they entail, the salary, the hours, etc.
Thank you so much! I will make sure to do this, this year and next year when I am shadowing. Health Science 2 also goes into a lot more specifics with certain medical professions so I will be paying extra attention to that now as well.
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We will have to agree to disagree. I did Orgo as a frosh. Many of my med school classmates from a wide variety of different undergrad schools did it. Many did not. Many of my undergrad friends majored in Bio and did very very well in their non-Dr careers, and those who went to med school with a Bio degree found the non-clinical preparation outstanding. No one had to “get in” to the biology major at my school, other than pass the prerequisites which essentially everyone does at that school, nor would that be a concern for any of the undergraduate institutions my D21 researched.
Great schools! One step at a time and you’ll do fine.
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There is no “better” major as far as med school adcomms are concerned. They do NOT care what your major is, only that you’ve completed the pre-reqs. In my daughters’ med school classes, there were students with majors that included: forestry, Italian, theology, business, public health, music composition, communications, physics, BME, biochem, neuroscience, English Lit, plus just about anything else you can think of.
In terms of the most successful major for pre-meds (i.e. highest acceptance percentages)-- that would be humanities majors (48% acceptance rate), closely followed by math majors (47%). But there is significant selection bias involved–very few humanities (only 1738 applicants) or math (342) majors apply to med school.
Health science majors fare significantly worse than any group.
Oh, another quick question. Are you allowed to retake the MCAT several times like you can with the SAT and [ACT]
You can, but there are annual and lifetime limits on the number attempts. You’re allowed to take the exam no more than 3x in one year and 7x in a lifetime. However, some schools explicitly say in they won’t consider applicants with more than 3 MCAT attempts. Med schools very strongly prefer “one and done” applicants who have a strong score from a single sitting. (There’s evidence these students are more likely pass their medical boards.)
There is no super scoring for the MCAT.
Also medical schools will receive every score from every MCAT you’ve ever taken when you apply. Adcomms will see all your scores and once seen those older weaker scores can’t be unseen. (Meaning adcomms can use it a datapoint during admission consideration.) At many schools, the formal policy is to average all MCAT scores and use the average score as your “actual” MCAT score.
I agree with @MYOS1634 post graduation employment prospects for bio and bio subspecialties (microbiology, neuroscience, cellular bio, etc) are not terrific. Chemistry and biochem do somewhat better than bio, but still there are more grads than jobs and most jobs will be in industry (think petroleum, agriculture, chemical manufacturing, pharmaceuticals, etc) or education (teaching HS or MS).
You can improve post grad employment prospects for a biology degree by learning coding/programming skills, taking additional math classes (stats and probability in particular) and doing summer internships in industry during undergrad.
If you like sales and have great people skills, there is a lot of money to be made in pharmaceutical and medical device sales.
I agree that you need to be open to other healthcare professions. Medicine is a team sport–everybody on the team has a role to play whether they are a physician, a podiatrist, a therapist/technician, child life specialist or a social worker
Here’s terrific website that will help you Explore Health Careers
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So, by selection bias, you are saying that even though the acceptance rate for math majors is higher it is due to the lesser number of applicants? Also, would the numbers you provided be annual? I was thinking of majoring in math or a science major (bio [ though I wouldn’t do bio now after this information], chem or biochem). Besides from applying to med school, wouldn’t it look a bit funny to a hospital if you wanted to be a doctor but majored in math or do they not care about your major too much?
Hospitals do not care about your major, and I agree with the above that med schools do not either. Do what you love, and IF that is Biology, or Math (and stays that after your first year or so in college) then major in it! You will do best in undergrad if you major in what you enjoy. You do not have to decide that now. Please focus on high school and getting into college, and worry about medical school later. There are so many colleges that have successful medical school acceptance rates/health professions advising.
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It’s not super difficult to pick a college, but of course, one still needs to get admitted, so have back up plans. Make sure they’re affordable because you don’t want a lot of debt. Med school is super expensive.
It’s incredibly difficult to pick a med school since admission rates for all of them are super low. A quick google search shows me their acceptance rate is between 1 and 3% just looking at the search page.
Don’t get your heart set on “a” med school. If you’re like most people, you’ll be applying to many and praying for an acceptance.
Pick a major you like because you’re likely to do better in it. Many students pick something that can work toward their Plan B if they don’t make it into med school (roughly 57% don’t as of the latest stats).
Applicant/Acceptance GPA/MCAT data here:
https://www.aamc.org/media/6091/download?attachment
Get as good of a foundation as you can in high school, then work hard, get multiple hours of shadowing/volunteering, and be an “interesting” candidate during your college years.
Scroll through a couple of these to see what one med school looks for in successful candidates - then be someone your school can write about. (You can google more if you want to, but you’ll see it’s a template - they tend to look for the same thing year in and year out.)
You’re smart to be looking ahead and planning ahead. My son decided he wanted to be a doctor when he was 8 years old and never shifted off of it. Now he’s in his first year of residency loving it, even with the hours, Covid deniers, and other issues. If this is something you want, go in eyes wide open and prepare to work hard for many years. My son tells me it’s not work when you love what you’re doing. He loved his college and med school years.
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Selection bias means that because math and humanities majors have not coursework that overlaps with pre-med requirements, those math and humanities majors who do apply to medical school a make an proactive decision to do so and go out of their way to make sure they have all the necessary components for a very strong application.
Those numbers are from the most recent application cycle (2020-2021). You can see the numbers here: https://www.aamc.org/media/6061/download?attachment
No, a math major wouldn’t look funny at all…Both of my daughters had a math major and they are both now physicians. Not single individual ever commented on their choice of major. (Well, except for that one creep who was either very seriously sexist or very socially awkward who told D1 she was “way too pretty to have been a physics major” and that “if [his] physics teacher had been as pretty as she was, [he]'d have a lot paid more attention in class”.) Why would an adcomm member look askance at math major applying to med school? How would that be any different than a Spanish major, or a dance major or computer science major who applies to med school?
And remember the adcomm member interviewing you may have earned a degree in electrical engineering or music or history before they went to med school–you just don’t know.
Adcomms really do not care at all what your major is. They are just looking for smart people who have demonstrated they can be academically successful at very high level and who have the personal qualities that make a good physician.
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I think NYU’s med program is free of tuition to people who do well in college.
Also for this, I really like math, but I can’t really see myself pursuing a career in it, but I can see myself pursuing a career in chemistry as it is something I find very interesting. I feel like I could do well in both majors. So would either be a good pick then?
Also, what could I do to make myself look interesting in college?
Thank you so much for the resource as well I read over it and am going to try to start doing some of the kinds of volunteering listed there.
Thank you so much for helping me out, I will be sure to focus on high school for the moment.
The only reason I thought it might like funny is because I still don’t know much about colleges and when I was little I was always taught that you major in something that corresponds to your job.
Thank you so much for all the help, I have really learned a lot from this. I will make sure to put the knowledge to good use and do more research.
If we assume a 2% acceptance rate at NYU, the following shows an example of total applications to acceptances. (Find the As for acceptances - all the rest tried, but didn’t make it.)
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X A X
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
X A X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
X X X X X X X X X X
You have to be you. If you read through those and possibly google some others think about how you’d fit in. In the class of 2021, my guy was the juggler. He also had a double major, did dance, ASL, a Christian club (leaders of all at some point), paid research, volunteered, was an RA in dorms and had the requisite good grades + MCAT score (highest possible category on AAMC’s data sheet). We wondered if he ever slept TBH.
You have to be good at school plus busy with medical and non-medical things (an interesting person) and do it all well. It shows you’re likely to be able to handle the physical, academic, and mental demands of med school and a career as a physician.
It’s definitely not impossible, but it’s a good work commitment.
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NYU also has a 2% acceptance rate and the highest average GPA/MCAT in the country. (3.9 GPA and 522 MCAT–which is a score above the 98th percentile)
Beside NYU is only tuition-free. Students are still on the hook for the $30+K it costs to live in Manhattan.
I really like math, but I can’t really see myself pursuing a career in it, but I can see myself pursuing a career in chemistry as it is something I find very interesting. I feel like I could do well in both majors. So would either be a good pick then?
I’m biased–my DH was a research physicist (which involves tons of math), both my daughters were math majors and my SIL is a theoretical mathematician/physicist. (My sister however is a chemist.) But math offers more, and more diverse, career pathways than chemistry.
But pick whichever you like better.
Also, what could I do to make myself look interesting in college?
Just be yourself. Follow your interests–whether it’s singing and dancing in the chorus line in a musical, entering baking competitions, playing Quidditch, solo hiking the John Muir Trail, being rush chair for your fraternity/sorority, or winning your expert title in chess.
Med schools are looking for well rounded, interesting people. Students need to pass “the lunch test”–which means the adcomm interviewers are thinking–would I mind having lunch every day with this person when they’re on my service?–when they interview you.
So, for right now your job is to finish high school, and be accepted into a college where you can do well and be happy.
There are over 4000 colleges and universities in the US. You can get into med school from just about any of them. (Just like med school adcomms don’t care about your major, they really don’t place much weight on where you go to college either.)
Good luck on your journey.
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Pretty sure you meant 522 MCAT if you want to edit…
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Thanks!
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