Need some advice from financial aid gurus or officers.

Paying for College
1

<p>Here is my story and my predicament:</p>

<p>I am 34 years old, and married and have a 8 month old son. Back when I graduated HS, in 1994, I wasn't a serious student, I went to school just because that was what was expected. I paid for, or my single mother, paid for my college education at a local community college, I didn't use grants or loans.</p>

<p>During this time, I dropped several classes due to lack of interest, laziness, and other factors. So my completion rate was crap, about 60%, but I didn't notice how bad it was or what it meant, since I was self-paying for the schooling.</p>

<p>Fast forward to 2001, my father died and I decide to get serious with school. I completed my AA at the community college and transfered to a local regional school, and decided to major in Criminal Justice/Paralegal studies, thinking I would go to law school. I graduated three years later Cum Laud with a great completion rate and GPA. </p>

<p>After graduation, and the economy crashing, seeing that going to law school would not be a good idea with so many people going to law school because of the economy, and finding out that finding a paralegal job in my city is almost impossible without already having experience, i've worked with several placement agencies, all of whom were impressed with my typing speed and paralegal knowledge, but none have been able to find me work, the legal market is just too small here. And no, moving isn't an option. I make 20k a year at the moment working in a hospital as an orderly, and have to live with family to survive.</p>

<p>I've spent the last several months taking aptitude tests and doing other soul searching, to come to the conclusion that with my innate ability with math and science, that I should have been an engineer. So a month or two ago I recently applied back to the community college I had attended before to take some hours that I need for the engineering degree that I can transfer to a local state college. However, after being readmitted, I found out that I was on financial aid supension. I never knew this, because I had always been self-pay.</p>

<p>I talked to an FA person at the front desk and they acted like "oh its not a big deal, just fill out an appeal form and say something like "I was immature before but i've grown up" He literally told me that was it. So I did that, of course I put a little more detail than that, and I also attached my transcripts from my CJ degree college. I filled out the fafsa before that too, and since I already had a BS degree, I wasn't eligible for pell, but I could take out loans, and that was exactly what I planned to do.</p>

<p>Well, the day before yesterday, I was told that my appeal was denied. To say the least, I am ****ed. I've never used financial aid, but the time I need it, I am told I have to pay out of pocket, and that after I complete 6 hours in a semester without dropping or without a grade below a C, I can re-appeal. Of course this doesn't mean anything, because the appeal can just be denied again. </p>

<p>The thing is, the cost of the classes at the Community College isn't that high, and I could probably cash-flow it, but barely, while working and going to school full time.</p>

<p>The true problem is once I transfer to the state school. My completion rate should be well over the % needed for FA, but after doing research lately, I have found out that I would be over the maximum attempted hours! And the tuition at the state school is about 3x more than the community college, and there is no way whatsoever I can self-pay for that.</p>

<p>Does the fact that I am going back to school to get a different BS degree matter at all? What options can any of you guys think of? Do they make exceptions for someone going for a second degree? Do they care about my situation, that fact that I started off foolish and immature and am now mature and seeking to better my life, as well as that of my son and wife? What if I don't drop any classes and I make great grades?</p>

<p>I am just about ready to go crazy. I have finally decided what path would be best for me, and have the desire, and drive, but I am having my legs cut out from under me. I can't afford this without loans. Am I screwed? Do I spend the rest of my life as a transporter because my college FA office says so? Can I transfer to another university and start from scratch with 0 credits? Can I "cancel" credits? Can I have the engineering school ignore my degree from the regional school, since NONE of the courses I took there would go towards my eng degree?</p>

<p>Need some serious advice.</p>

2

<p>If you already have an undergrad degree you are probably not eligible for financial aid. You are certainly not eligible for federal grant aid such as the Pell grant which is only for first degrees. </p>

<p>As far as loans are concerned there are caps for the amount of student loans. But even if you are under the cap you will probably have problems. Every school has to have a SAP (satisfactory academic progress) rules for students receiving financial aid. The SAP includes a minimum GPA, a successful completion of a certain % of all classes attempted at college, and a maximum amount of credit hours attempted. If you already have an undergrad degree you are almost certainly over the maximum hours allowed at a community college. It is pretty likely you are over or close to being over the maximum hours at a 4 year school. (at my daughters school FA eligibility expires once a student has 180 hours of classes including any dropped or failed classes).</p>

<p>As you already have a degree FA will be hard to come by. Some schools will not give aid, even loans, for a 2nd degree. If the school you are eventually hoping to attend does give aid for a 2nd degree it will probably be limited to loans.</p>

<p>

No, you cant reset with 0 credits or cancel credits. All classes you have taken at the college level are taken into account when determining eligibility for FA, including any withdrawals.</p>

3

<p>You are correct, I wouldn’t get grants, but I would be eligible for loans according to FAFSA. So are you saying unless I go to a new school and not submit my transcripts, than I am pretty much SOL as far as trying to change directions in life and become successful?</p>

<p>I love how I never used FA, but when I actually need it, I am denied it. I guess I know my choice now. Stay a slave, or break free.</p>

4

<p>Yes you are eligible for loans - my older D took them for her second bachelor’s degree. There are maximum limits, but it doesn’t sound like you are anywhere close.</p>

<p>What I would suggest in your case is to find another school to attend. I personally agree that you have earned a second chance, but if the original school isn’t allowing you to have it, perhaps another school is a better choice.</p>

<p>You might find that if you select a 4 year school that most of the credits (other than engineering coursework) will be fulfilled by the courses you have already taken. My older D, when pursuing her second Bachelor’s, had all of her required coursework and liberal arts fulfilled by her first degree.</p>

<p>Is there a four year state school that offers your major within commuting distance? That would be the route I would recommend. You would be applying as a transfer student.</p>

5

<p>Whether you used FA before or not is not taken into account. My son went to school and we paid for it out of pocket. He dropped out after a couple of years. When he returned he was initially denied aid because he did not meet SAP. The fact that he had never received aid before was not relevant.</p>

<p>The best thing is to talk to the school you are hoping to attend about whether they make exceptions to SAP for a student attempting a second degree in a different field. Some do. If they do you may be eligible for loans. Only the school can tell you what their policies are. The loan limits for an independent student are $9500 for a freshman, $10,500 for a sophomore, $12,500 for 3rd year and up, with an aggregate limit of $57,500. (as you already have a degree you would probably be at the 3rd year and above levels).</p>

<p>Talk to the school you are hoping to attend. Good luck.</p>

6

<p>How many undergraduate math and science credits do you have? If there is some faster way of meeting the entrance requirements for a Master’s program in engineering, then teaching assistantships and research assistantships become available outside of the normal FA process. There are a good number of undergraduate science majors entering graduate engineering programs this way, and they often do very well. No idea if this is practical for you, but it’s worthwhile talking to someone at your nearest graduate engineering school.</p>

<p>Also, consider practicing and taking a GRE test. If you do well, that may grab someone’s attention.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

7

<p>Talk to the financial aid counselors that told you that it would not be an issue. Since you did take course and show satisfactory academic progress after what you did, the evidence of that might need to be attached to your appeal. Have them make some phone calls and determine what the specific hang up is for you. As Swimmom says, it could be something to do with the rules of that specific school </p>

<p>My son did the same thing you did one term. He probably would not be eligible for any aid at that particular school without paying for a term or whatever the requirements are and doing well in a specific number of courses and self paying for them all. However, he had no problem getting aid at a whole different school without putting in any appeal. Like you he was independent when he returned, and in his case did get PELL and state monies as he did not yet have a undergrad degree.</p>

8

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<p>I don’t believe this is a CHOICE. EVERY college application I’ve seen clearly says that you MUST submit all transcripts from other colleges you have attended. You can’t “pretend” you didn’t go to college by not sending the transcripts.</p>

<p>Be honest.</p>

9

<p>The fact that the community college is putting you on FA probation will have no impact at the 4 year state school.</p>

<p>Just go directly to the state school and forget about the community college. You will be able to receive financial aid there as a transfer student. Or look into whydoicare’s suggestion of finding a master’s program (I hadn’t thought of that - it is an excellent suggestion).</p>

10

<p>A masters program is a good idea. BUT this student likely has TONS of prerequisite courses to take if he/she intends to major in engineering as a masters candidate. I will say that a student who does not meet the prerequisite requirements is not likely to be a a strong candidate for an assistantship.</p>

<p>However, there are some colleges that offer degree program in engineering as evening classes for students who are either trying to finish a degree or gain a degree…who are employed during the day. My husband took ALL of his lower level courses towards his engineering degree and finished his engineering degree doing evening classes at a four year school. He also did a co-op program so he worked IN engineering every other term.</p>

11

<p>Your CC has a pretty strict SAP policy. I would think that you will find more success in terms of securing aid (most likely just loans, but you already understand that) at another school.</p>

12

<p>A little update, and yes, you are correct kelsmon, they are being super strict with me. I went to my CC and talked to a FA person last week. They looked at my record and said they would waive the completion rate, and that I just needed to have an advisor give me a degree plan dealing with engineering, and fill out a form saying I was only taking classes to transfer to a 4-year college. He said it would be no problem, and that he would have it approved for me in a day or two, and that I should just pay for the class with a Credit Card and they would reimburse me. I was elated, so I went and paid for my classes, and bought my books.</p>

<p>Fast forward to monday, and I was checking online on my FA status, and there were no updates, so I called the CC to see what the status was. After checking my account and putting me on hold for about 5 minutes, the person came back and told me my appeal had been denied, and that they didn’t give a reason. I asked to talk to the person I had been dealing with, that told me it would be no problem, and of course he wasn’t there. I was ****ed to say the least, being jerked around and having door after door slammed in my face, with absolutely no reasons given, or things I could do to remedy my situation. So, with disgust, I dropped my classes and returned my books, and I am again wasting yet another semester I could be progressing towards a new career. I am livid, and am going to go to the campus tomorrow and talk to the person that told me it was no problem and see if I can find out what exactly went wrong, and what I can do.</p>

<p>At this point, I am ready to take your advice kelsmom, and give up on an engineering degree, and just go back to the university I got my bachelors in and get a masters in accounting. Maybe that truly is the best thing, as I called them yesterday and they told me I hadn’t maxed out on undergrad hours yet with them, and that I could take another 48 hours or so, and then when I switch to master’s level, it starts all over again. </p>

<p>I am so exhausted, and tired of trying to figure out what to do to better my life. I really like engineering, but there is only one school in town that offers the first 2 years of eng classes, and that is the CC. I would have to leave town, which would add about 8000 more dollars a year to my loans, which I can’t do at my age. I guess the Masters in accounting is the best thing, even though it is a regional school, and not one of the two big “brand name” state schools. I would at least be able to take the CPA exam afterwards. I only need about 9 hours of accounting classes to be eligible to enter the masters program, since I, thankfully, minored in business with my current BS degree.</p>

<p>p.s. anyone know if going to a regional school, which has a graduation rate of about 30% would be a bad idea, versus spending lots of time and gas driving an hour and a half to the state school, where the grad rate is 60%? Should I call some of the big accounting firms or email them and ask them if it matters, as long as I graduate and get my CPA?</p>

13

<p>The reason why your regional school has a graduation rate of 30% is because of all the students who party too much their first two years and drop/flunk out. If graduation rate were based on those students who are enrolled in third and fourth year classes, it would probably be significantly better. Don’t worry about this one.</p>

<p>As for employment prospects, make an appointment with the career center and with the accounting department at the university that you are likely to attend. They are the people who can give you the most up-to-date information on where their grads go.</p>