Nervous Junior - chances at t30s?

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

Hey folks! I’m in the college search process, and I’m really not sure where I stand when it comes to getting into selective schools. I’m definitely worried that my ECs aren’t strong enough. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Demographics

  • white, middle class, female

Academics

  • 4.0/4.3 GPA
  • my high school is only 3 years - at the end of senior year I will have taken 9 APs including World, APUSH, Macro, Lang, Lit, Physics, Stat, Envro, and US Gov, and honors/cc in anything that offered it
  • 34 ACT composite, hoping to get that up to a 35
  • considering majoring in polisci

ECs

  • marching band, pep band, and concert band(3 years)
  • speech and debate (2 years)
  • founded Model UN team (2 years)
  • Young Democrats (3 years) (elected president)
  • volunteer as a certified active listener on a mental health site, serve as a trainer for new listeners, completed internship (2 years)
  • NHS (1 year)
  • volunteer at Idaho Foodbank
  • volunteered on the Bernie campaign, served in advanced position
  • Youth in Government (2 years) (selected as state representative to CONA)
  • worked at Chick-fil-A (summer 2019)
  • intern at district court (summer 2020)
  • probably will do Georgetown Leadership Initiative internship this summer
  • will most likely serve as a page to the Idaho state senate January
  • will most likely join student council senior year

Awards/Achievements (that weren’t already listed)

  • handful of local debate tournament first places
  • published poetry in a state publication
  • superior rating at solo and ensemble fest

School List (I know it’s a lot)

Probably Reaches: Princeton, Dartmouth, Northwestern, Vandy, Duke, Chicago, Bowdoin, Colby, Amherst

Probably Target: Macalester, Carleton, Oxy, Wake Forest, UVA, Boston College

Probably Safety: Utah, Oregon

What are my chances? Is there anything I can do differently, or any suggestions I ought to consider when it comes to my application? And, finally, are there any other schools I may want to consider?

Thank you so much! :slight_smile:

2

If you’re willing to go to LA for Oxy, consider the Claremont Colleges as well.

Do you qualify for need-based aid or can you full pay for the no-merit-aid schools on your list?

If you’re applying to UVA, perhaps consider William & Mary too?

If considering UofO as a safety, maybe think about Willamette as another? It’s great for Poli Sci because of its location in the state capital and its connections with state government.

No interest in Women’s colleges? Smith and MoHo, in the same consortium with Amherst, could be good options, and Scripps in the 5C’s.

You’ve fit a lot into a short high school career - how many years of foreign language have you taken? Have you thought about an additional year of HS spent abroad through AFS or Rotary? You could become (more) fluent in your language, take additional advanced courses that aren’t offered at your home HS (i.e. AP/IB-level bio, chem, calc) and have a once-in-a-lifetime experience that could strengthen your college apps, both because of the experience and associated broadening/maturity, and because you could apply with all of your senior grades and AP tests finalized. (Of course you can also apply next year and then defer to do something like this.)

Just a though… but if you feel ready and eager to head straight to college, you’ve got solid qualifications!

3

Thanks so much for the advice!

I guess I should clarify that I will be graduating as a senior at 18; freshmen are technically high schoolers, but they go to the junior high here, so we didn’t quite get access to APs or the same extracurriculars as we did in 10th-12th. So, I think I’ll probably be ready to go right to college. (Unless a gap year would still be recommended?)

I will have taken 3 years of German by the time I graduate. Also, I do qualify for need-based aid, so the schools that meet 100% of demonstrated need would be really helpful for my family!

I’ll definitely take a look into those schools you mentioned! Much appreciated! :slight_smile:

4

Oh, I see - I thought you meant you were graduating/applying extra-young.

A gap year can still be a great thing to do, but totally a matter of preference in that case, vs. using it as a way to get another enriching year of high school and start college with your age-cohort.

Re: financial need, definitely run the Net Price Calculators that are available on each college’s financial aid website, or use MyIntuition (dot org), to see what your projected out-of-pocket would look like at each school. Even though your FAFSA EFC is a single number, different colleges will have different formulae so your projected aid can vary.

Depending on how much the full-need-met schools will cost for you, an OOS public like Uof O may or may not be an affordable safety. (You should get some merit there but you won’t get need-based aid, assuming your EC’s mean you’re an Idaho resident.) Utah is more affordable than UO, because you can either pay the WUE discounted rate or take the path to residency and pay in-state rates after the first year.

Try running the NPC’s at Denison and St. Olaf - these could be near-safeties for you but still meet full need. Denison is particularly good for Poli Sci (Check out their PPE major- philosophy, politics & econ - one of several programs in the US modeled after the Oxford PPE program. They also have a strong DC internship program, and a major where you can combine poli sci with data analytics.) And St. Olaf - in the same town as Carleton - is strong academically but also a phenomenal place for student musicians who want to participate in music as non-majors.

Speaking of Carleton, it’s competitive enough to fall into the reach-for-everyone category (it’s important to show interest, as highly-qualified students who don’t seem specifically interested and show “fit” often get waitlisted). Wake would be a match if you apply ED, but more of a reach-for-everyone in the regular cycle. BC is a little reachy to consider a pure match, too. (Maybe also look at Holy Cross, its Jesuit peer in nearby Worcester, which also meets need, as a safety. On the higher-reach end of the Jesuit spectrum… you’re not considering Georgetown?)

And speaking of early decision, Claremont McKenna (in the 5C’s consortium) is another full-need-met school that heavily favors early decision applicants, accepting more than 30% ED but only around 6% of RD applicants. Government is CMC’s most popular major (and the only department whose classes are closed to students from other schools in the Consortium) and they have a popular PPE program as well. Other 5C schools (Pomona, Scripps, Pitzer) are also great for poli sci even without access to the CMC Gov classes, and many of the 7000 students on the combined Consortium campus(es) are involved in political EC’s and causes.

The women’s colleges, as I mentioned, are a great way to add full-need-met matches. Schools like Scripps, Smith, and Mount Holyoke are competitive admits, but less so than if they were coed, simply because the applicant pool is limited to women. (Also Barnard and Bryn Mawr, although you haven’t expressed interest in other NYC or Philly-area schools… and Wellesley, which is the reachiest of the bunch but a terrific Boston-area school for poli sci.)

Are you thinking about continuing marching band in college? Northwestern and Vandy are the ones on your list that have this, and USC is another to consider which is great for marching band and for non-major music in general. U of Miami is another good private U that has a conservatory and a marching band - they’re not full-need-met but they’re often pretty generous - so that’s another potential safety if the NPC looks good.

5

First, before you do anything else, check to see if those schools are REALLY affordable. Chances are, if you show your parents that list, they’d probably have a panic attack. Unless you’re dad is Michael Bloomberg, the private schools are out of most people’s price range without financial aid to make it affordable. They should ALL be in the reach category. It’s the same with out of state schools.

The main focus should be your matches and safeties. Those should be unquestionably affordable BEFORE applying. Worse than getting rejected, is a big list of acceptances to schools you can’t afford. I’m not sure what state you’re in, but your state flagship is a good start.

Also, rankings are a lousy way to find a school. They don’t provide anything useful except one person saying it’s “better” and publishing it in a magazine. Just because it’s US News doesn’t make it any less stupid. Do some research based on your interests and your budget. You’ll find later that your $250,000 prestigious school name is really not much more useful than a narcissistic conversation starter at dinner parties.

6

Don’t worry about increasing your 34-35 you are already in the top range for those schools and the extra effort is probably not worth the minimal impact. Richmond is a perhaps another similar school as is UNC chapel hill. A safety school may be SMU. If it’s available perhaps take the SAT subject test in German.

7

Are you from Idaho? That is a state that is not well represented in T20 colleges. So if you are, that will give you a geographic boost.

Your stats are fine, I wouldn’t bother retaking the ACT. Your best shot is to apply to a college that has binding ED. As long as you can afford it, it will be your best chance for admission. During the RD round the odds are much slimmer. Pick one of these and apply ED.

8

Yep, I am from Idaho! I hope you’re right about the geography.

I’ve heard that applying ED doesn’t really improve your odds; rather, more people from the ED rounds are athletes and legacy students. Will applying early be a pretty substantial boost even for a non-legacy, non-athlete student?

My hesitation about applying early is the senate page thing; though I’ve met with the state controller who’s told me he could help me out and get me in, I won’t know for sure until the program starts in January, so I wonder if waiting to have that on my resume would be more helpful.

9

You’re definitely right! My family has used the net price calculators, and thankfully, these schools have excellent aid that makes them affordable for us. I believe that I also forgot to mention that I do have University of Idaho as a backup. That, plus the scholarships at the surrounding state schools (and WUE at Utah, specifically), makes them affordable - I think I can say I’ve got a few true safeties. Thanks a bunch for your advice, though - cost is certainly an important factor.

10

The early advantage differs considerably by school. The benefit for EA schools is marginal, as you point out. But for binding ED schools, the admissions rate is much higher compared to RD rates. The smaller colleges with ED often are filled with athletic recruits, that is true. These apply to the NESCAC colleges like Williams and Amherst. But for others, ED is your best chance.

The recent Harvard lawsuit has been quite revealing. Even in the EA round at Harvard, the odds of admission are about 2x higher than in RD. The Arcidiacono report explains in much more detail.

Among your reach colleges, Dartmouth and Vandy looks like they might appreciate your Idaho hook. The others are less predictable (esp Princeton).

11

In the RD round, they tend to admit students where they need help filling out the class – in general they focus on low income, minority, first generation and others who couldn’t apply ED.

As a middle class, non-URM, getting into a T20 during RD is very very difficult, even for valedictorians.

12

Your ECs are stronger than my daughter’s and she got into a T20. She applied ED and we believe that made all the difference.

13

Do you have an idea on major or what you’re looking for in a college? Idaho will definitely help, however if you need compare FA packages, not sure ED would be good, unless you’re absolutely sure it’s your top choice.

"Among your reach colleges, Dartmouth and Vandy looks like they might appreciate your Idaho hook. The others are less predictable (esp Princeton). "

Princeton had 2 from Idaho in their most recent class, and they have been known not to take any from a state, so they’re ok saying 47 states, while some colleges always tout 50 states. Princeton also has SCEA so it’s not binding.

14

I think your list looks good. Keep in mind that top schools are super hard to get into and lots of kids with perfect stats get denied. Just work hard on your essays and really try to express who you are and why you think a school is a good fit for you. Don’t just make your essay a regurgitation of your “resume”. Then cross your fingers.

I agree that being from Idaho might give you a slight advantage.

15

A few more general admissions questions: Are SAT subject tests a good idea? I’m not sure how to take them, or if they’re still being offered right now. Also, how important are letters of rec? While I’ve got one teacher and a counselor that I’m pretty confident could write a strong letter, I’m not sure on the second teacher. I’m also considering having an outside letter of rec from a boss - do schools appreciate extra letters or would that just annoy them?

16

Strong Rec letters are essential for competitive admissions.
Try to figure out the 2nd teacher and send a request NOW.

In the current situation, many colleges may not require SAT subject tests, but if you have strong scores, then it will be definite plus.

Regarding the 3rd rec, from boss or mentor, it depends on the school. Some specifically state to send only 2, others are okay with 3rd one, if that demonstrates something you did outside of school that your teachers or counselor don’t know about.

If you and your family ran the NPC (not just FAFSA), and the cost is affordable, then you should try to send an ED app, assuming you would be happy to go there if accepted.

17

Your ACTs are fine. Most colleges won’t need SAT subject tests in addition. Well except for Georgetown and a few others. Are you interested in STEM? If so taking them might help. But with the COVID19 situation, I doubt most colleges will require them.

Don’t send in any extra letters. Follow the directions exactly. They hate having to read more than what is necessary. Also non-academic letters are rarely helpful.