I will attest to this in fact very odd the GC in the school pushes kids to Colorado schools and Louisiana schools. No clue on private schools , rigor of academic work etc. We have to do everything
In my experience, the objective of the GCs at the publics is to get the kids assigned to them into a college â no unaccepted kids. Before the days of Naviance, ours circulated a redacted list of students, with rank and GPA, and the schools at which they were accepted. I tried to explain that the information was far less helpful than where the kids were rejected, all to no avail (i.e., if the valedictorian is accepted at Boise State, that doesnât mean that you have to be the valedictorian to get accepted at Boise State. By contrast, if the valedictorian is rejected by Cornell, that actually could be informative). I actually think the list was intended to reduce parental expectations.
Itâs your kid that is going to college, not the GC. Keep a very long list of potential schools and an open mind. The right experience for your kid will emerge from it.
Itâd be great if the GC can help out as suggested. It can sometimes be tough to educate GCs about the realities of athletic recruiting though, so as mentioned above youâll need to filter the GCs advice through your own sense of whatâs possible in terms of admission. And of course your GC might have zero experience with how athletes do at a particular school. Thatâs why I think the college coaches can be helpful (although sometimes they have their own biases and blind spots).
Oh, I completely agree that GCs aren't any help with an ATHLETIC match! That's definitely outside their field of expertise. Your coaches are the best resource regarding athletics. (My previous post was about <em>academics</em>.)
@Determined27 , SInce your sonâs GC is unhelpful, is there somebody else at his school who understands his learning differences and knows the rigor of the coursework he has done in HS? I would think somebody at your schoolâs learning center/special ed department would be a good resource. Surely theyâve seen their previous seniors heading off to college and might be able to steer your son in the right direction. It could be a NESCAC school, or perhaps NEWMAC or LIberty LeagueâŠbut the school with the right academic support would be more important than a specific DIII conference.
Because your son isnât a typical learner, finding his specific academic fits seems to be of paramount importance. It would be heartbreaking for him to attend a school which has a fantastic football team but is unable to meet his academic needs. And if he loses his academic eligibility, then having a great team will no longer matter. That could just be devastating for your son.
Itâs sad to hear that other families here havenât had knowledgeable GCs to help guide them. My kids attend a public high school, and theyâve received some terrific advice from their GCs on public & private academic matches. My sonâs good friend has a learning difference and he was worried he would struggle in college. His GC told him about a terrific small private school that would provide him with the type of support he specifically needed. Heâs a senior there and about to graduate with honors!
Spoken to a few NESCAC schools and done extensive research. The concensus is that all of the schools have support programs , Tutors etc. So that is comforting I guess then next question comes will that be enough to handle the work load ?
@Determined27 â you and your son will need to answer that for yourselves.
When they say tutors, does that mean help sessions 2 or 3 times a week (which most in the class will attend in a challenging class) or do they mean 1 on 1 instruction in as many classes as you need. And how much will you need?
Itâs really hard for all of us who donât know your kid to answer that. You know best what support heâs needed for HS so the challenge will be to extrapolate.
I sense that in courses that have problem sets (math, science, economics, etc), most of the kids at my kidâs school take advantage of the additional resources that are made available to them because they need it.
It will also depend on what he wants to study and how effectively he can manage the courses he takes to minimize those which donât play to his strengths.
I really donât get this. Why would a student set himself up for a situation in which he knows in advance that he will need extra support and tutoring? Accommodations, I get (extra time on tests, being alone in a testing room, testing only in the morning, bringing snacks, taking breaks, etc.). But what is so important about attending a school in the NESCAC athletic conference (or any particular conference) IF that a student wouldâin addition to attending classes, studying and completing assignments, and team practices, games, and eventsâhave to be on academic support? Besides adding more appointments to his schedule, wonât that be stressful?
And my question isnât just about students with LDs, but any student who knows in advance that he/she will need academic support to succeed at a particular school. I have a friend whose son went to Yale. Heâs not really an academic superstar, but he had other talents that were attractive to Yale. He struggled a bit academically. And his choice of majors was more limited because there was no way he could keep up with the coursework and keep up with his peers in the science major that was his original choice. This student has no LDs.
At Williams - 3 hrs home work per class meeting. Seems like a lot and more than I did in collegeâŠ
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I think you should consider speaking with a private educational counselor who specializes in students with LDs. You can find lists of qualified consultants on IECA, HECA or NACAC sites.
It sounds like one of the challenges here is that the OPâs kid is highly desirable as a recruit. This makes it less likely that a coach will say "yeah, youâre going to struggle here in the classroom " (if that is the case - this kid sounds like heâs very disciplined and has done a good job of figuring out how to manage.)
Question things are ramping up for son he takes regular High School courses and gets all Aâs. The football Coaches are all interested in him and he is on third round of Coaches talking with him. They all have his unofficial academic transcripts. My question how much weight do they coaches carry in support with admissions. Being told he is a C Band candidate. But if admitted would he be able to do the work. I understand the NESCAC have support but that I am guessing are for kids who scored high , take AP classes etc are the ones getting this support. Conflicted if he would not be overwhelmed.
As Glinda the Good Witch told Dorothy, âitâs always best to start at the beginning.â First, what types of careers might interest him? Second, what college majors can prepare him for that work? Third, what colleges offering those majors might be an academic fit, or reasonable stretch? Fourth, within that universe of colleges where can football enhance the college experience for which you are going to pay between $0 and $300K.
You may have gone through all of those steps already. But if you have not, perhaps arrange for your son to complete a career assessment test (like the Myers-Briggs). It might be better to find out now if he is meant for a career in coaching, teaching, nursing, or business before you spend $300K on an amazing liberal arts education he does not need.
@Determined27, I assume that you understand what is meant by a C Band candidate. C Band is the lowest academic qualifications that a NESCAC school would consider for admission for an athletic recruit. What grades and scores constitute a C Band recruit is different for the different NESCAC schools. If you are coach supported at the C Band, your son is in the admissible range, but in all likelihood, he could not get into the school WITHOUT coach support.
The history of recruiting in the NESCAC is well documented. The easiest way of explaining it is through slots and tips, which are two ways that a coach can support the recruit with admissions office. Slots are limited admission places earmarked for athletic recruits. Typically, they are reserved for impact players whose academic credentials fall below the usual admitted applicant. There usually are two slots for every varsity team (although football has more). The second type of support is a tip. A tip is an athletic recruit whose academic credentials are very much in line with the rest of the applicants. The tip pushes the applicant over the line with admissions. It should be noted that some NESCAC schools donât use the terms âtips and slots.â They may use the term âathletic factor.â The concept is the same regardless of which term is used.
So, it is not at all accurate that coach support in the NESCAC is for high academic achievers. To the contrary, there are limited spots for lower academic achievers, provided they are pretty good athletes with a good shot to play all four years.
Coach support through admissions weighs quite heavily with the NESCACs. Remember, with the pre-read, itâs not like a coach is going to support a recruit without a fairly good idea whether or not he will be admitted. But your questions really need to be directed to the coach. Ask where your kid is on the list (i.e., no. 1 on the recruit list); how many recruits supported by the coach with similar academic backgrounds have been admitted and how many rejected by admissions; and whether the coach thinks your son will be admitted. Be sure to ask for a pre-read. Coach support usually requires applying early decision.
The high D3s do have a lot of academic support for students, but remember it is up to the individual student to seek out the support. Also, per NCAA D3 rules, the academic support is not just for athletes. It must be equally available for all students.
If your son wants to go NESCAC, and if he is admitted, why shouldnât he go? Sometimes when the bar is raised, kids fly higher.
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I understand your concern regarding the work load as he has not taken APs, which can be quite a bit more work and a good gage for NESCAC type students.
As others have stated, C-Band at one NESCAC is different than a C-Band at another. Schools such as the NESCAC do offer a lot of support and the football coaches tend to stay on top of it. Some coaches have a designated âmandatoryâ team study period for all freshmen, and others as well.
Without knowing your son, but thinking of my kids, my general take is that if he gets All As even though non AP, he will be fine at the lower-middle NESCAC. It will still be a lot of work to get good grades but that is true most everywhere. If it is the very top NESCAC, the work will be a challenge (I had that worry with one of my kids) but there will be a support system for him, so with a lot of hard work I am sure he will be fine.
I would focus more on if the school(s) (most NESCAC are very small schools and some are quite remote) are a good fit or not, and if your son is 100% sure he wants to go to that school. NESCAC offer a lot and can be attractive with the recruiting though some kids may prefer a larger school or a university experience.
If it is a good fit and he is 100% on board, then I would keep working towards getting support. I am not sure how many C-band students get in on their own but my guess is that at the top or most NESCACs itâs very few.
Appreciate the input. So far the ironic part is that the Coaches indicated that after looking at his transcript they put him in the C Band. If they have so many years experience coching in NESCACS you would think after looking at the transcript they would be able to immeditely know if canidates are going to be admitted. Why keep going in the recruiting process. So I am perplexed they keep this process moving forward sounds like they beleive that the preread will be fine or should I just be cautiously optimistic.
Always be cautious and keep several irons in the fire. But you are correct that most coaches know what they are doing. If they donât think your son is admissible they wouldnât be wasting their time or yours. If he is C band and they are talking to him he is probably an impact player. Coaches keep their jobs by winning. So if he can help them, they will help him.
My athlete is at an Ivy, not a NESCAC. Different terminology but he would be considered a C band recruit, both in athletic and academic ability. He was worried about the academics. And to be fair, his grades are not stellar, but he is doing fine. If he were pre-med, it would have been a bad choice, but for him Iâm not worried about his grades. He was below the 25% number, but the coaches and admissions thought he could do the work. They were correct.
Go through the pre-reads and see how everything goes. But I think most coaches already know 90%+ of the time how the pre-read will come back.
The advice is always to look at the school first, and that is great advice. Especially if he is looking at NESCACs there probably isnât a pro career ahead, so this is it. Absolutely use it to get into a great school. But also be mindful of the coach and team culture. Yes, coaches can change. But unless your son joins the military he will never have a boss who controls him as much as that coach will. So make sure the school and the program are both good fits.
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@Determined27, I may have been trying to convey too much information. C Band athletes are definitely admissible, but in all likelihood only WITH coach support. Usually C Band athletes do not have the academic stats to get in without the help of the coach. The athlete is given a slot (or whatever term you prefer) and, given a green light with the pre-read, almost always is admitted.
Listen to the coach. A coach wants his or her recruits to be admitted. A recruit wants to be admitted. Thus if you are high up on a coachâs list, the interests of coach and recruit are quite aligned. They wonât pursue a kid who wonât get in.
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I understand. But my question is that a Coach who has been around for a long time at the school must know how to read a transcript. The transcript was mentioned in phone call with son and shows no AP or Honors courses taken just regular classes taken. Having said that my theory is why pursue the recruit and why continue the process.
Cearly if he even takes a fall AP which is highly unlikely in his Senior year and that AP class or classes would not be reflective grade wise until Decmber. I am assuming that if C-band , pre read good they would probably ask for an early decision application.So these grades would not even be available for the application process. Why stipulate we will see what happens with pre read. ?
The information will not change and son is finishing the year with all Aâs so what could possibly change. In other words what they are seeing now is going to be the same as Pre read. So either are they still on the fence as to the recruit checking into options or is this a formality in the process. The process seems odd.
The reason why the coach, even an experienced one, is hedging on receiving the official pre-read is that the AO may not provide a positive pre-read. Even though the coach may have the ability to give a fully supported slot to a C Band athlete, a positive official pre-read is given by the AO, not the coach. A C Band athlete is likely to be at the greatest risk of not getting a positive pre-read. Also remember at this time, the coach is looking at more recruits than he has slots or tips because there is always shakeout from negative pre-reads and recruits deciding to go elsewhere. It is a stressful process for almost all recruits an their families. As advised above, you and your S need to keep all options open â again I would reiterate for D3 athletes, school and team fit are what should be driving your decisions.
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Yes, this is well put. It might help for athlete/parent to remind themselves that they are not at the decision-making stage quite yet, a d neither is the coach. So while itâs good to be doing the due diligence and thinking about contingencies, you probably wonât have all the clarity you want until later in the process.
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