<p>"I think "detests" would be a better word than "deters"..... "</p>
<p>I don't think they actually "Hate" the process kk. I think they're just going against it which is what "deters" mean</p>
<p>"I don't think they actually "Hate" the process kk. I think they're just going against it which is what "deters" mean"</p>
<p>-Hmm....Here is what you said: </p>
<p>"To the general public, abortions are considered blasphemous solely because its considered murder which socety deters (according to their GOD)!"</p>
<p>-You said that certain people think it "blasphemous" to have an abortion - surely they would thus "detest" the "blasphemous" act of aborting a pregnancy. If you think "deters" works better in your sentence, then so be it; it just sounds awkward to me.</p>
<p>
[quote]
If Asians feel so discriminated against then they should do what Black people did and protest against it. Go to your admissions office and tell them what you think don't keep quiet and then complain.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Well, TrackBabi, I’m glad to read that you are supportive of this type of action. Many parents here were incensed and flat-out livid when Jian Li filed his civil rights complaint against Princeton last year. A lot of these supposedly urbane and “sophisticated” parents pulled low blows on Li by attacking his nationality, his character, and his “motives.”</p>
<p>
[quote]
plus I'd say Asians benefit a lot in the college process. They are so many of them in schools which is a great thing. If it weren't for the civil rights movement, anyway, there wouldn't be any minorities in schools no matter how qualified you are.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Well, there were asians in top US universities back in the 50s 60s and even before. It's not like they start going to college after the civil right movements.</p>
<p>and his “motives.”</p>
<p>-Well, I think it's pretty difficult to "prove" that a school is discriminating against an individual applicant - especially when the claim seems to be that said applicant just "should" have been admitted to the school. If anything it made Mr. Li seem haughty at best. Pretty much all an admissions officer would have to say is he "lacked X" and that could be seen as reason enough for not admitting him; and in fact, I think this is pretty much what happened. </p>
<p>I mean, the guy actually said: "I was actually hoping to be rejected by Princeton University so I could file a civil rights suit."</p>
<p>Lord knows he wasn't rejected because his ECs weren't what the committee wanted, or because his essay wasn't well-written, no, no, of course it was because of his ethnic background. That seems to me like a person over whom many people would - and probably even should - get incensed, but hey, legal protest is protest and I applaud his standing up for that in which he believes.</p>
<p>^yea the guy was obviously jealous of other people that got in. He and no one else knows what goes on in an admissions office so, he can't accuse them of any discrimination. Plus there are a lot of Asians in Princeton, they all got in so I don't think Princeton has anything against Asians.</p>
<p>But like I said before, if Asians want to protest, they should, but they better make sure that they have something to back up there statements other than a whiny, "I had a 2400 SAT, 3.98 GPA, and was president of the physics club. I deserve to go to Princeton. Not that black/Hispanic lowlife from the inner city who just has a 1800." If you get rejected from a school then that means that you do not fit in the admissions officers' mold, if you do get in then you do, by all means deserve to go. And don't let anyone tell you differently.</p>
<p>Mr. Li was obviously very egotistical.</p>
<p>now this is something to protest against. Asians are always made fun in the media and they are devalued in their ability to lead. But has anything(like the Imus incident) happened, even for that racist Juicy Fruit commercial? </p>
<p>ok I just read all of that. That is worse than the stuff the conservative paper at Cornell prints. And this the daily paper at Princeton. At my school all minority groups would protest.</p>
<p>sigh, start a new thread..</p>
<p>kk19131,</p>
<p>Li brought up a long simmering issue. On this subforum, questions like “Am I a URM?” or “Should I tell them my race?” are asked multiple times every year. It is not as if Li created an issue through his complaint. He simply brought it to the public’s attention.</p>
<p>TrackBabi17,</p>
<p>Li stated in an interview that he enjoyed being a student at Yale and was not jealous. Li cited Espenshade and Chung’s research to back up his claim. Last and most important, he never said anything like “Not that black/Hispanic lowlife from the inner city who just has a 1800.” That is a gross straw man.</p>
<p>...and you use the term straw man excessively. This is a public internet forum not a formal debate. Though it's nice to see you show off your terms and everything, it doesn't really affect people and what they choose to post. Obviously he had issues if he brought up the his Princeton rejection after he was already matriculating to Yale, calling the rejection unfair on the basis that "he deserved to get in". If he didn't get in then most likely he did not deserve to get in. I doubt that Princeton or any top college discriminates against Asians since they are the highest minority in higher education.</p>
<p>TrackBabi17,</p>
<p>I applaud your jujutsu skills. I criticized you for making a straw man, and you redirected my criticism by accusing me of us[ing] the term excessively and show[ing] off [my] terms and everything. Very nice.</p>
<p>Yes, I do use the term excessively. Why? Because I often see it employed by supporters of positive discrimination. They make up stuff and act like they dont have to back it up. </p>
<p>I hope your doesnt really affect people and what they choose to post is not your get-off-scot-free card for attributing falsehoods to Jian Li.</p>
<p>You know, back in the day, Jews were the highest minority in higher education. Its amazing how they were still able to dominate admissions despite having to answer questions like:</p>
<ol>
<li> Whats your religion?</li>
<li> Whats your mothers maiden name?</li>
<li> Have you changed your last name?</li>
</ol>
<p>Are you suggesting that Jews were not discriminated against in the old days simply because they were the highest minority in higher education?</p>
<p>trackbabi: "now this is something to protest against. Asians are always made fun in the media and they are devalued in their ability to lead. But has anything(like the Imus incident) happened, even for that racist Juicy Fruit commercial? "</p>
<p>Do any of you guys watch Comedy Central? I haven't looked at the link to the joke/commercial you are citing, but I believe that sometimes we all need to chill out on the protesting thing, sit back, and laugh a little. There are a lot of funny quirks to be found in every ethnic group, race, religion, gender, or whatever. Not to have access to that stuff for material is leaving behind a lot of good humor medicine for us all. </p>
<p>If you turn on Comedy Central, you will see some really outrageous no-holds-barred stuff that is beyond hilarious. And I think it is very healthy, because it blows the doors off all of the uptight, poised-to-pounce-at-any-slight, pessimistic attitude that is around a lot these days in every group. If you are going to go to the edge to try to make people laugh, you are probably going to offend some people. I think we need to expect that when we leave the house every day (or turn on the TV), there is no guarantee that we are not going to be offended. And there shouldn't be.</p>
<p>My litmus test is the intention. Laughter is the very best medicine of all, and we live in crazy, litigious times. There is too much litigating, and not enough chilling out. It is so very weird. It is impossible to tell where edginess will fly fine, and where someone will get destroyed by their joke. I see African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Italians, etc. making the NASTIEST jokes about their own race or ethnicity, and I get it, it's different when you are joking about your OWN race. And I see jokes made by people of one race or group about those of another (and sometimes everyone is OK with it, and other times people decide that it is OK to destroy the person who made the joke - and instead of joke you could insert other things like movies or commericals). But the world out there is very weird right now, and simply treacherous to negociate authentically. It's like the spirit of Big Brother left the government offices, and invaded the souls of the general public.</p>
<p>I am a pretty overweight person (I can hardly fit into my Spideygirl suit anymore). Everywhere I look I see discrimination against people who look like me. There was a movie that I saw recently where an African American male actor (can't remember his name) was dressed up like a fat old lady (that was pretty much the whole story). I think he was a cop. Practically the entire movie was pokng fun at obesity in a really painful way. And it crossed my mind - how would this guy feel, or the general public feel, about a movie which made fun of African Americans the way this movie is mocking obesity? What if a Caucasian male were to dress up as an African American and then poke fun, as the actor playing the fat woman was not fat (one of us). But I decided to be "whatever" about it. Because it really was pricelessly funny, slights aside. While I did feel pretty zinged, I just decided to focus on the guy's intention (which was to make me and everyone else laugh). Anyway, just thought I'd share from personal experience what it looks like to chill out. And I do think that the Asian student who felt slighted by adcoms who were trying to assemble an incoming class should have just chilled out as well.</p>
<p>Do you want to see a really outrageous example of edginess? Check out this link:</p>
<p><a href="http://youtube.com/watch?v=G2nTbqbtGug%5B/url%5D">http://youtube.com/watch?v=G2nTbqbtGug</a></p>
<p>I hate the N word. I hate that some African American comedians (on a recent Oprah show) think it is OK to use it among themselves. It freaks me out - like seeing swastikas. But this is a really funny video - to me. Because the kids are really blowing away so many assumptions about what is possible and what can be done, and it is really edgy. I don't think it has anything to do with making a horrible word more acceptable, but it does take a big stab at the tension which exists today. And that is why it is funny.</p>
<p>kk, yes I see what you mean with the context of the word. I geuss detest will be the better word.</p>
<p>Ok, taken from the article Trackbabi posted!</p>
<p>We cook greasy food, wash your clothes and let you copy our homework. Brown people are catching up, too but not before the 2008 Beijing Olympics. Plus, two Princeton professors showed that racial preferences for black people and Hispanics hurt admission opportunities for me. I mean, Asians in general. The Great Wall Street Journal support my case. What more you want?</p>
<p>^^^Extremely Pompous!! I have never heard such a jealous and arrogant statement in my life. Though Princeton does not offer transfers but why bother going through all of that?</p>
<p>"if he didn't get in then most likely he did not deserve to get in."</p>
<p>Trackbabi, yes, there are some people who did not get into elite colleges but no, it doesn't mean that they don't deserve to get in. Remember, its also about space limitations. There are hundreds of deserving kids who gets rejected from elite schools like our "Precious Princeton." But that doesn't mean that they didn't meet their standards or anything. It just means seats are scarce at the school.</p>
<p>"I am a pretty overweight person (I can hardly fit into my Spideygirl suit anymore)."</p>
<p>LMFAOOO.....sorry spidey but I had to laugh!</p>
<p>"I hate the N word. I hate that some African American comedians (on a recent Oprah show) think it is OK to use it among themselves."</p>
<p>Yah, its pretty sad that a word that was used to rebuke and belittle a group of people is now used amongst themselves. SMH</p>
<p>spidey, the movie you are referring to is "Big Momma's House" starring Martin Lawrence. There arre 2 of them. Big Momma's House 2 just came out last year, I think.</p>
<p>
Not that I'm condoning the use of the word, but I think the idea is that black people are reclaiming it, making it acceptable to say to each other. And although this is going to sound extremely silly, there really is a difference between the way black people say it to each other and the way other people say it as a racial slur.</p>
<p>"Not that I'm condoning the use of the word, but I think the idea is that black people are reclaiming it, making it acceptable to say to each other. And although this is going to sound extremely silly, there really is a difference between the way black people say it to each other and the way other people say it as a racial slur."</p>
<p>hotpiece, you can't possibly reclaim a word YOU NEVER owned. Blacks (if im not mistaken) never owned or started that word. It was started (if I'm not mistaken) by caucasians or slave owners that were in authority. Therefore, it will be extremely silly to keep the same word (that was used to belittle your people) into your daily base vocabulary. Thats why so many people condone it. Besides, you ever noticed how often the N word is used with a "A" at the end rather than the regular "ER" at the end</p>
<p>So Authentic, I qualified what I meant by "reclaim." Black people now use it in a positive way to each other, thus (in the user's mind) taking away it's original power.</p>
<p>Secondly, I already mentioned the difference in the pronunciation.</p>
<p>Oh ok, I see it! My eye missed that part. </p>
<p>hmmm.....not that I'm actually rebuking it myself (because people do have freedom of speech), but it does seem kind of awkward spinning that word positively</p>
<p>regarding the "n" word. Its not just the difference in pronunciation, its the context in which a black person or a white person would say it. Many people wonder "why is it ok when black people say the n word but not ok if i say it!?" and to find the answer you (as someone who isn't a black person) have to ask yourself, "what motive would i possibly have to say it?". Your either going to be using it as a slur, and insult, making fun of black people who say it, there is no positive reason for you to say it, so why would you want to?</p>
<p>But back to the point, (possible) discrimination against asians and AA are completely different issues. If you are going to argue discrimination of Asians in admissions, be aware that it is completely separate from AA.</p>
<p>"If he didn't get in then most likely he did not deserve to get in."</p>
<p>I have to disagree with that statement. Academically speaking, Jian Li was obviously imminently qualified. He would almost assuredly have excelled at Princeton. But the same is also true of thousands other academically gifted applicants who were not admitted (including some URMs). The fact that Jian Li was weight listed proves that his application received serious consideration. He did make it to the final round. But, because there were several thousand more applicants than there were seats available, the Adcom had to make choices. </p>
<p>The question is, what factors determined those choices? Heck, I don't know. What did Jian Li's Asian classmate (the only other applicant from his school to be admitted to Princeton that year) have over him AND all the white applicants and URM applicants from his school? Can anyone know other than the committee doing the choosing on that day? All we know is what colleges and universities commonly say they value in an applicant pool when crafting a class. And they do indeed look upon their job as one of "crafting" a class. There has never been a time when GPA and test scores were the only things that mattered. Never. Not even when the applicant pool was as white as the driven snow. The only time raw stats are the ONLY things that matter is when the opponents of AA are sputtering with righteous indignation. </p>
<p>American institutions of higher education have always had niches they were keen to fill. All the different academic departments desire applicants interested in majoring in their discipline. for instance. Too few anthropology majors mean that that department will eventually be unable to justify it's existence. Which of the Ivys do you think would be willing to scrap Anthropology, or East Asian Studies, or History because most of the applicants with the very highest raw stats only happen to be interested in business, or pre-med, or the hard sciences?</p>
<p>Schools have always had a vested interest in fielding all their various sports teams and clubs (especially those that bring in revenue). </p>
<p>They want students from various backgrounds, who they believe might enrich their communities with various viewpoints and perspectives. This means they want rich kids, poor kids, middle class kids, whites, blacks, Asians, kids from the east coast, west coast, fly-over country and foreign countries. They want kids who are passionate about politics and social justice, about scientific research, and the arts. They want free spirits and cerebral thinkers. They want the kid who is a computer programing genius who only lives for the stuff, and the kid who writes incredible plays or plays 9 different instruments, even though neither of those two is particularly strong in the higher maths.</p>
<p>Why is this rubric so hard to comprehend?</p>