<p>Hey guys! Look <a href="http://www.yale.edu/opa/v34.n8/story1.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.yale.edu/opa/v34.n8/story1.html</a></p>
<p>Impressive building. I hope this outdoes Harvard.</p>
<p>it'll take more than mere bricks and mortar for #44 yale to catch up with #31 harvard in undergraduate engineering.</p>
<p>2006</p>
<p>International comparisons Top 100 Engineering and IT Universities</p>
<p>Rank Name Country Normalised
score Citation impact
per paper
1 University of California, Berkeley US 200.00 6.23
2 Massachusetts Inst of Tech US 191.15 6.15
3 Stanford University US 150.71 6.85
4 Indian Institutes of Technology India 149.34 1.85
5 Imperial College London UK 137.87 4.14
6 California Institute of Technology US 123.99 7.01
7 Tokyo University Japan 121.46 2.84
8 Cambridge University UK 116.46 5.08
9 National University of Singapore Singapore 106.50 2.46
10 Beijing University China 102.42 2.16
11 Tokyo Institute of Technology Japan 95.28 2.35
12 Oxford University UK 85.37 5.36
13 Harvard University US 83.04 8.08
14 Carnegie Mellon University US 82.90 4.94
15 Tsing Hua University China 76.28 1.72
16 ETH Zurich Switzerland 74.44 6.06
17 Georgia Institute of Technology US 72.99 3.76
18 Monash University Australia 70.04 2.54
19 Ecole Polytechnique France 69.84 4.35
20 Hong Kong Uni of Sci and Tech Hong Kong 68.62 2.99
21 Illinois University US 67.62 5.01
22 Melbourne University Australia 65.75 4.41
23 Kyoto University Japan 64.16 2.97
24 Delft University of Technology Netherlands 63.24 3.76
25 Purdue University US 62.59 4.39
26 New South Wales University Australia 62.48 3.45
27 University of Texas at Austin US 60.83 4.13
28 Massachusetts University US 57.12 4.65
29 Technion - Israel Inst of Tech Israel 57.04 3.62
30 Cornell University US 56.60 6.04
31 Australian National University Australia 55.67 3.81
32 Universit</p>
<p>a ranking by citation impact? haven't your mercilessly attacked the yale troll for citing ISI, which ranks by citation impact?</p>
<p>It depends how its calculated. Both the Times and the Shanghai rankings consider citation impact in ranking grad academics. Note that in this ranking, unlike the TROLL's out-of-date and obscure list, Yale puffs across the finish line at #58!</p>
<p>Note also that the Times ranking includes, but is not entirely based on, citation impact. If it had been, the numbers seem to indicate that Harvard would have been #1, not #13!!!</p>
<p>It's really hard to argue that Harvard is in the top 20 in engineering, Byerly. Anyone who's been to UCB, MIT or Stanford will know where the serious programs are. </p>
<p>Relying on a random foreign ranking when the USNews you LOVE to cite doesn't make Harvard look good is a little much.</p>
<p>The Times has Harvard at 13, and USNews has it at 20 out of 198.</p>
<p>The Times rankings are hardly "random"; indeed, they are consulted closely by the international applicants who are among the strongest applicants. Although Harvard's School of Engineering is among the smallest, its academic rating is among the highest - with an average GRE score for matriculants of 783.</p>
<p>"The Times has Harvard at 13, and USNews has it at 20 out of 198."</p>
<p>disingenuous. u.s. news has it at 20 for graduate engineering, but 31 for undergraduate engineering - the latter being the level that concerns the vast majority of this board's readers.</p>
<p>Talk about "disingenuous"! Both Harvard and Yale have precious few undergrad engineering majors at the moment, since all must earn an A.B. or B.A. degree, as you well know. For almost no one at Harvard (or Yale, for that matter) is undergrad engineering a terminal degree.</p>
<p>The School of Engineering at Harvard is, however, near the top, academically, with more talented students than Princeton (as measured by GRE score), a lower acceptance rate, greater faculty membership in the National Academy of Engineering, and higher research expenditures per faculty member - all despite being half the size.</p>
<p>Even with the broader curriculum feasible with its larger size, the Princeton School of Engineering ranks barely above Harvard - 2 slots higher - in the USNews rankings, and, as I have pointed out, far lower in the international rankings.</p>
<p>again, you're using graduate rankings (GRE scores, etc). in the undergrad rankings, princeton ranks 12 and harvard 31. that's <em>19</em> slots higher. also, you're wrong about NAE membership. princeton's faculty includes 20 members, harvard's 14.</p>
<p>well, anyway, regardless of what the rankings are right now, yale is improving, a fact symbolized by the new building. they're pouring tons of money into engineering right now.</p>
<p>Fact of the matter is, no matter what arguments are presented, Harvard still trails far, far behind MIT, Stanford and Berkeley. </p>
<p>Stanford has 83 NAE members to Harvard's 14. </p>
<p>Hard to make an argument with that.</p>