<p>Poetgrl-- great post! I agree this is a variegated, nuanced issue (agreement also goes to those that have pointed out these nuances). Also have wondered about our relative lack of investment in Latino America in general, Mexico in particular as the closest neighbor to the south, in comparison to our investment elsewhere in the world. That said, I also feel very much for undocumented students. Thanks for the links to the scholarship sites. It will be interesting to see what the scope of their mission is in actuality. Take care all</p>
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<p>While sending kids to college helps college admins/faculty keep their jobs, I don’t see how paying for undocumented kids to go to US colleges will “deliver more” or much of anything to our economy, unless they will be attending colleges that are in need of more paying students in order to stay in business. Doing so is certainly charitable, but I don’t see how it can be referred to as an “investment” if the students cannot work here after they graduate. I suppose if they return to their countries of citizenship with an American college education, then perhaps it is an “investment” in the betterment of that country, that may result in less need for our foreign aid or something like that.</p>
<p>There are ways for educated people with skills in very high demand to get visas to stay, at least for a while. There is a whole industry getting people with these visas green cards so that they can eventually become naturalized. Plus if they go to college, there is a substantial chance that they will marry a citizen and get naturalized that way. Then they get a good job, pay lots of taxes, shop at the mall, buy homes, cars, contribute to the PTA, start a business and hire more people. </p>
<p>The people who these scholarships are intended for are top students in American schools who happen to be undocumented. They can be as ambitious as anyone on this board. </p>
<p>I do not want THESE kids to go back to their country of citizenship. They are a net plus to America, which is often the only home they have ever known. The alternative is a complete waste of a human resource.</p>
<p>^That all makes sense, but it is dependent upon a lot of “ifs.” (<em>If</em> they study the right subject, and <em>if</em> they are in high demand, and <em>if</em> they get a green card, and <em>if</em> they marry a citizen…). People can spend their own money any way they want, but if we are talking about benefitting America, the chances are greater that helping to pay a citizens’ college expenses will pay off more.</p>
<p>A few sample threads involving real people. </p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/475684-aid-undocumented-students.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/475684-aid-undocumented-students.html</a></p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1133236-need-advice-how-help-student.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1133236-need-advice-how-help-student.html</a></p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/586708-any-hope-undocumented-immigrant.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/586708-any-hope-undocumented-immigrant.html</a></p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/684719-please-help-i-dont-think-i-can-go-school-all-im-trying-find-way-out.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/684719-please-help-i-dont-think-i-can-go-school-all-im-trying-find-way-out.html</a></p>
<p>Bay, the only tax payer funding for these scholarships occurs because the organizations are 501c organizations, and donors get to take charitable deductions. In every other sense, they are privately funded.</p>
<p>I agree that investing in Americans will pay high returns too. They don’t face quite as hopeless of a situation though as the Dream Act kids.</p>
<p>There is nothing stopping these undocumented students to apply to U.S. universities as int’l applicants and jumping thru all the hoops that int’l applicants have to go thru.</p>
<p>@CRD: ^Yes, I understand that these are private funds. It is also happening in CA: [Tech</a> Titans Aid Undocumented Students - WSJ.com](<a href=“Tech Titans Aid Undocumented Students - WSJ”>Tech Titans Aid Undocumented Students - WSJ)</p>
<p>I can’t help feeling that there are plenty of outstanding US students in financial straits who could use the help these kids are getting, and they probably feel a bit surprised/hurt/confused by it.</p>
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Why, Bay? Do they feel entitled to my money for some reason? I only support a limited number of charities because I would rather give a little more to 3 or 4 groups than spread $5 and $10 contributions to 30 organizations. </p>
<p>The only medical cause I support financially is Doctors Without Borders. Are the American medical patients with cystic fibrosis, cancers, and tay-sachs surprised or hurt that I’m not giving them my meager contributions instead?</p>
<p>Every college we’ve investigated has scholarships set up by generous donors which are often very specific as to who qualifies to get them. Needy nursing student from Kalamazoo High School, aspiring business student from local Native American reservation, student with visual disabilities, etc. Are the rest of the students from Kalamazoo, the aspiring musicians from the reservation, and the hearing impaired hurt that they are not the ones getting those particular scholarships? </p>
<p>The US students in financial straits at least have a chance of getting the usual financial aid, and most other scholarships which they may be qualified for. These students don’t have as many other options.</p>
<p>It’s going to be interesting to see how this program will implement the awarding of these scholarships. Do the applicants have to, lol, DOCUMENT that are they are undocumented? Or can a U.S. citizen simply lie and declare that he/she is illegal to be eligible (i.e. can one lie about lying about their residency status?)</p>
<p>“The only medical cause I support financially is Doctors Without Borders.”</p>
<p>You mean the French?</p>
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They have organizations in 19 countries, including the US. In 2009, US contributions were some $134 million.</p>
<p>At the risk of interjecting facts into this thread, the international HQ for Doctors without Borders is in Geneva, Switzerland.</p>
<p>The very nature of this thread is insulting to me, as an undocumented student and as a common person. Who are any of you to wrongly judge an individual based off of a group? Some of y’all are using the excuse of taking the spot of somebody else at a college, but in reality, do you think that it matters in he end? Were they even qualified (specifically, more than I)? If I didn’t take that person’s spot, someone more qualified would have. If not them, somebody else would have. </p>
<p>These are the threads that embarrass me for being part of such a community. The hate is certainly easy to see, but the animosity that emanates from it is disgusting. Why can’t some of you, presumably “intelligent,” or at least in your eyes, see what others go through everyday pursuing what you take for granted? True, I wasn’t always motivated in school, for varying reasons, but I did stick it out and was always more capable and ready than a lot of my peers, even those who tried and were legal citizens. The mere thought of some of them going to college or even managing to graduate high school is embarrassing. The U.S. puts outs garbage for graduates at all levels, but more so at the high school level, because the system is broken and the students aren’t motivated enough. This may be more true in some parts, but it is true mostly everywhere. So to say that some of those students should get a chance to go to college over me is utterly laughable. I’m definitely not the smartest, as well as not a try-hard like most of the high standardized test scorers here, but I can hold my own (2000+ SAT, without the laughable hours some of the kids on here pour into studying). I believe I’ve rested my case and ended my tirade.</p>
<p>Also, my parents pay their taxes. We’re not piggybacking off of anybody. We don’t get the benefits U.S. citizens get, but we can manage. We know how to handle our money wisely and make up for those downsides. Oh, and one last thing. Saying that such scholarships are enticements is dumb and unfounded. You all must realize that there are usually several stringent requirements that must be met before the students can even qualify for the aid (on top of needing to be qualified). So do you really expect people to think about such things that far ahead? Please, get over yourselves. </p>
<p>*I’m on my phone and don’t have the time to check on grammar mistakes or whatever. Also, I will probably not come back to check on this seeing as the nature of this thread will probably stir some anger haha. So fire away and may you be enlightened, if only just a bit.</p>
<p>Sent from my Desire HD using CC</p>
<p>WHATDAMCFUDGE,</p>
<p>while you might qualify academically to go to US college, legally you do not. In the end, the number of spots at schools, jobs are limited. You and your parents do take someone else’s spot. </p>
<p>Let me put it in the example that might be easier to understand. If you had stats to attend one of the Ivy-league schools and got accepted as US resident, you would have had taken another academically qualified kid’s spot, because there are more qualified candidates than spots at those schools. Exactly the same principle applies to any kind of resource you and your parents are using in this country.</p>
<p>And nobody argues that you and your family don’t have it tough. But so do many other people around the world. Why do you and your family deserve the break more than ones who did not break the law?</p>
<p>Several posters here got it right when they said that instead of focusing our efforts to on those who are here illegally, we should focus our efforts on those who are still in their native country suffering, - by putting pressure on their corrupt government and supporting charities that build schools and provide other forms of aid to people living in those countries.</p>
<p>■■■–</p>
<p>yikes!</p>
<p>Entitled much?</p>
<p>“We are the brokest nation in the entire history of the world”</p>
<p>I wonder if the people of Niger would agree with you on that"</p>
<p>-They are on receiving end…they would stay away from this type of discussion. BTW, talking about education, I know several immigrants from Nigeria, some of them were thinking about sending kids back home for k -12, being very disspointed with USA system…as most immigrants from other countries…</p>
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I am personally acquainted with people who have been or whose family members have been sexually assaulted on crossing the border. They felt they had absolutely no choice and this is what happened. It’s not uncommon because the people trying to cross the border are victims of the wealthy/powerful in their countries who push them out, they are the victims of the coyotes (who are straight-up criminals), they are the victims of plenty of people on this end. And I understand that a lot of you really mean well and think you’re doing right, but as long as you enable and encourage these border crossings, particularly without stopping the remittances going back, the exploitation will continue. Sometimes it’s really, really hard and painful to do the right thing, particularly when so many interested parties who want their cut are so aggressive about maintaining the status quo, but it is WRONG. I know nobody wants to be called a racist, which is what will happen, and I know there will be economic consequences, but there have to be huge changes made or people will continue to be hideously exploited and eventually there will be unrest. The home countries MUST be held accountable. There are some small steps that can be made to begin the process, and I don’t know anyone who supports the straw man argument of “kicking them all out” but it’s beyond time to stop pretending that people, communities and cultures aren’t being hurt because they are. I find it amusing and annoying that the same people who rail against the destruction of the native American cultures don’t see that by advocating open borders they are doing the same to the indigenous peoples in Central America in real time. I’m not sure if a lot of you know this or if it is unique here, but many of the illegal immigrants not only don’t speak or read English, they don’t speak or read Spanish, either and have no history of literacy in any language. There isn’t much we can do for them here and they will not be assimilated and self-sufficient in this generation OR the next. But they absolutely should expect human rights in their own countries, but no one is supporting them in that because for so many, it’s just fine and dandy for them to not achieve their potential or live dignified, happy lives as long as lawns are cut and restaurant dishes washed – and make sure most of the money they do earn gets sent back home where there might be a pittance left for the family after everyone else gets their cut.</p>
<p>Miami, Niger and Nigeria aren’t the same country.</p>
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It breaks my heart that your country doesn’t have the benefit of your gifts. Some of the home countries of the immigrants I work with would be so much better off if their best and brightest citizens, like you were using their talents and energies to improve their countries.</p>