<p>D is a hs sophomore and we just went on our very first college visit trip. I learned about Elon on this site and told D about how great it sounded. She researched it and loved everything she read about it. We’re VA residents, but she wanted the first trip to be to NC because she really wanted to visit Elon.</p>
<p>Well we visited four schools this week. She loved one, liked two, and really didn’t like Elon! She could not get away from the campus fast enough. Of course every school is not right for every student, but we’re trying to figure out how much of a role the quality of the tour is playing in our reactions.</p>
<p>The Elon tour was not good for us. Our guide was a young lady with a lot of personality, but she never really gave D a feeling for the school. She tended to answer questions with more of a comedic response than much information. It seemed that every tour had to follow the same path so we had to rush through most stops because there was always another group on our heels. I know it was a busy spring break day, but we didn’t have that experience at the other schools on this visit. D did speak to a few other students and found them to be friendly and positive about the school, but it just didn’t feel right for her. </p>
<p>The school she loved gave an awesome tour. H and I both wanted to attend after it! We’ve been trying to decide if any of our feelings would have been different if the great tour and not great tour had been reversed. We’d appreciate any thoughts on how to separate ‘fit’ from the tour.</p>
<p>Sometimes the tour does define the fit! Just FYI, we toured Elon as well, and our tour guide was awful, just awful. We were underwhelmed with the info session as well, and the adcom we spoke to. DD felt like they thought they were doing us a favor by meeting with her. She scratched the school from her list as well.</p>
<p>There are lots of reasons why kids don’t mesh with schools. One of our kids didn’t like the look of the buildings. </p>
<p>There is a thread on this forum about silly reasons kids didn’t Iike colleges.</p>
<p>You know…they have to drop schools off their list for some reason! At least she liked one of the schools. She is a sophomore. Plenty of time to find a variety of schools. And that one she loved this week? Don’t be surprised if it falls into disfavor at some point!</p>
<p>Aw, sorry it didn’t go well. We have decided to take the tour, then to wander around on own and chat up random students in order to get a fuller picture of the school. We go to the Student Union or equivalent, the gym, and then Hillel (you would pick the appropriate religious org) . We read all the posters on the light poles and stuck up in the Union. If there is a lecture or special event going on, we ask about it and crash it if possible. I think it is better if your child can wander off without you and gather info in her own way if possible. </p>
<p>We try to do more than just a tour on campus for that reason. Try to have my kid attend a class, eat in the cafeteria. I had my kid read the Fiske Guide to Colleges review on the drive to campus from the hotel in the morning (copied the relevant ones so I didn’t have to schlep the whole huge book!). We tried to pick up a copy of the student paper, or read it online if we couldn’t get a paper copy. We even attended info sessions if there weren’t classes that day (must admit we are not big fans of them, though). We would also go look at the studio art space on our own at every campus for D2, since she was interested in that as a possible minor. We would usually hash over our day on the way back to the hotel after visiting – just trying to figure out the good and bad parts.</p>
<p>One problem that seems common is that a parent loves a school that the kid doesn’t like. In the end it is tough to get a kid to apply to school they don’t like or attend there. But it is good to try to pin down what they didn’t like. Campus location & atmosphere, behavior of students, food and common spaces, something they heard about academics, etc.</p>
<p>We really encouraged out kids to keep an open mind throughout the application process. No “dream school” for us. We only wanted them to apply to schools they would be willing to attend, and made sure that there were some pretty certain admission/affordable schools on that list. Then we had our kids go back to the top few schools after decision for accepted student visits, and THEN settle on a choice. </p>
<p>Your D is a sophomore. She doesn’t have any pressure now to pick “the school”. She just has to pick a reasonable list of them to apply to.</p>
<p>One thing too about this week - in New England where I live - is that it’s April vacation week so colleges tours/visits tend to be pretty busy right now. Two years ago we visited Boston and it was crazy how busy each school we visited was. </p>
<p>We did the same as Intparent in encouraging our kids to keep an open mind and we’d talk about what they liked and what they didn’t like after the visit. We also would try and eat on campus. </p>
<p>The first college we visited with DS1 was one he really liked on paper but in person, not so much. I was surprised because he was so excited about the school. Now the veteran of many school tours (and with two in colleges), I realize it happens. But finding out why she didn’t like Elon I think is important. Good luck to you guys!</p>
<p>Now that my son is a senior in college he’s less convinced about the utility of visits - he feels it’s too easy that the small sampling you meet are all too likely not to really be representative of the campus. Most tour guides tend to be outgoing types and the same often holds true of the student hosts. If you have an introvert kid they may feel like there isn’t anyone like them there. </p>
<p>Mathmom, while I would agree partially with that, I think that actually just adds some weight to the idea that a kid shouldn’t completely make up their mind until after attending accepted student visits at their top choices. 24 hours on campus is a lot more telling than 4 hours, IMHO. I don’t think students should skip initial visits, and I think you have to pare down the original list SOMEHOW. But don’t get too attached to anyplace until you have seen more than just a couple of hours and one tour guide.</p>
<p>Another thing that happened to us is that we kept meeting very cool people working in admissions (the admissions officers). I had to keep reminding my kids that they are hired partly because they are personable and you will likely never see them again after you arrive on campus unless you volunteer in admissions. And they aren’t actually professors or students… so don’t let them influence you too much, either.</p>
<p>We did visit most of the schools my D applied last year. The campus tour did give some general idea about the area and environment, but more important is to get some information, ask question, and express interest to the school. We even visited the campus in town but obviously not for checking out the campus as we are so familiar with it. After the admission, we went back for a couple more visit and the last one gave a more in depth campus tour in the engineering school. We are not so much interested in the dorm visit or the meal at dining hall, but more to the academic programs and extracurricular activities. I think that are more critical to define a good fit or not than the campus per se.</p>
<p>My daughter is a somewhat reserved kid (there are CC folks she has met…I think they would agree). She was a student ambassador at her college, and developed and ran an accepted student program for three years. She also worked in the undergrad admissions office for three years. She knew that NOT every student was outgoing and vivacious. And she also knew what she loved about certain tours we too, and what she hated about others. </p>
<p>She frequently told me that she tried to “read” her tour groups so that her presentation would be good for the group. Of course she had certain information to cover, but that could be done in a variety of ways. </p>
<p>She also made it a point to be able to linger after tours for anyone who might want to ask questions. This was not required, but she felt it was essential.</p>
<p>She hopes she had a positive impression for the folks on her tour, but she also knew the school was not for everyone who toured. </p>
<p>Very similar to @intparent we found it helpful to walk around by ourselves for a few minutes, do a tour and an info session, attend a class, have lunch in a dining hall. During the tour and our walk around, our S was trying to glean as much information as possible…newspapers, sign-ups on walls, comments written in dorms, how students interacted at lunch & around campus, etc. When possible, if he liked a school on the first visit, he went back (ie) for an interview and spending a day attending classes and eating with students. As parents, we did not stay with him, he was alone for the day at the college. Even though he is not real extroverted, students invited him to lunch and even used their passes to get his meal for free. My S found the visits extremely draining because, mentally, he was taking in so much information. Interestingly, he ended up at a school where the initial tour was disappointing, but a conversation with a student about a visual protest was extremely thought provoking and stimulating. Finally, the extended visit during accepted students days really gave him a sense of the school and his fit. At one school he said he liked the admissions staff much more than the students. So, short answer, try to do more than just a tour.</p>
<p>Thumper1 I think the tour guide at the school she loved followed the same guidelines your daughter did and it made a huge difference. I told her not to consider it a dream school – just a school she’d be interested in exploring further.</p>
<p>We did try to do some of these things. Wandered the campuses, checked bulletin boards and got the papers. Well she didn’t wander at Elon – she just wanted to leave! We were really trying to look at it as an initial exploration for what type of schools she should look at in terms of size and campus type since we do have a lot of time before she makes the decision. Elon was the only one she had any real prior opinion of. Maybe that was part of the problem? </p>
<p>It’s interesting that your son feels like college visits may be a waste of time Mathmom . This experience made me nervous about sending her off anywhere she hasn’t visited because she loved Elon on paper!</p>
<p>She’s having difficulty articulating what she didn’t care for. It really seemed like a visceral reaction from the time we got there although she thought the campus was very pretty. We asked for three positives and one negative for each school on the drive away. She couldn’t even come up with three positives. The negative she offered was that they didn’t offer the major she might be interested in, but she knew that going in. She’s not really firm on what she wants to major in and we realize that it’s likely to change before she even starts applying. I changed my major three times while I was IN college! It was the smallest school we visited, but she doesn’t think that’s what she didn’t like.</p>
<p>So I guess my follow on question is whether you should drop any school that provokes such a negative reaction. Even though your son didn’t like his tour Lacgrad he did have a very positive impression of at least one student. Has anyone else ever actually ended up attending a school that gave them a very negative first impression?</p>
<p>I think there can be multiple “fits” for one kid; there is not one “best” school. If she found one she likes, rejoice. If she likes it enough to apply ED, even better. If you’re doing RD, she will need to apply to more than one school, and if Elon feels like it ought to have been right but it just had a bad day then apply. She can always visit again after she’s been accepted to see how she feels. Usually, when you get to the end and have to commit to one school, there are no bad decisions. They are all good fits. </p>
<p>Remember, at this point you don’t have to pick where she’ll go, only where she’ll apply.</p>
<p>Well interestingly, I think my son is a bloom where planted kid. Or maybe a complain where planted kid. I don’t think he regrets his choice, just that he realizes that there are all types of kids at schools of almost any size. And perhaps that the groups that he feels are most dominant at his college (or at least in his major) were not necessarily the ones he saw on either of his visits. </p>
<p>Funnily while my older made his choice based on his major I think the culture of the school ended up being a better match.</p>
<p>I would absolutely drop a school from your list of consideration when there was such a negative reaction. There are so many colleges out there that a kid will like, that it makes no sense to keep one you “should” like, but don’t. My DD toured over 20 colleges and there were definitely those she loved, liked, felt neutral about and didn’t like at all. I was glad that she was having an opinion to start narrowing things down from such a large list. Move on and focus on what she likes. </p>
<p>I think the gut reaction does tell you something about fit. There were some campuses that we walked on and just thought “no” and felt good about others. It’s subjective because that same campus could be another student’s dream school. The reaction to a visit doesn’t tell the whole picture about a school, but it is something to pay attention to.
When your child writes her essays and fills out the application, it should be written with sincerity. I would bet your daughter would have difficulty stating why she wants to attend Elon now.
Yet students do change their minds. She is only a sophomore, and she may decide that it is worth a second look,. I think students are sometimes afraid to apply to a school because they think it is a definite commitment but nothing is definite until the student is accepted and accepts the offer of admission… If your D has some interest in Elon and is willing to do this as a senior, then fine, but if her reaction is still strong, I would let it go and focus on schools she is interested in. </p>
<p>I tried mightily to “make” my son like a particular LAC when we had a bad tour guide. I even sent him back for another tour w my father who lives in the area. But at the end of the day, you have to respect someone’s gut. How would you feel if you interviewed for a job and got a negative gut feeling about the company but were pressed to ignore it? </p>
<p>First and foremost, I agree that the entire concept of a “dream school” should be STRONGLY discouraged!</p>
<p>Unless there is some pressing reason that Elon should be seriously considered for her list–legacy, for example–I’d just drop it. There are so many other colleges to pick from.</p>
<p>That said, I think that a student should go on the tour, attend the info session, and definitely attend a class. Each activity will show a different aspect of the school. That’s why it is best to visit when school is in session, if at all possible. Eating in the student union and checking out the town is good, too.</p>
<p>As far as tour guides being “bad” … I think that may be rather harsh. In my experience, it is more likely that it is just a bad fit. But if everything gives the same impression, then your kid has probably been able to glean something about the predominant vibe of the place.</p>
<p>This is exactly the reason for visits. It worked. Many schools may seem great on paper but will not translate to a good fit upon a closer in person review. Since it is so early in the process, I would drop Elon for now and continue trying to narrow down what your D wants in a school. If at this time next year Elon still seems like a good “on paper” fit, you might suggest a revisit but I wouldn’t push it. There are just too many other schools out there to try to force a fit if her gut is saying no.</p>