<p>Congrats on the interviews!</p>
<p>So far, just 1 interview invite to a prelim med program for me. My file is still missing a LOR, my transcript (ie my grades), and the MSPE. My school refuses to send the transcript out before mid-October and the MSPE doesn’t go out before Nov. 1st. Seems like most radiology program wait until the MSPE goes out before sending invites whereas some of my colleagues applying to other specialties (like anesthesia) seem to interview earlier.</p>
<p>Congrats to you EaDad! Good luck with the Interviews.</p>
<p>Thanks NCG and Pharmagal</p>
<p>Do away rotations where you want to do your residency help in getting it?</p>
<p>DocT - they can. Like anything else, a poor showing though can be disastrous.</p>
<p>In some specialties, most notably Ortho, an audition rotation is practically required. It doesn’t guarantee a match, and people do match at programs without having done an away there, but if a student has top choice, they’re best served by doing a rotation with that program and then busting their hump. Most medical schools limit the number of months a student can spend away from campus, so it’s important to pick away rotations wisely.</p>
<p>In other specialties, away rotations are useful, particularly if the program is a bit of a reach for the applicant. It can also be useful in “announcing” an applicant’s interest in a particular program. I had friends who had very specific locations they needed to match at due to family considerations and so they did rotations specifically to demonstrate their interest in that particular program.</p>
<p>
Since this is a premed forum and there are so many knowledgeable CCers on this thread, could I ask a similar question on behalf of the lowly premeds who have not overcome the first hurdle – getting into a medical school? (Sorry about being off topic, but this thread seems to have attracted most very knowledgeable CCers, including the thread starter, NCG.)</p>
<p>Assuming that a premed takes a gap year, does doing research at a medical school where you want to go to during the gap year help getting in there – especially when the medical school is not a huge one? (Some medical school is huge not because of the size of class in its MD program as the size of class is not very different almost everywhere; it is huge because of the sizes and numbers of the medical research groups within the medical school, which could be easily much larger than the “teaching” part of the medical school if this is a research-focused medical school.)</p>
<p>I would say no. Away rotations are valuable because the same people reading your applications are also the same people who’ve seen you on the wards. It’s not just the fact you did an away at a place that’s going to net you an interview. You need to have an excellent or at least decent performance on your away rotation. </p>
<p>On the other hand, doing research for a year with a phD at Harvard Med School really won’t speak to your aptitude as a medical student and won’t help you get into Harvard Med School. Anyone can do research, whether you have a 2.5 college GPA or a 3.9 college GPA. Interest in general is much less valuable for med school admissions than it is for residency admissions. Residency programs are much smaller than med school classes so demonstrated interest plays much greater of a role in residency admissions.</p>
<p>And it looks like NCG has beat me to it while I was typing but here’s what I said anyways - pretty much the same thing:</p>
<p>mcat2 - I’d say that the potential impact on admission status is much less…perhaps even zero. Of course there is potential, but I wouldn’t necessarily count on this strategy. </p>
<p>The major reason is that as a research tech you’re not necessarily making an impression on anyone with any say on admission decisions. Certainly there is the possibility that you end up working with someone on the admissions committee, but you could also end up in a lab with someone that everyone hates. Worst case scenario you end up in a bench research lab that has little cross over to the clinical side of things. </p>
<p>The other major issue, at least in comparison to doing away rotations for residency, is that doing research doesn’t translate to being a good medical student/doctor, whereas the audition rotation allows an applicant to actively demonstrate how good of resident they’ll be.</p>
<p>The take-home point by reading your last paragraph seems to be that: Everybody knows that showing interests is a big part of your medical school application (possibly with the exception of some top medical schools.) However, showing interests is even much more important in the residency application.</p>
<p>Re: “bench research lab” vs “clinical research”: many research groups seem to be on the bench research side, especially for many highly ranked schools.</p>
<p>Thanks to both of you.</p>
<p>My son did research at a very competitive medical school in his home town, got a letter of recommendation from the professor he worked for, and didn’t even get an interview. C’est la vie. No we’ll see if he can get a residency interview!</p>
<p>Mythreesons,
That surprises me. I was under the impression that Research experience is a great hook.</p>
<p>NCG, Are there any stats on acceptance to residency of your choice and its correlation to research experience during med schools, i.e what % of students with research exp get their top choice?</p>
<p>Pharmagal: I’m not suggesting that research is unimportant in a medical school application. The question upthread as I understood it was whether research at a medical school before applying would increase the odds at THAT school. I offered one anecdotal story. </p>
<p>Question for you: Do med students (other than MD/PHD) do research? Other than the summer between first and second year, and I can’t imagine when there would be time?</p>
<p>Depends on the med school. Some expect you to be engaged in research throughout med school and there are some that require it. At Yale, a research thesis is required . Stanford is another with a “scholarly” requirement of some sort but I don’t remember much about it.</p>
<p>Pharmagal: there is data based on specialty via the “Charting Outcomes in the Match” report from the NRMP: <a href=“http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf[/url]”>http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf</a> , but as far for each individual program, it’s up to the programs to put that sort of information out there.</p>
<p>Strangely enough, UNM (not a high ranking research school) requires a thesis project from all its students.</p>
<p>
An anecdotal example here: DS hang out with postdoc or PhD candidate a lot last year. These “career researchers” teased those MDs that the researches done by MD students are “Micky Mouse research”, which likely means that it is not as “real” as THEIR research in terms of their quality and scope. I am not sure whether they are overly arrogant or not when they say this.</p>
<p>From the two quotes above:
</p>
<p>It does seem to imply that the training/education of a typical front-line doctor (not a “super-doctor” that you would find in a clinical research hospital) and that of a researcher on the academic track requires somewhat different mindset or attitude. For one thing, the research is what a PhD candidate will do mostly and the grades are almost irrelevant as long as they pass the qualifying exam (hmm…they may even barely take any classes and/or tests after the qualifier exam, but they hole up in their lab for many many years after passing that exam), while the clinical year grades and STEP 1 grades count a lot for MD program students.</p>
<p>Thanks, BRM.</p>
<p>Just to put this thread back on track, how are people doing with residency interview invites? My son has done pretty well number wise, although so far only one in Chicago, where he really wants to be.</p>
<p>3 prelim/transition year invites. 0 rads</p>
<p>I’m still missing a rec letter, my transcript, and dean’s letter. Not having my transcript is really hurting me since it’s hard to get an interview without med school grades (the most important thing on your application). My school normally uploads the transcript in mid-October. I can request them to upload it earlier but I just performed pretty well on my Sub-I in September and would like that grade on there. Even with the transcript, most rads programs don’t give out invites until November, after the Dean’s Letter comes out. I think the most frustrating thing so far is watching my classmates applying to other specialties getting tons of interviews. I know the rads interviews will come in bunches later but it still sucks for now.</p>
<p>Last year’s dates of when interviews invites were given out for rads (actual interview dates are even later). If I had known that radiology interviews so late, I would’ve taken December/Jan off instead of Nov/December off.</p>
<p>ALABAMA
UAB 10/6
Baptist Health System - Birmingham 10/18, 10/27<br>
South Alabama 11/4, 11/10 </p>
<p>ARIZONA
Maricopa Medical Center 10/1
St. Joseph Hospital & Medical Center 10/11
University of Arizona 10/18</p>
<p>ARKANSAS
University of Arkansas 10/28</p>
<p>CALIFORNIA
Kaiser Permanente 10/19
Santa Clara Valley Medical Center 11/5, 11/9
UCLA-Harbor 11/3, 11/4, 11/8
USC 11/5
UCI 11/9
UCSF 11/9
Loma Linda- 11/10
UC Davis - 11/18
Stanford - 11/22
Cedars Sinai - 11/23/10
UCSD 11/24
Santa Barbara Cottage 11/29
UCLA 11/30</p>
<p>COLORADO
UC Denver 11/8 </p>
<p>CONNECTICUT
St. Vincent’s Bridgeport 9/13
University of St. Raphael - 10/20
Hartford Hospital 10/21,10/25
University of Connecticut 10/25
Norwalk 11/1
Yale 11/5, 11/8</p>
<p>DELAWARE
Christiana 10/4 </p>
<p>DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA
George Washington 10/28
Georgetown 11/8, 11/12 </p>
<p>FLORIDA
Mayo Clinic Jacksonville 10/6, 11/2
University of Florida-Gainsville 10/12
UF-Jacksonville 10/13
Mount Sinai Medical Center Miami Beach 10/26
University of South Florida 11/17 </p>
<p>GEORGIA
MCG 9/29
Emory 10/12, 10/20 </p>
<p>ILLINOIS
UIC Peoria 9/14, 9/14
Rush 10/5, 11/23
SIU 11/1
U of Chicago 11/2
Northwestern 11/4
UIC 11/5
Masonic 11/5
Loyola 11/8
Stroger Cook County Hospital: 11/12 </p>
<p>INDIANA
Indiana University 10/14, 12/13</p>
<p>IOWA
Universtiy of Iowa 9/30</p>
<p>KANSAS
University of Kansas (Kansas City) 9/22, 9/23
University of Kansas (Wichita) 10/13 </p>
<p>KENTUCKY
University of Kentucky 11/2
University of Louisville - 10/28</p>
<p>LOUISIANA
Ochsner Clinic 9/27, 9/29
LSU - Shreveport 10/12
LSU - New Orleans 10/15, 10/22 </p>
<p>MAINE
Maine Medical Center - 11/16 </p>
<p>MARYLAND
University of Maryland 9/27, 10/13
Johns Hopkins 10/11, 10/20, 11/5</p>
<p>MASSACHUSETTS
UMass 10/6
Baystate Medical Center 10/12, 10/13, 10/15
Tufts 10/15
St Vincent Worchester 11/01
Harvard - Mt Auburn 11/4
Boston University 11/09
Massachusetts General Hospital 11/10, 11/11, 11/12, 11/15, 11/17, 11/22, 11/23
Lahey Clinic 11/15
BIDMC 11/19
BWH 12/1</p>
<p>MICHIGAN
Providence Hospital 9/17, 9/23, 9/24
Henry Ford Hospital 9/17, 9/21, 9/22 (Advanced), 10/5
Botsford (D.O.) 9/22
WSU/DMC 9/23, 10/4 , 10/26, 11/17
University of Michigan 9/23, 10/5
Grand Rapids/MSU: 10/4, 10/25
William Beaumont: 10/6
Oakwood: 10/7, 10/8
Flint/MSU: 10/26</p>
<p>MINNESOTA
Mayo Clinic 9/14, 9/28, 10/04
University of Minnesota 10/6 </p>
<p>MISSISSIPPI
University of Mississippi 9/22 </p>
<p>MISSOURI
University of Missouri - Kansas City 9/30, 10/11
University of Missouri - Columbia 10/5
Mallinkrodt 10/13, 11/2
Saint Louis University 11/2</p>
<p>NEBRASKA
Creighton University 9/15, 9/16
University of Nebraska 9/22, 10/4 </p>
<p>NEW HAMPSHIRE
Dartmouth-Hitchcock 10/1, 10/7</p>
<p>NEW JERSEY
Saint Barnabas Medical Center: 9/23, 10/1
Monmouth Medical Center: 10/13
Atlantic Health Morristown/Overlook Hospitals 10/18
UMDNJ-Newark 10/25
Cooper 11/1, 11/16
UMDNJ-RWJMS New Brunswick 11/10
Newark Beth Israel 12/17 </p>
<p>NEW MEXICO
University of New Mexico 9/15, 9/27, 10/4, 10/7, 10/20 </p>
<p>NEW YORK
Long Island Jewish/Albert Einstein COM 9/15, 9/21, 9/28, 10/13, 11/1
University of Rochester Strong Memorial 9/21, 9/24, 10/4
Beth Israel 9/28, 10/12, 10/28
Maimonides 9/29
Albany Medical Center 10/5,10/27, 11/4
Columbia 10/8, 10/26, 11/8
Cornell 11/24, 12/2
Stony Brook 10/8, 10/14
Rochester General Hospital 10/11
Jacobi/Albert Einstein COM 10/12, 10/26, 11/4
Staten Island Univ Hospital 10/14
Upstate Medical 10/22
North Shore 10/22
Winthrop 10/27
SUNY Downstate 11/1, 11/5, 11/8
NYMC 11/2
Mount Sinai School of Medicine 11/2
Montefiore/Albert Einstein COM 11/03, 11/8
Nassau University Medical Center 11/4, 11/15
NYU 11/15
St. Luke’s - Roosevelt 11/19
Bronx Lebanon - 11/23
Harlem Hospital - 11/23 ,12/20
Lenox Hill - 12/14, 12/20
Long Island College Hospital 12/14, 12/21 </p>
<p>NORTH CAROLINA
Wake Forest University 9/23, 9/24, 9/28, 10/1, 10/13, 10/19, 11/12, 11/24
University of North Carolina 9/29
Duke 11/16</p>
<p>OHIO
Cleveland Clinic 9/28, 11/12
Case Western- Metrohealth 10/6, 10/11
Case Western Reserve University (UH): 10/11, 10/12, 10/18
University Hospital/University of Cincinnati College of Medicine Program - 10/19, 10/26, 11/1
The Ohio State University 11/9
University of Toledo 11/17 </p>
<p>OKLAHOMA
University of Oklahoma 10/18
INTEGRIS 10/23 </p>
<p>OREGON
OHSU 11/8 </p>
<p>PENNSYLVANIA
Drexel University 9/23, 9/27, 9/28
Geisinger Medical Center 9/27, 9/30
UPMC 9/23, 9/24, 9/25, 9/27, 10/4, 10/11, 10/18
Penn State 9/29
Mercy Catholic Medical Center 9/29
Bryn Mawr 10/4, 10/20
Temple 10/26
Albert Einstein Medical Center 11/1, 11/4
Thomas Jefferson University Hospital 11/2, 11/3: 12/8/10
University of Pennsylvania 11/4, 11/8
Pennsylvania Hospital - 11/5, 11/8
Allegheny General Hospital- 11/10 </p>
<p>RHODE ISLAND
Brown 10/18</p>
<p>SOUTH CAROLINA
MUSC 10/1</p>
<p>TENNESSEE
UT Knoxville 9/9, 9/13
Baptist Hospital Memphis 9/15
UT Memphis/Methodist 10/13
Vanderbilt 11/9 </p>
<p>TEXAS
UT Houston 9/2, 9/7, 9/16, 9/23, 10/1
Baylor College of Medicine (Houston) 10/8
Baylor University Medical Center (Dallas) 10/11
University of Texas Medical Branch 10/12
Texas A&M Scott and White 10/13, 10/15, 11/4
UT Southwestern 10/14
UTHSC San Antonio - 10/15, 11/9 </p>
<p>UTAH
University of Utah 10/14, 11/2 </p>
<p>VERMONT
Univ of Vermont FAHC: 9/28</p>
<p>VIRGINIA
UVA 9/20, 9/21, 9/29, 10/4
VCU 9/22, 9/27, 10/05
EVMS 10/19 </p>
<p>WASHINGTON
University of Washington 10/19, 11/1, 11/6
Virginia Mason Medical Center 10/21, 11/8
Providence Sacred Heart Medical Center, 11/11 </p>
<p>WEST VIRGINIA UNIVERSITY 12/6, 12/13, 1/3, 1/10, 1/17, 1/24 </p>
<p>WISCONSIN
Aurora St. Luke’s 10/5, 10/11
MCW 11/1
University of Wisconsin - Madison 11/8
Wheaton Franciscan-St. Joseph Milwaukee - 11/9</p>
<p>Right now my strategy is to schedule as many prelim and TY interviews as I can for October and November (with the goal of 5-6 total interviews) with the goal of freeing up late November, December, and January for rads interviews (goal of 10-12 interviews to match).</p>