NY Times: Moderate Drinking Has No Health Benefits, Analysis of Decades of Research Finds

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It’s frustrating to see articles that are behind paywalls. :frowning:

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https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/04/health/alcohol-health-effects.html?unlocked_article_code=sk6Ve7udlq665tlIDUkzYz1kvQ7KTQBCu7U3gtU8IifvOAf_Iyfm2JzDXrNyhc6ySb76p_F8lXYx9nsaBfOLryEOo3T3NdvosaKBdg38ja6jm11XdYud-9Jo-_W9SnhMl5MacIOWSJCwvK1oaRvEhd5HZZgiVk2_-7d4HdPKHK4hjols4HbIcL55mwNsQVGVDYy_ZjrEJOh_F43k5tsdc53O6ATfzrtSTQ64FRgKhW0nbxIDMJg41_fSXkiUDPMOYiCH_2kQR-L2lYR9GvBS4WtlYpYJ18VLuBzOHafzGDUNsdjxZf0lDqOd-zTS3ufSCTPw-iMd4ROk46rtqpbG&smid=url-share -

This one should be unlocked - if the first one wasn’t.

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Thanks, @sabaray. I am out of gift links.

You are welcome! Between the two of us I bet we can get the interesting stories posted.

Other articles about this same study noted that people who drank “moderately” were no MORE likely to die prematurely than abstainers. And clearly certain other factors seem to drive health. From the article, “Moderate drinkers tend to be moderate in all ways. They tend to be wealthier, are more likely to exercise and to eat a healthy diet, and are less likely to be overweight. They even have better teeth, scientists say.” So it seems that staying healthy in all sorts of ways is beneficial; it’s not super clear that having a moderate amount of alcohol really has much benefit/harm for your health. So if moderate number of drinks helps you to be more social (clearly a huge health benefit) or relax and let go of stress (another obvious health win), I’m surmising it’s a win. Whereas over indulging is clearly never a win.

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It’s a slippery slope from moderate drinking to overconsumption for some, myself included. I think it’s a personal choice everyone must make for themself.

We recently started experimenting with some alcohol substitutes, such as Seedlip and Lyre. If you enjoy the taste of alcohol but not the morning after regrets, Lyre is a good product. When my alarm goes off at 4:30 am to get to the gym or out for a run, I’m always glad I didn’t have any alcohol.

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I don’t pay much attention to this type of “researches”. They are nothing but some statistics on limited samples that are likely far from representative. They may draw one “conclusion” one day and something else (or even an opposite “conclusion”) the next day. They have no scientific value, because there’s really no science. I subscribe to the philosophy that anything in excess (even if it’s supposedly good for you) is harmful but nothing in moderation is.

There are some illegal drugs (commonly used ones) that are definitely harmful to users, even with a first use. Cocaine and Heroin come to mind right off. I doubt there’s any “moderate” level of Fentanyl either, but haven’t looked at that one as closely.

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I’m not sure there’s such a thing as a “moderate” user of narcotics, with their much stronger addictive power.

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I’m just surprised that 2-3 drinks every day is considered moderate. Personally I’d define moderate as maybe 7 drinks per week, some/most weekdays no drinks and maybe 2-3 socially on weekends.

But I’m a super-light drinker (maybe 2-3 drinks a month) so my perception might be skewed.

Actually now that I think about it, when I spent a summer in France with a family they knocked back a couple bottles of wine every day and that seemed normal so my perception probably is very skewed.

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Right, I was concerned when I saw the headline. This definition of moderate is a lot more than I thought it would be! I can’t imagine having two drinks a day and being able to function.

I am enjoying an apricot sour beer from Urban Family at the moment.

Ok, back to the discussion :joy:.

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I tend to have wine with my meals on the weekend and plan meals around wine and visa versa. How much largely depends on how long I’m eating (having guests over typically means more wine). I don’t drink during the week largely because I don’t have time to prepare meals that warrant a nice glass of wine. On the whole I think is better for us than drinking each day (and cheaper). I hope to retire sometime in the future and have given some thought to my drinking habits. Currently I primarily drink water. I think I may substitute tea as my weekday drink. We’ll see.

As for the study. I am of the opinion that it’s probably accurate but not for the reason people think. I think that people who like to cook often enjoy wine, beer or spirits with their meal. Cooking for yourself often means healthier meals and more moderate portions. It’s the diet not the alcohol that keeps you healthy. Light drinking can relax you and lubricate social interaction. Both I would think would be good for you.

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Smoking (anything at any dose) is likely to be harmful in terms of increased risk of lung cancer and other hazards.

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I think for some people drinking alcohol in moderation probably won’t hurt them. But it probably doesn’t help either. I think that’s what this article is saying.

Plenty of things in moderation can be bad for you.

I am a light drinker, but I don’t pretend that drinking helps me in any way.

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I used to be a social smoker (decades ago when smoking wasn’t regarded as harmful) and quit when it was no longer a socially cool thing to do. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

My husband listened to a podcast by some scientist he respects and came to the conclusion that there’s really no reason to drink at all. He loved collecting wine, so now we have a basement full of wine he’s not drinking! I told him I’d do a month of cold turkey, but then would probably do some moderate drinking. We’ve really enjoyed trying some of the alternatives like Seedlip (have not tried Lyre). I had no problem not drinking, but I have gone back to having a cocktail at a restaurant or a glass or two with dinner on the weekend or at gatherings.

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You are a very rare specie. :slight_smile: I’ve known many folks who started as social smokers… and couldn’t kick the habit no matter what they tried.

@oldmom4896 I’m another person who would be happy to gift NY Times articles. Just indicate that your article isn’t gifted as you’ve run out this month. You post some great thought provoking stuff.

I had 2 glasses of wine last night at dinner. I just can’t drink wine in America. In Europe, I’m fine. It think it’s the preservatives. Feel terrible today. 2 measly glasses. Hardly ever drink.