off topic - i made 400k

<p>but i have to post this. I made 400k out of 16k in the last 2 days. I bought both google put and call (May, almost ending) options last thursday anticipating exciting or super bad numbers and boom, google went up 20% and the option shot up around 25 times and then i bought UA call and put yesterday and boom it double folded, so my investment is up 34 times and yea, that's a little more than 400k...</p>

<p>well the google put option and UA call option became worthless paper but do i care? lol</p>

<p>the sad thing is, i wont qualify for financial aid next year</p>

<p>Wow, that is amazing. Could you explain what you did in English please? I don't understand what you mean by "bought both google put and call options." Also, are you only 18? If you are, that is absolutely crazy. I can't even imagine having 400k right now.</p>

<p>yea i m a freshman. i cant believe it either, we were talking about that in our IOE class about risk management.
Call and put options and ways to buy or sell a stock (in the future). You buy a call option with a certain strike price now and at the designated execution date, you can exercise the option and buy the amount of stock at the "striike price". You make money if the stock goes up. Say the strike price is $100 and your stock is actually worth $116, then you make money because you will be buying $116 dollars worth of stock for $100. but if your stock is $80, then the option you bought becomes worthless because why would you want to buy $80 worth of stock for $100 right?
put option is the complete opposite of call option. The strike price is an exercise price you can sell the stock at on a designated day. So you make money if your stock goes down.
people buy options because well, they move a lot more than the real stock, say for my google as example, google went up 20%, and it shot up 25 times, that's 2500%.</p>

<p>if anyone wants to talk about stocks, pls pm me. the reason why i post here is coz I wanna find someone to share ideas with so we can make money together :p</p>

<p>yea this way is a good way of making money but you can lose just as much as easily....</p>

<p>that's why you hedge it by buying both call and put at the same time</p>

<p>well then the thing i dont understand is then if you hedge google both ways.... then u will be losing and winning at the same time.... ur profit would not be as big.</p>

<p>i knew google was announcing earnings, and so i bought both near expiration (25 days) call and put warrant that are very lowly priced because they are not close to strike price. google did well. stock price went up 20%, call warrant went up 2500%, put warrant became worthless, so i almost lose 95% there, but i still make 2405% combined. If the earnings were worse than estimated, the opposite would happen and I would make money off the put warrant.
if everything matches expectation then there wont be vigorous movement and all I would lose is the daily depreciation of the option.
i looked up earnings announcement dates before I did it. You need some kind of stimulation for this to work</p>

<p>i am doing the same thing for apple today. Earnings announcement at 5pm eastern time. </p>

<p>ah i wish i had more money to do this....money still held up for settlement, stupid T+3... my balance is avalible on thursday..how ironic....</p>

<p>15k call
18k put </p>

<p>we'll see how it goes</p>

<p>ironice thing is , 2 weeks ago I was still trying hard to convince them to give me level 2 options capability (purchase/sell options), and they almost didnt let me.</p>

<p>Today I called them to upgrade my option level to level 4 (uncovered calls/puts and index) and they said I need to wait for 3 months to reapply after the last decision. I told them in that case I would withdraw all 400k from my account tomorrow once settlement is done and transfer to etrade they are like..let me talk to my supervisor, and then tell me I just have to fill out the application and they will grant me...
money works wonders</p>

<p>That's ridiculous dude. It's awesome. I'm learning about hedge funds right now. How do you have all this money to throw at these stocks? How long have you been investing?</p>

<p>i started off with 5k which was my summer earnings and graduation gift combined</p>

<p>Wow I seriously have to learn about stocks..because you fellas are throwing out jargon that I just do not understand lol. But congrats to Bearcats, that is insane!</p>

<p>Bearcats,</p>

<p>Ok, so I've been reading about call and put, and I think I've got it all figured out, but I can't understand how you made so much money. This is how I understand it (please correct me). </p>

<p>If I buy 10 options put and 10 options call at $50 and the thing goes up to $100, I would be able to buy 10 options at $50 with my call option and the put option would be useless. I would then sell the 10 options at $100 each to get $1000. The problem is, though, I bought 20 options for $50 each (10 put and 10 call) for a total of $1000. So therefore, my net profit would be $0.</p>

<p>Nevermind, I didn't realize that you don't actually buy the shares, but instead buy the option to sell or buy the shares, hence the name options.</p>

<p>I still don't understand, though how you made so much money. When google went up 20%, why did the call warrant go up 2500%?</p>

<p>google, damn, u must've had a decent amount of money urself to invest in google. if u din't sell it, maybe you should hold on to it! its looking like they have strong interest in yahoo, if microsoft doesn't give the deal, google cud make a move.</p>

<p>How do you get call and put options? Like explain the classes of investors or whatever you were talking about.</p>

<p>While everyone is right to congratulate bearcats on his success here, please recognize the risk he took before you try the same thing. He invested $16,000 in Google puts and calls. If, instead of posting better-than-expected earnings (or worse-than-expected earnings), Google had merely matched expectations (which is generally the most likely thing to happen, since the people whose "expectations" count are usually smart, sophisticated, well-informed, and work hard to figure out what they think is going to happen), then he could have lost substantially all of his investment. Trading in options is a super-risky investment strategy, as you can tell by the fact that he made the kind of return that you would need to justify a super-risky investment strategy. If you do it a lot, you are going to lose more often than you are going to win, and if you keep doubling down the way he did, you could lose big. It's like going to the racetrack or the casino: exciting, great if you win, but you shouldn't do it with your rent/food/tuition money, money you can't afford to lose.</p>

<p>Here's how it works:</p>

<p>Let's say Google stock sells for $100 today. You can buy a call option to buy 1,000 shares of Google @ $100 any time in the next month for about $3,500, and a put option to sell 1,000 shares of Google @ $100 for about the same price (actually, always a little less than the call, because everything being equal stock prices for companies that don't pay dividends should rise over time). If you BOUGHT 1,000 shares of Google, it would cost you $100,000, plus commissions, but you can get the options position for $7,000 plus commissions.</p>

<p>If Google stock goes up to $105 next week, your call option is going to be worth about $8,000, but your put option is going to be worth maybe $1,000. Approximately the same thing, in reverse, if the stock goes to $95. You could sell both options for $9,000 combined (and pay more commissions), and you would have a pretty nice profit for a week's investment. If it went to $120, your call option would be worth about $20,500, and your put option would be worth close to $0 (and it would be the same or a little better, in reverse, if the stock went to $80). There you would have almost tripled your money.</p>

<p>But look what happens if Google stays around $100/share. Most stocks don't move 20%, or even 5%, over the course of a month. The "option premium" part of the value of an option -- and in this example, where the options are bought "at market", 100% of the value is option premium -- declines every day as the expiration date gets closer. (It also declines as the stock price moves farther away from the option price.) So, if Google basically stays where it is for the week, your $7,000 options investment may be worth only $5,000. If you wait until the end of the month, it will be worth nothing. Taking commissions into account, you may have lost 1/3 of your investment in a week, whereas if you had bought Google stock itself you would not have lost anything.</p>

<p>The more likely a stock is to jump around in price, the more expensive it will be to buy options close to market. You can get bigger bang for your buck if you buy options a little off market (in the above example, say call @ $102 and put @$98), but then of course you are increasing the likelihood that your "straddle" -- that's what the offsetting options position is called -- will decline in value. If bearcats really turned $16,000 into $400,000 with two trades, he was not buying the options at market, so he was taking pretty considerable risk.</p>

<p>you lose daily depreciation. I never look to hold options more than 2 days. I buy it right before earnings day, and sell it right after. You have to follow the rules you set for yourself, no matter how painful it is or what your emotion tells you to do. You lose 20%, and you feel like you might be able to make it back holding onto them. nope, you sell it. You make 100% but you feel like if you hold onto it you might make more, doesnt matter, you still sell it.
that's how you prevent total loss.
this is not long term investment, as you said, if you hold for like a month, you might be holding worthless toilet paper, you are just hoping for a bang on earnings announcement, then sell it right after. nothing happens, you lose daily depreciation, which sometimes can go up to 20% of your original purchase price. something happen, you take the money and run as fast as possible</p>

<p>btw I dont buy in the market.</p>

<p>ps. For td ameritrade, you get 500 free trades</p>

<p>btw for people who never traded options before, start by doing covered calls. You take less risks but you can actually do pretty well</p>