what are your thoughts on paying full OOS tuition for UCLA vs paying tuition for a slightly less prestigious but smaller private school? I know UCLA is beautiful and has perfect weather and a great social scene, but to succeed academically, I’m conflicted on whether UCLA is the best choice…
factors to consider:
research experience? at said private school, the enrollment is 5000 but they have brand new med facilities. is it hard to get research positions at UCLA? I know, talk to professors, but with huge classes, they would only be able to offer so many spots.
competition/GPA? are classes HARD at UCLA? how much MORE work would it take to ensure a high GPA at UCLA vs a smaller private school?
attention from faculty? at UCLA, are there premed advisors, general academic advisers, and how accessible/busy are they? would they be able to grant attention comparable to a smaller school to see premeds succeed?
name brand recognition? is UCLA THAT much more well known, than say like a school ranked in the 30s? and how much does this matter for premed?
extracurricular involvement- are positions limited at UCLA for extracurrics? would it be THAT much harder at a large state school to make a mark in the community?
**I was offered a 15k/year scholarship at the small school, so that is also a factor. but price is less of an issue with me. educational quality and success matter more.
I’m on a quest to raise $1 million a year for the UC system. I just need 20 OOS kids to enroll!!
Sure you’ll just be a kid at a large impersonal public, but don’t let that discourage you. The gift from you and your parents is most appreciated. Thank you in advance from a CA taxpayer.
Premed, or for that matter, any defined curriculum is harder at a large research university especially the UCs. You have to keep in mind there will be greater competition for everything - pre-med stream courses, research projects, even getting a high GPA is harder - too many kids for the curved methodologies at a Berkeley etc.
If you are not going to stop at a Bachelor’s going to a namebrand U is not as important as being prepared for med or graduate school. Which LAC did you get admitted to? Do they have a great academic reputation? Do they graduate matriculate enough students to med schools? Do you have any data?
Premed from OOS in CA is a losing proposition. There just aren’t enough spots for CA residents already.
Most students don’t have a personal adviser (or any adviser until in a major) and very little contact with professors until, perhaps, your last year. They’re not invested in your success because they can’t. There are just too many undergraduate students to know all their names, let alone know what they want to do or offer support.
“Would they be able to grant personal attention to see premeds succeed” indicates to me that you haven’t given enough thought to what “large public university /budget cuts” means.
A university ranked in the 30’s will be well-known to grad schools.
Thats an easy choice then - a close friend of mine’s elder son is at Univ of Rochester so i know about the school personally. It is a rigorous school and prepares you well for med/other graduate programs. It will be easier for you to prepare for med school there than at UCLA.
Bear in mind that if you enroll at Univ of Rochester, you will hate the weather some weeks of the year and there are minimal parties but other than that it will be very academically rewarding experience. So if that is a consideration, Univ of Rochester gets beaten into pulp by UCLA - Westwood near Beverly Hills Socal location. Nuff said.
To be honest, I feel like these comments are overly harsh towards UCLA.
A main plus to UCLA for premed is having a hospital on campus that's ranked #2 in the nation. You'll have the opportunity to do clinicals here and what not that you probably won't be able to do otherwise.
Also, research opportunities are big. 51% of undergraduates participate in research. If you take advantage of this, it'll look great on an application.
Name recognition does help to an extent if you are able to succeed. If you can thrive in a hard academic environment and well known university, it testifies that you can thrive in med school.
UCLA having a med school and hospital means that certain professors are friends of or may even work also in these departments. This can make their letters of recommendation extremely valuable.
Addressing each point,
Like mentioned above, 51% participate in research. While there is a lot of competition, there are also a ton more opportunities. I firmly believe that as long as you have solid qualifications, you'll be able to receive at least a couple research opportunities. Also, I spoke to someone who went to the school and they said that they've known some professors who intentionally look for freshman or sophomores for certain projects since they will be able to work on the project with the professors longer than upperclassman will be able to. Not sure the magnitude of truth in this, but being able to secure positions your freshman year is huge and very unique.
I know there is grade deflation. I believe the average gpa is 3.3 which can be worrisome. However, things I've looked up have said that med schools take grade deflation from well known universities into consideration. You may however want to look more into this to make sure.
Even though it is a large school, they have large advising to accommodate this. I feel like this concern is mainly dependent on the student. The staff is definitely gonna be too busy to seek you out about your future. This being said, you'll need to be a self advocate and go to their offices. They definitely have the resources there, it's just up to you to go find them. I would call UCLA to find out more information on specific resources they have for helping you get into medical school and compare this to your other school. Keep in mind too that UCLA having their own med school gives them inside information as to what med schools want to see on applications. This helps for advising.
See above bullets. I'm personally not sure of how much name recognition helps, but it probably helps a little bit.
UCLA has over 1,200 clubs and is introducing new ones all the time. This helps you make a mark on the community much more since there are so many clubs you can have leadership in and use to make a difference. Clubs usually don't have max's unless you find some exceptions, but since there is such a large abundance of them, if you can't get into one club, it's no big deal. You could even start your own club for a cause you think is good. This would look remarkable on an application and is really easy to do at this school.
Ultimately, I think it comes down to you as a student. If you’re someone who is willing to work really hard in classes to overcome grade deflation and take advantage of research and medical opportunities, I’d say it’s worth it. If you’re not looking to work overly hard or aren’t interested in completing research, maybe the other school will be better. It also depends on how much of a self-advocate you are. UCLA definitely has the resources, you just have to pursue them.
But I think you should go through and compare each one of these categories to the other school that you mentioned. It’s hard to say whether or not its worth it without knowing what the other school has to offer. For all I know, that school could be comparable in all of these categories or even better. On the other hand, you might find they significantly lack in some compared to UCLA. It all depends.
Good Luck in your decision tho, and I’m sure it’ll all work out either college you choose.
^a lot of this is moot for OP, since being OOS s/he can’t apply to CA med schools.
Large advising and grade deflation are also bad for premeds. And unfortunately no, no allowance will be made for UCLA students. Finally, having research on your transcript isn’t some “nice to have” thing, it’s basically required for students to have a chance.
UCLA is a GREAT school, but it’s already tough for residents who want to be premeds (their odds are staggering). For OOS… it’s a really, really bad idea.
And while URochester’s weather is miserable, it won’t have all these downsides and quite a few perks.
^very good points. I did find this on UCLA’s med school site “No preference is given to state of residence. However many applicants come from California. Acceptees from California are more likely to matriculate at UCLA. Out of 175 freshman, 85 percent were from California.” However, while they say this it might not necessarily be true and I know a lot of CA med schools do give preference to in state students. I also didn’t know the other school was URochester and I don’t know anything about that school, so I’m not sure how it compares.
Also, I’m not disagreeing with what you’ve stated thus far, I just wanted to list some of the positives of UCLA since it’s been mainly negative thus far. Obviously, what I listed can be argued against, but there is some merit to it and should be considered.
The competition among the pre-meds is brutal in UCLA. Eventhough my daughter is extremely competitive - were admitted last year with Regents scholarship and stats of SAT 2370, GPA 4.65 - still she has to fight hard to get A’s to maintain high GPA!
If you have any doubts in your ability to survive in such an environment you better stay far away!
Thanks everyone for your insights.
An update- I am now considering Northeastern University (near my hometown) in MA, which has offered me a scholarship. What are your thoughts on premed at Northeastern (which would be roughly 15k cheaper because of scholarship) vs premed at OOS UCLA? Thanks!
UCLA OOS + premed is insane. Seriously, there’s no better way for you NOT to get into med school. This seems like a nobrainer for me.
URochester vs. Notheastern is a bit harder to decide. Is one cheaper than the other?
Northeastern is very strong for science and the coop system actually allows you to gain a lot of medical experience for your admissions.
URochester is very strong for science, is more personal than Northeasern, and has great research.