<p>S1 applied ED2 to a highly selective school with assurances from the coach, but given his academic record, we were nervous) Just in case, I called other schools that were interested in him (he would have skinned me if he knew), explained the situation, and asked if they would still be interested in the case that the original deal fell through. They were very forthcoming, and in at least three cases encouraged me to send S1 back if the first deal fell through (it didn't).</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
Why is it important to commit to one school and share this with the coaches at competing schools? Does your son becomes less valuable to the first school without issuing a verbal commitment AND not pursuing other alternatives until a formal acceptance is received?
[/QUOTE]
The coaches have a limited number of slots to offer athletes, so they are reluctant to put a kid on their list without a firm commitment. For most schools and athletes this gets resolved relatively early in the process through early acceptances or letters of intent.</p>
<p>The Ivies don't offer athletic scholarships, hence no letters of intent. So the coaches try to lock in their top recruits by encouraging early decision with the coach's support, which would be a pretty strong incentive for a kid who knows he wants to go to a particular reachy school.</p>
<p>Harvard and Princeton (w/o ED) would be at a severe recruiting disadvantage if they couldn't offer likely letters which, as JHS points out, are only valuable as a recruiting tool if they are perceived to be rock solid.</p>
<p>Does anyone know if H and P will honor their likely letters if the athlete is injured? </p>
<p>Good advice from CPT about the best, most accomplished and level headed kids who sometimes get involved in something senior year that seems "innocent" but turns out poorly. Although...in those cases, actual admissions can be rescinded almost as easily as a likely letter....and some of the alternative schools might not be interested in the student, either.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
Does anyone know if H and P will honor their likely letters if the athlete is injured?
[/QUOTE]
Good question. I wish I'd asked it of the coach. I did think to ask if my son had a bad athletic season after getting a likely letter would that affect his final acceptance. I was assured it would not.
[QUOTE]
Good advice from CPT about the best, most accomplished and level headed kids who sometimes get involved in something senior year that seems "innocent" but turns out poorly. Although...in those cases, actual admissions can be rescinded almost as easily as a likely letter....and some of the alternative schools might not be interested in the student, either.
[/QUOTE]
This gets to the heart of the matter. I'm starting to come to the conclusion that a likely letter from H or P is probably as reliable as an SCEA acceptance from Y or S, in other words reliable provided the applicant stays on track senior year.</p>
<p>Is your S planning on official visits?</p>
<p>^ Only to the likely letter school.</p>
<p>
[quote]
[Quote]
Why is it important to commit to one school and share this with the coaches at competing schools? Does your son becomes less valuable to the first school without issuing a verbal commitment AND not pursuing other alternatives until a formal acceptance is received?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>The coaches have a limited number of slots to offer athletes, so they are reluctant to put a kid on their list without a firm commitment. For most schools and athletes this gets resolved relatively early in the process through early acceptances or letters of intent.</p>
<p>The Ivies don't offer athletic scholarships, hence no letters of intent. So the coaches try to lock in their top recruits by encouraging early decision with the coach's support, which would be a pretty strong incentive for a kid who knows he wants to go to a particular reachy school.</p>
<p>Harvard and Princeton (w/o ED) would be at a severe recruiting disadvantage if they couldn't offer likely letters which, as JHS points out, are only valuable as a recruiting tool if they are perceived to be rock solid.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Parent of 2, I know ALL of that but it changes absolutely nothing to what should be important to YOU. Your list includes everything that is important to the school. One of the greatest potential pitfalls of the recruiting process if to lose the focus on the ... student. Inasmuch as every recruited athlete and the family want to BELIEVE everything a school says, there is ample evidence that such confidence is not always warranted. </p>
<p>The question that remains open relates to the necessity to lowering your bargaining position by disclosing your son's FIRST choice to other schools. There are very good reasons why schools dropped their SCEA or ED, and they weighed the impact of such decision on athletic recruiting. Simply stated ... that is NOT your problem. </p>
<p>Your **only **preoccupation should be about maximizing YOUR chances at a potential school.</p>
<p>PS Incidentally, there were discussions at the last Ivy League conference alleging Harvard and Princeton are using their new financial initiative as severe recruiting ... advantage. Again, the schools knew what they were doing and your commitment should espouse the official rules, not the tacit expectations of coaches.</p>
<p>
[quote]
PS Incidentally, there were discussions at the last Ivy League conference alleging Harvard and Princeton are using their new financial initiative as severe recruiting ... advantage.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>xiggi, this is exactly what I expected to happen when HYP improved their financial aid. HYP can now offer the equivalent of a full- or near full-athletic scholarship to most recruits that cannot be rescinded if the athlete drops their sport. It seems likely that these schools should see the success of their recruiting efforts improve immensely.</p>
<p>xiggi - sorry I misunderstood your earlier question. I'll try again.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
Why is it important to commit to one school and share this with the coaches at competing schools? Does your son becomes less valuable to the first school without issuing a verbal commitment AND not pursuing other alternatives until a formal acceptance is received?
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
The question that remains open relates to the necessity to lowering your bargaining position by disclosing your son's FIRST choice to other schools. There are very good reasons why schools dropped their SCEA or ED, and they weighed the impact of such decision on athletic recruiting. Simply stated ... that is NOT your problem.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Agreed. But navigating the process IS my problem. And EVERY coach wants to know if their school is his first choice, and with good reason. They don’t want to waste their slots. So suppose DS tells H/P coach that H/P truly is DS’s 1st choice school but that he has to keep moving on other options until he has a formal acceptance. I imagine H/P choice coach can handle that.</p>
<p>But what does he tell 2nd, 3rd, and 4th choice coaches when one wants an ED application, another wants an SCEA application, and another is offering a small scholarship and wants a signed LOI? Anything short of a commitment and they won't go to bat for him.</p>
<p>Add to the equation what I was once told by a Div 1 coach, “we’re not supposed to talk, but we do,” and the navigation gets even trickier.</p>
<p>xiggi, you are absolutely right that my son should be the only one I care about in this process. That's why I'm here asking these questions. And I am truly grateful for everyone's help.</p>
<p>One Ivy coach admitted to us that they do talk to each other. One coach might call the other and say "Did you tell so-and-so to ask me for a financial aid read?" That way both coaches know where the athlete really wants to go, and as I mentioned before, they can help each other get their athletes the best aid package with no risk to their own programs.</p>
<p>I think it sounds as if the backup plan train has already left the station. The more typical approach might have been to use the interest from the other schools as leverage - in that case, your S would have said, "I love your school. I am sure it would be a great fit for me, but I need to go on my official visits and really get an inside look at each school before I make my final decision." Then the fire is kept on the coach's feet until October when they can actually get the letter in the mail.</p>
<p>But - barring a disaster a la CPT - it sounds to me as if the only problem you have is tolerating the anxiety until October when the likely letter arrives in the mail. It sounds like your son is in a great spot.</p>
<p>From the Ivy League Admission Statement:</p>
<p>Ivy</a> League Sports</p>
<ul>
<li><p>Admissions Offices at each Ivy school may offer some athletic and other candidates a "likely" letter, which has the effect of a formal letter of admission provided the candidate continues to have a satisfactory secondary school experience. Coaches may initiate the requests for these letters, but only the office of admission can issue a"likely" letter.</p></li>
<li><p>Admissions decisions will be communicated only by official written notification from Admissions Offices, by notification in Early Action, Early Decision or regular processes, or by likely letters after October 1, which are confirmed by one of those notifications. No other indication of a possible positive admissions result is or should be considered reliable.</p></li>
<li><p>A coach may both inquire about a candidate's level of commitment to an Ivy institution, or interest in attending that Ivy institution, and encourage that interest. However, a candidate may not be required to withdraw, or not make, other applications, or to refrain from visiting another institution, as a condition for receiving a "likely" letter or for a coachs support in the admissions process.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>Regarding the last bullet, I'm thinking that would be hard to enforce and difficult to prove if violated. If the kid hesitates or waffles, the coach just moves on to the next one on his list.</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
Regarding the last bullet, I'm thinking that would be hard to enforce and difficult to prove if violated. If the kid hesitates or waffles, the coach just moves on to the next one on his list.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Absolutely.</p>
<p>Then there is the following paragraph that was taken from the "Joint Statement for Candidates on Common Ivy Group Admission Procedure" which is posted on all of the Ivy schools websites.</p>
<p>"Within each institutions overall admissions process, from October 1
through March 15 an admissions office may issue probabilistic
communications, in writing, to applicants who are recruited student athletes.
(Such communications given by coaches, whether orally or
in writing, do not constitute binding institutional commitments.) An
applicant who receives one or more such written communications and
who has made a decision to matriculate at one institution is encouraged
(but not required) to notify all other institutions, and to withdraw
all other applications, as promptly as possible."</p>
<p>This implies that likely letters are intended to be extremely reliable.</p>
<p>Hmm, but notice that communication from coaches, even in writing, is not binding. In the OP's case, it is the coach who is telling the athlete he will get a likely letter. While I would assume that is trustworthy, I would still worry if it were my S or D. If the letter doesn't come in October, at least the student can apply elsewhere RD. But the chance for a scholarship might be gone.</p>
<p>I'd like to thank everyone who has posted here as well as those who have sent private messages. I've shared all of this information with DS and he has formulated what seems to be a very solid plan for keeping his secondary options open while pursuing an acceptance at his first choice school.</p>
<p>I'll let everyone know how it turns out.</p>
<p>Thanks again.</p>
<p>Of course the coaches talk to each other. The kids and families talk to each other too. Now days the info is often posted on the danged internet sites for sports as well. I just looked up a friend's son who is verbally committed to BC with ND and UMD as back ups for football. No secrets there at all. He made those commitments and the schools agreed early in Junior year. The kid will be a senior in high school this year. And he's no sure shot in graduating from high school and keeping his nose clean either. I would not bet a dime on it.</p>
<p>That's why I suggested above that the student needs to keep some other irons in the fire until he or she gets the likely letter, including an ED school. (Actually filing an ED application could be very effective. The student can withdraw the ED application before decisions come out if he or she gets a likely letter in the interim. But it's a little bit of a game of Chicken -- if the likely letter doesn't come, the student has a real dilemma about whether to withdraw the ED.)</p>
<p>I really do not suggest playing games with the process. Do as those in your child's sport do. Unless your kid is such a super star that they are fighting over him, he is easily replaceable and fooling around that way can make it so. The only piece of advice I add is to look for a back up/ safety in case all blows up. that takes the help of the kid. Nothing wrong with looking and talking to other coaches but I would not negotiate 2 likely letters or an ED app. You don't know what will happen if you do something like that. There have been early ED responses that can foil timing.</p>
<p>As somebody who was a recruited athlete and had a D who was recruited and son who walked on and competed at my PAC10 alma mater let me offer the following advice.</p>
<p>Nothing is certain I could site example after example. I've seen likely letters just not work out.</p>
<p>Find a safety and get admitted as soon as possible. Apply to a couple of matches. Then go after your reaches.</p>