<p>^^cptofthehouse makes good points about there being no secrets. I was amazed at the information exchanged on Facebook among athletes about where they were planning to sign, which programs they liked, and so on, apparently oblivious to the fact that some of their online "friends" were members of the teams they were talking about. Maintaining the highest level of privacy and honesty in this transaction is key. Good advice for many things in life. Student athletes should refrain from posting their college preferences on their profile pages until they have been admitted :)</p>
<p>Stanford has always made it clear to all that whatever the coaches said are not binding. Only the letter from the Admissions office is binding. Every year many top recruits are rejected by the Admisions office because they didn't meet the academic requirements.</p>
<p>I don't want to hijack the thread, so feel free to PM me. I know that things are different in D-III, but can coaches help to get likely letters in the fall for someone they want? I was assuming we'd be waiting til April like everyone else. S2 knows he won't be recruited D-I or II, but would like to play, which means D-III. Any suggestions on resources/timelines/how to approach an Ivy? (Expect his SAT to be solidly in the 50-75% range for Ivy based on PSAT)</p>
<p>Specific info for football would be great. We haven't submitted info to the clearinghouse yet -- we were planning to wait for fall PSATs. Should he look at taking SATs earlier than March of junior year?</p>
<p>Hi Counting Down,
Ivies are D1 and use the likely letter in the way that other D1's use the letter of intent.<br>
DIIIs don't use likely letters and coaches have varying influence (ranging from zero to a lot) with admissions. If you ask about specific DIII programs, you might find a parent to help you with whether the coach at that particular school was helpful or just encouraging!</p>
<p>Thanks -- S2 and DH are out looking at some schools this week and was wondering if there was anything he ought to do besides drop by, say hello, ask for advice, etc.</p>
<p>OK, I think we all agree that coaches will pressure kids to verbally commit early in the process. I think we also can agree that unless you're a superstar, some if not all coaches will move on down their list if you don't verbally commit by a certain point. So, suppose you make a choice and follow 3xboys leverage suggestion above--you tell your first choice school that they're #1, but you'd like to continue to look around and go on other official visits. Right there I think you could run the risk of causing the coach of the #1 school to reconsider. But, supposing he's OK with that confession, then we're back to parentof2's question: What exactly do you tell the other schools you're only using as leverage? If you tell them they're not your first choice, then the coach is not going to waste a slot on you, and then you lose your back-up option.</p>
<p>I hope the "solution" here is not that you have to lie and tell each of them that they're your first choice, because I don't think that's ethical. Besides, since we've established that coaches may talk to each other (esp. coaches within the same conference), you'd run the risk of being found out anyway, and who knows what could happen then!</p>
<p>Help!!! How does one navigate this in an ethical manner?</p>
<p>The standard answer is ... I am really interested in your school and your program but I am not quite ready to make a decision yet. Possibly followed by: My top schools are yours, his, and that one over there, but I am not sure yet.</p>
<p>Probably the best thing to do is try to figure out YOUR (student athlete's) list as best you can, and then see if you can put them in some sort of rank order. If school number 2 asks for commitment before school 1, you ask #1 where you stand. If #1 is honest and says you are #8 and they have 3 slots, you probably need to move to #2. Etc. It's a tricky dance.</p>
<p>Forgive me, but I can't help but wonder: do you parents of athletes have any perspective on how this all reads to the rest of us?</p>
<p>("How does one navigate this in an ethical manner?" That's a joke, right?)</p>
<p>Sorry, wolrab, but I guess I'm oh so lacking in perspective then, because I fail to see the humor or cause for disdain. The problem did not start with us parents. The NCAA system comes with regulations and timelines designed to keep this fair for all, but unfortunately people always find a way to push the envelope. Read the earlier posts and you will see how schools and coaches are seeking any recruiting advantage they can which makes our position difficult. In particular, they are pressuring athletes to commit well before the specified time period for official visits when decision-making was supposed to occur. </p>
<p>Enlighten us ignorant ones, please.</p>
<p>GFG - Have you read Chris Lincoln's "Playing the Game: Inside Athletic Recruiting in the Ivy League"? It talks a lot about these questions, and could be worth reading before you get further into the process. I think it would confirm your hunch that hesitation might be viewed as a negative unless you're a total superstar. The book gives good insights into the tight spot coaches are in, as well as the dilemmas that face the athletes and their families.</p>
<p>No, I haven't, FauxNom. I did look at the synopsis on amazon and thought it was more of an expose than guidebook for parents, but since others have also recommended it I think I will pick up a copy.</p>
<p>^ It's a helpful, informative book. I'd consider it a must read for recruited athletes and their parents.</p>
<p>I went through this 7 years ago with my oldest. It has gotten a little bit easier and clearer due to the internet. A lot is posted on sites specific to the sport and you can see what others are doing. At the time we were in this "game", we were operating in a black box.</p>
<p>It's all so dependent on which sport we are talking about and which colleges -- and the talent level of your student athlete. When you read some of the basketball and football recruiting stories ... lacrosse was nothing like that.</p>
<p>But it starts earlier and earlier. The Notre Dame lax coach told me about a boy he spotted in 9th grade in a tournament he attended as a favor to a friend. He kept track of the kid and recruited him when the boy became of recruitable age. </p>
<p>From my perspective, a parent of a talented player in a sport that doesn't have a serious professional career on the other side, you can use the sports for a nice admissions boost. You can also use the sports as a serious motivator for your kid. </p>
<p>In a nutshell, when it comes to college search and selection, the athletic recruiting adds another layer. If the sports <em>matters</em> to your kid, enough so that they have the desire to play at D1, you need to start early on looking at schools on both the academic side and the athletic side, build your list early, and be prepared to cross off a school that doesn't have the athletic fit and the academic fit. </p>
<p>If your kid is a focused athlete like mine, fit in both areas is vital.</p>
<p>Just be careful and take a lot of what the coaches say with a grain of salt. Having completed the recruiting process with my S, we learned a lot. Especially with the Ivies, they come on very strong and want an early committment. Since they cannot offer dollars, if they know your child is being recruited by scholarship schools they will move on to the "sure" thing without an early committment--no matter how much they say they want you.</p>
<p>Wolrab: I understand your thoughts, but until you go through this process you really cannot understand all of the components. My son was being recruited for soccer and football, throw in the normal college search process, high school and a 17 year old-it makes for some interesting times. All of the recruiting rules and unkown rules make it confusing given that you are making a super huge decision in a very short period of time under pressure-with lots of opinions.</p>
<p>As for the ethical discussion of being honest with the coaches, I really think that once your kid has his choice narrowed down everything is literally on the dining room table at that point. Dishonestly would really show bad character.</p>
<p>Instead of saying this is my number one school, use different aspects of the prospective schools as reasons that they might be chosen.
For example, my son narrowed down his choices to Cornell, CMU and Fordham.
We were all honest with all of the coaches.
-He liked Fordham because of NYC and the Wall Street connection that the school has.<br>
-CMU is located in his hometown where all of his family lives
-Cornell pretty much had everything he wanted in a school.</p>
<p>Wolrab, the recruiting process is a business negotiation just like any other business negotiation. All that is being discussed here are standard negotiation tactics.</p>
<p>First, I do not hold parents responsible for this very sad state of affairs. That's important to say upfront. Second, I simply see this as yet another manifestation of how upside down our societal priorities are. Third, it disgusts me to see the way athletes are recruited, how much time and money institutions of scholarship and higher learning put into this distraction, this misguided endeavor. Not to mention the lowering of admissions criteria. Simply put, there is a broad based lack of perspective and absence of ethics in the whole system. Period. I mean, I'm all for fitness and sport. I played sports in high school and continue to be physically active. But athletes knowing where they're going to college in July, before others have even filed their applications, just because they're athletes? Gimme a break.</p>
<p>Wow, Wolrab-as the kids say "chillax"-I hear it all of the time :)</p>
<p>I am not sure what your agenda is but you a making sweeping assumptions.
If it is such a "misguided endeavor" why are college student-athletes so highly recruited again for their post undergraduate endeavors?</p>
<p>I am not sure about your "admissions criteria being lowered" comment. From what I have experienced, athletes have to apply just like every other student. Their application might be supported, but the student still has to have the stats. </p>
<p>Non athletes can know where they are going to school in July.</p>
<p>Whoa, Wolrab! Where did you get the idea of the lowering of academic criteria????</p>