I think that on average things might improve a bit as our generation sees the risks with own parents, tries to stay healthy, relocate as needed to ranch, independent living etc. At an individual level we all would LIKE to be financially ready to deal with worst-case situation for self and spouse, but that’s a tall order.
Well, but how?
Financially ready is beyond a tall order for many, if not most. Certainly not possible for us. We have no retirement planning that accounts for $10k+ a month in ALF expenses.
We live in a raised ranch. It could be modified with a ramp or indoor stair mover thingie so that we could still live here. But we are in the boonies. Not helpful if kids were to offer to help; they wouldn’t find work here.
And, I say again, this house, some other property - this was to be the dang inheritance that the 4 kids could sell and split among them. Are we supposed to sell it to afford to live in a nursing home?
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Unfortunately, today the answer is “yes.”
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Well, maybe…. if both of you end up going to nursing home (I think statistically unlikely). There are supposedly some kind of protections for a spouse to stay in home if other assets run dry, though I presume that someday there would be lien on the estate.
Once upon a time we all wondered how we would ever be able to pay to get our kids through college. Most found ways to do it. Alas, no scholarships or FA for nursing homes. Well not until you run out of funds. That happened to my grandfather. My divorced mother, an only child, retired early to care for both of her parents…. and she devoted 8 years to their care, most of the years with one of both of them at at her apartment. No inheritance (though a bit of gift money from the first years). After they died she was able to afford to live independently only by the grace of Section 8 subsidized housing. She did have an old/good LTC policy but ended up not needing it. I lamented her situation, but she never complained. She was just happy that she was able to arrange proper care each parent when they were no longer able to stay at home. (Today possibly there are more services that would have been helpful.)
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The place where my FIL went to rehab a couple times also had a skilled care nursing facility. We would have had to pay two years at full price in order for him to keep a bed there when he qualified for Medicaid. BIL and I had been discussing whether to not to get FIL situated there, as his assets were getting to that tipping point, but he was still living in an apartment independently, with a HHA coming twice a day, four hours total for showering, meals and housecleaning.
As it turned out, a few months later, FIL was in the hospital for a UTI, was released to rehab to regain strength to go home, and he got Covid and passed away.
When your house is both your biggest asset and the place you live in, then selling it to pay for your own care as you age and provide you with a place to live that meets your needs actually makes sense. We are under no obligation to pass our home or for that matter our money on to our children.
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Agreed - there’s no obligation. Doesn’t mean I wouldn’t want to.
And I was lucky enough to enjoy a small inheritance from my mother. It sucks that my kids cannot expect at least the same.
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@somemom there are some areas where there are multiple Hospice agencies - and also perhaps resources from aging public service groups (federally or state funded) and other sources of information - wow on Lewy Body Dementia and the hard time you received on getting Hospice care. Of course and agency is going to have a hard time saying their assessor was ‘wrong’ - they don’t want to change out their way of doing business or the person doing the assessment because that could cause them litigation – you taking them to court for the extra expenses or duress that had put you under.
As the NY Times article showed, you can pay a lot and still not have safe, great care. A memory unit or facility having unlocked outer doors?? Our skilled care and rehab facility only had a patient get out when a family held open a door for residents – and let the individual out! Signs are posted, but there are a lot of non-thinking people walking around…
If a relative can research and line up ‘best care and cost analysis to not run out of money’ - it may take having family leave from a job - but if the parent has assets, parent should be willing to work with children/grandchildren to assist in the process - especially if anyone is local. However, sometimes family dynamics (parents maybe burning their bridges and making it difficult for any family to step up with the job at hand). Also, some older people think they can have what they want, even if the financial numbers and care situations don’t line up - their aging brain, along with their personality, along with being scared and other emotions in the way.
Friend’s father, with his family help, had a handicapped accessible residence and a van where it had the wheelchair ramp - he hired a live in fellow, paid him well - health insurance and all living expenses included. What he paid out of pocket was probably less than what some facility would have charged - and his QOL was as best as it could be based on his limitations from a stroke. His daughter and son lived nearby, dad was 100% mentally competent (high intelligence guy, multiple businesses).
When you have supply/demand issues, higher cost of the service industry, companies (some are vultures) putting on a pretty sales pitch but often a costly ‘deal’.
I will compare this situation to large universities that don’t have enough campus housing beyond freshman year, and there are these apartment complexes that run across the country alongside various universities – DD was paying a bit of a premium 2015 - 2018, but I have seen how these places have gotten to where they add in all kind of charges, as well as charge a really high price for shared apartments (lease and charge with each resident - who typically has their own bedroom and bath, and not allowed to double up in a bedroom). However, the ‘bleeding’ of the students’ parents is only a portion of the ‘bleeding’ on some of these Assisted Living, and gradual level of care complexes with a buy in and monthly charges. Yes, they offer really nice meals - but how much does a senior really eat? And then $12 every time they bring a meal tray to the room?? Some states have better regulations than others on Assisted Living - and honestly, some Assisted Living situations are at a more reasonable cost than when one goes into needing higher level of care.
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If a relative can research and line up ‘best care and cost analysis to not run out of money’
I’m willing to do that - for my father, living with us currently, but also for my husband and I. But how do you even do this? You know how there’s a Medicare/Medicare Advantage sherpa - I wonder if something like this exists for the actual residential care?
Life (and death) are not predictable. Your kids have probably have decent odds that they will have some inheritance, just not a guarantee. If you feel strongly that you’d like them to have some of what your mother passed to you… and it’s affordable to do so… consider gifting them some of it now.
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Haha, I wasn’t clear. The inheritance I’m “enjoying” enables us to pay for college. It’ll be gone in four more years. But yes, worth exploring how to gift before it has to be squandered to some private equity fund masquerading as senior living.
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A friend of mine is living in her elderly mother’s house. Mother is over 100 and in nursing home, paid for by Medicaid. There is a lien on the house but as long as the daughter lives there, it is hers. The lien only results in the government taking back money, if the house is sold. My friend saw an estate planning lawyer who arranged it.
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Well I can’t think of any better gift from you/mom to your kids than college education. Well done. If there is more left over some day, that will be a nice bonus.
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If you die young, your kids stand to inherit more (like your retirement savings). Consider spending their inheritance to provide care for yourself as you age as giving them the gift of having you around in their lives for a longer time.
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My aunt moved into the local nursing home Friday. She could private pay for a year but we don’t expect she’ll live that long. We all kind of expected we’d have some inheritance from her but don’t care. There is a little life insurance.
We’re going through her apartment and seeing what we might want to have. She has just a select few belongings at the nursing home. She is a hoarder. It’s so overwhelming- every available space randomly crammed with furniture, kitchen goods, food, cleaning products, knick knacks, toilet paper packages. We have moved her/cleaned her out multiple times before. This time Mom says she’ll pay for a company to clear and clean. Hoping we can find someone to take it on timely and do it well.
Good that your family has helped out your aunt. Somehow getting moved and home cleaned before didn’t have a change in her behavior. Some people just have some areas of weakness like this, and maybe some depression that has them with no energy to have their home/apartment functioning. Holding onto things, maybe memories of their past, and also becoming reclusive out of embarrassment.
As much as people have relatives that have lived somewhere a long time and have never gone through their stuff, I saw a real eye opening movie - a documentary - about a woman alcoholic, and the film went backwards in time on her life, and also gave a lot of statistics comparing women to men. How alcohol affects women’s deterioration of organs quicker - and so, unless recovery begins sooner, irreparable damage to major organs. She was not able to smell how bad things were in her home (probably for years), and also essentially was starving herself because her body could not digest food/nutrients. Her paid for home - she had no one besides herself step in it for her last 6/7 years, and as a result no repairmen. She had two daughters, and talked to one occasionally, while the younger daughter stepped away from contact because the mother chose alcohol over her and her sister. Due to non-payment of water bill, the city person went to turn off the water and the smell from the home was so bad that they did a ‘welfare check’ and found her dead on her couch - she probably had talked to her older daughter shortly before she died (but the daughter had no idea that her mom was about to die). Her daughters had to have a hazard cleaning service come in, and then the house had to be stripped to the stud walls due to the odors absorbed into the walls/ceiling. Only a few photos were able to be saved out of the house contents. I saw this movie with Amazon Prime. The woman’s name Bette was in the title. Learned some things with the comparison of women and men alcoholics. Her maternal grandmother was an alcoholic, but always functioning.
In my small town, I only knew one mom that was an alcoholic - she drank Vodka all day, and died in her mid to late 40’s. Her husband was a successful businessman, and she died when her daughter was still in high school and son was in college. This was before Betty Ford treatment centers, but in hindsight, based on this documentary, she was probably in worse physical shape at a younger age than the Bette in the movie. Maybe she grew up with a functioning alcoholic parent.
Something to think about, others with worse situations. But hugs to your family while you are supportive with your mom and others to get through this family situation.
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Thanks, she is just wired to love “stuff” and be comforted by having it all around her. She could never use a gift but loved to own them. I can remember her main home from my childhood and think it was more of trinkets, sentimental items, and maximalist/crowded design but in older years has devolved into the absolute hoarding of everyday items.
The nursing home situation is going pretty well. She always wanted to retire in her hometown so she has friends there and staff has been great.
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Another NYT article reprinted in our local paper. Private equity firms figured out how to drain elders’ $$.
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/extra-fees-drive-assisted-living-profits/
Yeah, whenever private equity firms get involved (see, also: college town rental corporations), it is guaranteed to be a soul-sucking drain on ordinary humans for the sole purpose of fattening someone else’s wallet. Not sure how these people sleep at night.
My aunt died this morning. My cousin has been taking care of her for years. She was 95 and still active to a degree (very similar to my dad). She did have short term memory loss from a stroke (although she recovered pretty well). She had a combo of caregivers while at home in addition to my cousin who lives close. She had just moved to assisted living within the last couple months (at her insistence in fact). It’s hard to let loved ones go but I know she and Dad have already gone fishing. And for some weird reason this family all picks late November around Thanksgiving.