<p>Thanks SlitheyTove. Will definitely add Wesleyan to our list - should be close to Yale. BTW isn’t that the school that was featured in the Gatekeepers book ? I should probably get a copy of that from the library. I will look into Rochester as well - I suspect it may be a bit out of the way. Williams was as far as we had planned to drive. We have about 2+ weeks and need to cover Ivys/LACs from Boston to Philadelphia.</p>
<p>dadmm85, yes, Wesleyan is the school in “The Gatekeepers”. </p>
<p>D1 is interested in Rochester, especially once a friend of hers started talking it up. D1’s list should be getting shorter, but now every time that she hears that another senior friend is going to School X, she wants to add X to the list. Also Y, Z, and alpha through omega. :rolleyes: At any rate, common wisdom says that Rochester really really really really likes to see applicants visit, if at all possible (though many people of course are admitted without visiting beforehand). If it’s going to be a serious contender for your son, you might want to extend your travel plans. It is indeed out of the way.</p>
<p>Thanks SlitheyTove. We sort have the opposite problem - DS wants to put in the minimum effort in the apps. process and therefore wants to keep his list short. His original goal was large schools with great football programs - he has sort of grown out of that. Despite being really good in science he has virtually eliminated Caltech, Harvey Mudd and MIT because they are too “nerdy”. He was ( and I still think is) hung up on Columbia, but after finding out about their core program is having second thoughts ( in his inimitable style he does not consider humanities courses “legitimate” as he thinks the grading is completely subjective). So my goal at this point is to simply widen his options a bit and let him decide at the end of summer. We do have the UCs as a clear option - Berkeley in particular, but here again he wants to go somewhere further away than the Bay area where we live !</p>
<p>Hi Peeps</p>
<p>Well we did a quick tour through 4 schools in a week</p>
<p>… Had a great time and learned alot…we did 7 last spring.</p>
<p>I saw a big change in our student between last yrs trip and this yrs trip…in thinking about what wasa “fit” and so on…
.Last year the first schools were about getting through the shock of what the whole college campus might feel like and what is a fit urban/vs rural etc…</p>
<p>This time while our student still felt a bit selfconscious of not “being” a student at each school and just being a “visitor”, our student tried to "try-on how it would feel if that campus was "home.</p>
<p>ACT is next weekend so thankful we are “off” today.</p>
<p>dadmm85, i’ve only recently heard about hooks when applying for college, so I’m thinking an anti-hook is not a good thing, but what is wrong with being asian? Is that because each college has a ethnic quota or something?</p>
<p>KatCh614 - I realize I opened a can of worms. The subject of Asians has been debated quite extensively in several CC threads, but there is a very good book by Dan Golden called the “Price of Admissions” which covers this whole topic along with several other controversial issues such as legacy admissions etc. quite well. I found this thread on the web covers some of the material from the book - do keep in mind that the site of course has their own political axe to grind. [The</a> New Jews? | The Weekly Standard](<a href=“http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/463ufyzo.asp]The”>http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/463ufyzo.asp)</p>
<p>But politics aside there is the practical matter that Asians on the whole probably have to jump through higher hoops to make the cut at Ivy league schools in particular. The notion of a “hook” is really having some special talent that the school finds highly desirable so they can overlook any weaknesses in your profile. Writing a research science paper or having ECs that reflect genuine involvement in your community are instances of hooks - along with the usual ones such as having parents/relatives who have contributed to the school, being an URM (under-represented minority etc.), an outstanding athlete …
Personally I don’t have a problem with the Ivys doing what they have to. The colleges try and pull a class together … they don’t necessarily want a class full of valedictorians etc. They need their rich donors to keep contributing so they can fund their research work and scholarships. </p>
<p>In the context of my son, originally he was quite enamoured by the Ivys. He is a pretty good kid with excellent academics, but other than his speech and debate really does not have any “hooks” so as to speak. So I have been slowly trying to widen his horizon in terms of other options (such as non Ivy LACs). Lets face it even without the “Asian” factor it is probably a good strategy to look at LACs because the odds are really so low at these ivys for anyone, given that they are so oversubscribed.</p>
<p>I wish my son wasn’t so enamoured with the Ivys, dadmm85. He keeps thinking the better the college name, the better the chance of getting into med school. The acceptance rates at the Ivys for Fall 2010 are really depressing/discouraging. As for hooks, well, mine hasn’t done much community service or won very many awards outside of varsity fencing. The fencing might have to be a hook, but I’m not even sure how impressive that would be. He is the volunteer assistance coach for the girls fencing team and just recently applied for a summer internship at a hospital, but that’s the extend of it.</p>
<p>^^ I have a friend who’s DH is a very successful surgeon–he applied to one great private…got in…
and then applied to one medical school. </p>
<p>Believe me when I tell you–If you met him he would say some of the most unimpressive coddled MDs have come from some of the biggest “name” schools…that may sound like a generalization but its been his experience and he has worked with some pretty great and pretty poor surgeons…
Your student needs to be at the top of the class at a great school–not necessarily a big “name” school
and then has to work the hardests and do the most while in schoool and at the hopsitals…putting in the hours and really digging in…</p>
<p>Do you know any MDs that could counsel your student. Especially with changing times, medicine is going to experience some radical changes in the coming years.</p>
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</p>
<p>My doctor’s son didn’t get any As in high school. He got Bs and Cs and that is all his parents thought he was capable of. He went to community college for two years because he did not get into the mid-tier state school that he wanted to go to. It was at that point that the kid announced that he wanted to be a doctor. The parents thought “sure, good luck.” He got great grades at his CC, transfered to a mid-tier state U and got great grades, and is now a third year med student.</p>
<p>There are many paths.</p>
<p>Just piping in to agree with the posts that favor re-taking the SAT, which may help kids who have reaches on their college list, or would qualify for merit aid. Higher scores do give the edge in a very competitive pool, especially for the unhooked student. At S1 & S2’s HS, the GCs gently urge students to re-take tests in fall of senior year, having seen marked improvements with an extra semester of APs under their belts and added maturity, stamina, and…motivation. </p>
<p>With S1, I made the mistake of telling him if he got above a 2100 the first time, he wouldn’t need to retake. So he celebrated his good SAT score from the first take. However, with the gentle nudge from the GC, S1 took the SAT again in Oct senior year. His score improved over 100 points. I think his new score made a marked difference in the merit awards he received, but that’s just guessing. In our house, S2 knew he was gonna take the SAT at least twice, and it set his expectations. He also did well on the first SAT, but with so much at stake, one or two more tests just are part of the commitment. </p>
<p>Boy have I changed. LOL.</p>
<p>I also meant to say, it is best to look at each college’s accepted student SAT range and pay attention to the number that represents the top 25%. If your unhooked student falls above the top 25% they are a match. I may sound cynical, but I’ve seen a lot of disappointed kids over the years who fall well within the middle of the accepted scores. So many great applicants with hooks out there, and so few open spots.</p>
<p>If you haven’t already done so, go to the Colleges forum and take a look at the Class of '14 RD acceptances/rejections threads for any schools in which your student is interested. It’s a huge dose of realism. I just looked at Rice - all kinds of 34-35 ACT/3.9 - 4.0 students rejected or waitlisted.</p>
<p>
Even what you describe as cynicism may be too optimistic at the elite U.S. universities. I personally have a perfect SAT score and would never consider myself a match at HYPS or any other T10 school for that matter. At these colleges, the applicant pools are so competitive that a class of students with nearly the exact same credentials as the accepted students can constructed from the group of rejected students.</p>
<p>Right, Jersey13. I was not speaking about HYPS, which are, as you say, able to select a class made up of all 2400s if they wished to. You’ll note, however, they don’t do that as they build a class to satisfy other institutional priorities. They need a football team. They need new buildings on campus and endowed chairs. They need the next great architect, poet, broadcast journalist, entrepreneur. They need a diverse student body and a fairly equal gender split. This is a good thing for most of us (if not for Jersey13–our shining 2400!, but I feel certain you will do amazingly well).</p>
<p>I would also consider a match very different from a safety. A match just means that on paper you fit well into their selected students. But I am sorta the Pollyanna type. :)</p>
<p>It would be difficult for HYPS to select a class made up of all 2400s, as they admit 1500+ freshmen each, but last year there were only about 250 2400s. So there is still hope for 2390s and 2380s. LOL.</p>
<p>Talked to D after school today about whether or not she should retake the SAT. We decided that since she’s already signed up to take the ACT at the end of this month, we’ll see what her scores are from that, and if she needs to, she can retake the SAT in the fall.</p>
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<p>This month’s ACT is this coming Saturday.</p>
<p>keylimepie–I agree. 
However, somewhere around cc I’ve seen a larger number of students who super-scored 2400. Or maybe the fumes of lost dreams have just gotten the best of me and I’m woozy.</p>
<p>My 2011 son scored 31 on the ACT as a sophomore and figured he was done. I insisted he take it one more time this year because he took it without writing and needs with writing for an in-state scholarship. He finally agreed to take it in June. I wish I could get him to consider out of state schools. He only wants to go to Purdue. I should be happy but I’m not convinced it’s the best place for him to study computer game design (what he says he wants to study) AND he would have been eligible for free tuition if he’d been able to keep a 3.8 unweighted core GPA through the end of this year but he just hasn’t been motivated. I think he’s going to miss it by .1 or .2. UGH! Now if I could just get him to consider IU, another state school with big merit aid that is a little easier to get. They’ve got computer science, too… It’s too bad he hasn’t been motivated this semester because he could have been guaranteed the Purdue scholarship and admission by August and not even had to think about it during senior year. Oh well…</p>
<p>I am pleased to announce that LuckyBoy has started prepping for the May 1 SAT!!! :D</p>
<p>He’s using the College Board 10 SAT test book, going through the “Xiggi” method (as explained in the SAT prep forum here on CC). Basically he answered the first test without time considerations and with checking explanations for the ones he got wrong. He’ll do at least one more test the same way, then transition to timed sections, then to timed full tests--------------each time checking wrong answers to make sure he really understands the correct answers. I’m hopeful that he’ll get a lot of prep done while on spring break, because once back at school AP review will take over :eek:</p>
<p>He came up with a target M+CR value, so we’ll see how close he gets. State Flagship is the top contender for his interest right now (has the perfect interdisciplinary major w/ research opportunities as an undergrad; he’d be an auto-admit; and compared to current-year seniors, he’d most likely receive some very nice merit money), though Brown keeps popping up in conversation. He’d love to be “one and done” with the SATs, though!</p>