Yeah. I don’t disagree but we’ve made our decision. Actually, President Rose is having a townhall call with each grade separately next week. The sophomores’ call is on Tuesday. I expect that he will put the fear of God in them and say he does not want any virus spikes as a result of Bowdoin students in Maine and off campus. What I would love is for them to offer these kids a test upon arrival in Maine but I’m not sure they’ll go that far.
- This is totally going to vary by school and even by kid. The reason UChicago decided to invite everyone back is that they believe in-person collaboration greatly enhances the academic experience. Even if most courses are online, you still will have more chances for person-to-person meetings than remaining off campus and at your parents' house. John Boyer, dean of the College, said it best at the webinar for families last month - see his words below. The university's epidemiologist also explained that finding ways to work around Covid in order to get back to doing what you want and should be doing (in this case, being back on campus for work and school) was far better than remaining at home waiting for a treatment or vaccine. Finally, by returning to campus for the year, one will be there as the campus continues to open up. No one will be left out or excluded.
"Our former president, Robert Hutchins, once said ‘What education can do, and perhaps all that it can do, is produce a trained mind. Getting a trained mind is hard work. The best practical education is in some ways the most theoretical one.’ Yet a trained mind comes from many public and collective practices between students and between students and faculty. Communication and collaboration are thus key features of our institutional culture. Such training comes in the interactions among and between us as much as by individual study. Indeed, the very nature of our community is inherently collaborative and not isolated and insular. That is why we decided with great deliberation that we should open the college to all students who wish to return to Hyde Park rather than to exclude some in favor of others.
We acknowledge that some students may decide to remain or may have to remain in their home communities for a variety of reasons. Most of our courses will have remote capabilities so will enable students to enjoy a rich and stimulating experience in that mode. But we also think that the return to Chicago is to return to a host of community resources and stimulating and intellectual friendships in support of a magnificent level of education. It is to return to a community in which, as Hutchins once put it, the air is electric. It introduces students in powerful ways to the challenges of intellectual partnerships and gives them a common and shared vocabulary of ideas and ideals.
It was an ancient Greek ideal that the city (polis), and only “the city,” can educate women and men to live full and enriching lives, lives defined by excellence and intellectual independence. Our university is such a polis, a formative intellectual community of friends set up in the home of the metropolis of the city of Chicago itself. We very much hope to welcome as many as of you as possible home, home to Chicago in the coming academic year."
By the way, add Cornell to the list of universities bucking the trend and returning everyone back to campus (at least as of July. Haven’t checked recently). Their own study concluded that an aggressive method of testing and contact tracing would actually result in less infection among its student population than making them stay at home.
I just happen to be married to one of those experts, who is part of the team who is tasked in developing such plans for her own university, and other universities in our state. She does not believe that these types of practices will be enough to keep a major outbreak from occurring at urban universities, such as U Chicago.
Yeah, this is a good point. So much second guessing (not talking about here, other social media) by parents when the admins making the decisions are using world leaders in the field to advise.
I do agree with that but then we still have some pretty different plans from elite schools. Why is Bates going back but not Bowdoin? Why BC and not Harvard and MIT? At some point, it’s about if the school can afford giving up all room and board.
- Minnesota, correct - or am I misremembering? And what sorts of decisions are being made for this fall at those universities?
- This is a really good question. Not sure I agree with this seemingly obvious answer. From what I can gather, a lot has to do with the philosophy of undergraduate education, size, on-campus residential living, preference of faculty for remote or in-person teaching (or even differing mandates about this from schools), and of course locale. Some schools are just more able to adapt to a Covid environment than others. Also, nothing has probably been set in stone yet (as we've seen with Duke and Penn) and some schools have opted to add stricter protocols as they've moved along whether in response to changing virus counts or concerned parents - or both.
Could be wrong but IMO a school’s response to this pandemic reflects its unique philosophy, attitudes, hopes and expectations. I think it’s also sizable evidence for how schools can be “different” from one another and how “fit” matters when one is choosing a school. It’s an example of an intangible that isn’t usually captured in a normal admission year.
I want to believe it’s a more nuanced decision and, in some cases I think that’s true. But Bowdoin having a different plan than Bates and Colby can’t really be explained by a difference in philosophy. Those NESCACs pretty much have the same philosophy. And those three are really close geographically and in the same state so dealing with the same governor. Maybe their towns feel differently about having all students back. Not sure. Bowdoin’s president is tight with Harvard so that might have something to do with his decision. Prior to taking this job, he taught at HBS. He’s also on the board at the Howard Hughes Medical Institute and that could have informed his choice as well. So, perhaps the “philosophy” of the president of a college does come into play. He chose this very conservative plan when it wasn’t even one of the options that the committee presented to him.
^ @homerdog you might be on to something, there. Meant to add earlier that MIT also following Harvard’s plan might have to do with peer influence. Harvard was also the first school to shut down last spring (and did so fairly suddenly, shocking a lot of students). Anecdotally, it’s chosen a very conservative path throughout and has had very specific messaging. Have other leaders/schools been influenced by Harvard’s lead? We can’t rule that out.
I tell people I’m starting a pool betting on how soon UofSC has to end all F2F activities and close dorms. S19 says I’m being too negative…
@SammoJ well if they aren’t testing much then they won’t find much virus. Magic!
Not Minnesota, and the decisions at her university are not much better. The plans are somewhat similar, though her university is hiring contact tracers, and, as a public college they have more leeway to make more demands on the students to comply to more serious restriction. They also intend to hire contact tracers and have continuous symptom monitoring and testing. At least the university has a very well set up testing system of their own, so that they can perform massive and frequent testing of students.
However the experts are none too happy with the plans. That is why I wrote the same about U Chicago.
While it is true that the city in neither as large as Chicago, nor is the campus area nearly as densely populated as Hyde Park (density of her college is less than 1/2 that of U Chicago, and the city is only 1/4 as dense as Hyde Park). The administration also has less of an expectation of compliance on part of students. However, the student population is large enough that even a small percent who misbehave are enough students to start an outbreak.
Magical thinking is fully apparent here as well.
I am sure that the people who provided the science and analyses behind U Chicago’s decisions are none too happy with the administrator’s decisions as well. The problem is that the experts cannot really come forward and tell parents “DON’T BELIEVE THEM, EVERYBODY’S GOING TO DIE!!!”.
Of course, being a public university, on one hand, the university is open to pressure from the parents (parents pressure elected officials who pressure the university). However, the university also has less liability, since it is public and shares liability with the state, especially if they are following state guidelines, and being pressured by the state.
I think that their calculations are that, since COVID 19 is not really dangerous for undergraduates (they are more likely to suffer harm from on-campus drinking than from COVID 19), even having an outbreak won’t be a big problem, and if it gets too big, they’ll send the students home.
On the other hand, there could be loss of life among faculty and staff.
In all honesty, one of the reasons we are happy that our kid is going to be on campus at Midd is that it’s better there than here, and it’s just going to get worse here
However, my fondest wish is that, this coming December, you will be able to respond to me with “Hah! I told you that everything would be OK”.
I REALLY don’t want to be right.
@MWolf so what is Middlebury’s plan? When does your D go back?
Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere but Johns Hopkins has reversed course and decided to go completely online and will give a 10 percent discount on fall semester tuition:
https://covidinfo.jhu.edu/university-messages-and-announcements/changes-to-plans-for-fall-semester/
Princeton also reversed and is going fully remote with no undergrads on campus this fall.
Haverford continues to insist their in-person fall will be safe, with ever increasingly warming tones. Their newest correspondence goes as far as to say that even students living off campus must wear masks in their apartments when not alone except for eating, showering, sleeping, and teeth brushing. They’ve also said no to pods and friend groups and have said they will go to all-remote classes if isolation spaces have an increase for a straight week. They also lowered gatherings from 25 to 15 (with masks and 6 ft between people) in the outdoor tents. My daughter is more glad with each further correspondence that she wasn’t able to find an off campus lease.
Quarantine at home for two weeks, staggered arrival at campus. Everybody is tested as soon as they arrive, and is confined to room (food is delivered to room) except for bathroom until there is a negative result. Then Phase I.
There is a second test, 7 days later. If a student cannot quarantine at home, or flies into campus, they are confined to their room until the second test comes back negative.
It is pretty involved, but it includes face masks when anywhere but private spaces and their own residence halls, daily symptom check, including taking their own temperature, contact journal, confined to campus, and more.
Phase II and Phase III relax some restrictions.
High levels of health monitoring, contact tracing, easy access to testing, a small population in a rural setting, in a state with extremely low levels of COVID 19, face covering, and social distancing. It will likely work, so long as cases remain low in Vermont, and students mostly follow the rules.
https://www.middlebury.edu/office/midd2021/return-campus-guide
S19 took his Covid test on Monday and sent it back UPS. He should get results by tomorrow and we head to Nashville on Saturday. We have most things set for his apartment, although he’ll need to find a sofa in Nashville since we won’t have room to haul one with all the other stuff. His roommate is flying in from CA on Saturday as well. I know they are very much looking forward to being back together.
S19 is a leader in Vandy’s freshmen orientation program and was assigned 16 students. He has had phone calls with each student to answer questions and get to know them a little. He’ll be having weekly meetings with them and trying to plan fun activities (hopefully meet outdoors in small groups) to get them connected with each other. I know he enjoyed that program last year, and I feel the role of the leaders will be much more important this year.
D17 flew to Laguardia this morning and is en route by Lyft and then the train to her college. Had her covid test 7 days ago and then was mostly isolated in the meantime. She’ll have two more tests in the next 14 days. Hoping for the best!
I think D19 got her COVID test results back a day after they received her sample. I was surprised at how quick it was.
Have a safe trip to Nashville! D19 will arrive in Nashville for move-in later on next week. She is looking forward to returning. It has been so nice having her home–I’m really going to miss her…but I am glad that she has the opportunity to return for classes. Hopefully the COVID protocols being implemented will allow the kids to complete the semester without having to go completely remote. I have my doubts, but am hoping for the best. On paper, the COVID plan looks comprehensive and well-thought out, but of course it requires the students to be very good at complying with the rules and procedures…so we shall see…
S19 is moved in to campus apartment. Nicer place than my first post-college apartment. Roommates seem nice, now just hope they stay safe.