I am not familiar with what happened on other college campuses in California, so I am not able to comment on that. I can say that I saw many references to Santa Clara County (which is where Stanford is located) being one of the first counties in the nation to institute “shelter in place” and having aggressive COVID policies.
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Ugh ugh ugh, I know we are all doing right by our kids, doing the research, trying to keep costs down, if applicable - yesterday I was talking with an acquaintance and updating her on my kid’s college process and I mentioned how important budget was to us, how student loans were in the mix but nothing more than that - and she was telling me about a friend’s kid who has NINETY THOUSAND DOLLARS in student loans from freaking Montclair State.
There should be a law. Or barriers. Or something. And yes, I know there is an education module you have to complete before the $5,500 student loan is disbursed, but clearly a parent is co-signing for way way more in this instance. That kid is so screwed.
Generally speaking, those of us who have the time and resources to do this research are the ones who need the benefits of scholarships and financial aid least, to be blunt. No, I’m not saying we don’t need every bit of help we can manage. But there’s a whole subset of the population that hears “you have to go to college” and does not have the time or background to do more than get the acceptance squared away, and colleges absolutely are preying on this level of student/parent, and it should not be allowed.
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And those are the ones who end up with college having a negative net ROI, which feeds into the idea that college isn’t worth it, which then also results in people having less trust in colleges as institutions, which results in lower government support for colleges (which affects public colleges directly, but also affects private ones), which results in an increased cost to attend college, which makes the ROI even worse for those who aren’t in positions of privilege. Rinse and repeat.
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I know many people putting their kids in $100000 debt for mediocre college degrees, or because they want to have a school to brag about. Look at the money people are willing to finance for a “brand name” school just here. I get so much flack, as do my kids at their high school for our college choices. My oldest was made fun of and switched to another college and had to take on a little more debt because of it. I am still so angry over it. College counselors could care less if you can pay for college, it is all about the HS marketing. The whole business is a racket and predatory. My middle two will have no debt after leaving college but have had to put up with people making negative comments about their choices. I am a little more concerned about my 23, but I am trying.
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You mean putting themselves in debt, right?
I agree, it is insane. I would also agree that based on my very unscientific observation that the majority of parents are clueless about college admissions. Many feel the need to keep up with the Jones’ and still many others believe that a college degree at any cost is better than no degree at all.
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This is a tough subject in our house, S23 got Florida Prepaid and 100% bright future, this means college is Free in Florida (UF apply) UCF already accepted. He wants to go to his dream school Duke. All we can do is supporting and hope he makes the best decision for his future.
Yes, many parents and students are not well educated when it comes to financing college costs. My kids know our budget and our expectation that they will take out student loans to the max allowed (about $5500-$7000 per year) if needed. The general rule is that students should not leave college with more debt than their 1st year salary so we feel keeping it under $30K is realistic, even if they don’t get a job in their field.
Since this is our final rodeo, I would really love to volunteer my time to help other families with their search. I’d have no agenda other than “paying it forward” and helping those who may not be familiar with the process to target school within their budget or navigate a complex process with deadlines and checklists. I’m hardly a professional but I have learned a ton along the way and feel like an expert in some areas. It drives me crazy when people talk about budget and some respond “well, there is always your state school option” but that is often out of reach for some families, even if their student commutes. So we have a lot of assumptions about affordability but that can be very different for each family. Even “well off” families struggle if they have 4 or 5 kids to put through college. That is ALOT to save or borrow, even with big merit scholarships. We had the intention of saving more for college for both kids, but my husband had an accident when my son was a baby and we had to reassess priorities with our money and then we needed a new roof, etc.-so never really got back on track. Things happen that aren’t always predictable. So now we adapt & chase merit.
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Have him watch Gran Turino to understand Hmong. As for USSR, I’m sure others are no longer on the drop down as well. Assuming closest to USSR was Ukraine or Russia and they were most likely on the drop down, unless Russia drop down is on the sanctioned list :).
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Well, it boils down to if you are comfortable paying whatever your EFC is for that school or not. And of course, getting into Duke is not easy.
I suppose one could make the argument that a top school like Duke is worth the money. I do not know what the answer is to that. I think if grad school is in the plans then that almost always makes a bigger difference than where you got your undergrad.
There is a show on Netflix about financial trainwrecks getting coaches to sort things out. There is a woman on there who took on a lot of debt. One of her quips was something along the lines of who the heck thought it was a great idea to let a 17 year old kid take out $50K in loans? I agree 100%.
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I’ve helped one friend through the process, from FAFSA thru state grants and applying to college, and it was really rewarding.
Another family asked me for help but backed away really quickly when I started asking questions about money. Like, they didn’t want to talk about it at all. I guess it seemed too personal?
I haven’t pushed. I know the family in a superficial way - they seem to be of modest means, middle-class, and basically work as a rental property manager and run an online handmade products “store” - and I see on Facebook they’re taking their kid to the local state school directionals.
Which are still over $20k with room and board in PA.
And they have a kid behind this one. So I dunno. After the student loan, closing the gap is $15k and it has to come from somewhere, and PA state schools give very very little financial aid to in-state kids.
But I can’t force people to listen to me.
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Did the parents attend college? Because I know families like the one you described. Parents did not attend college but do ok. They think their kids need a degree to do better. They are typically the ones that are ok with a $50K debt to send their children to say XX State to study a non-directional major. And in many cases, the kids are not mature enough to survive in college.
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Did you son have hooks? And could you share his stats, please? Would be so helpful!
I shared his stats in this great thread with a lot of details from each applicant.
Hook = URM, with high stats.
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I feel like I’m shouting into the wind when I hear GCs, parents, and kids pick schools solely based on where they want to go, and the only thought they give to finances is “apply for financial aid” and they don’t look beyond that.
I know a dozen families who have no idea that their total cost could be wildly different depending on where they apply; they are operating under this vague notion that liberal arts colleges cost $X and their State U costs $Y and that’s it.
So their kids are picking LACs out of books based on random criteria such as “it’s close to NYC” and none of them are realizing that this LAC vs that LAC may offer them a better or worse merit or need package. And these aren’t parents who are full pay - but they and their kids just think “this is what LACs cost” because they don’t know any differently.
Or I know another family where their graduate went to our State U, and they’ve moved back home because they incurred $85k in debt for their undergrad degree. (Gulp). They’re now thinking about going to grad school (more debt) as they can’t find a job that will enable them to pay off their undergrad debt. Yet we live in a state where there are free associate degrees with transfer options, in a city where there are so many options for inexpensive credits. But this student blindly went to the State U, simply thinking: “well, this is what college costs.”
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So I was reading on a university parent page how many of the kids there did not get courses they needed for next semester. It sounds like its creating major havoc.
The parent fb pages might be good for something.
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This is one of the main reasons I will (after the musical) resume hectoring the kid about honors college applications. Priority registration is a real boon in most cases, and while it might not matter at smaller schools, it is a huge problem at some larger schools.
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Not sure I understand…. Once the School report and LORs are loaded to the Common app, they are available for all submitted, pending and any new applications. Only the 1st deadline is at the mercy of the school and teachers -unless you add recommenders along the way.
My girls requested LORs midway thru Jr and supplied their recommenders with resume, Brag sheet and unique questionnaires requested - all by the end of June. It still took right up to the wire. It’s hard, but need to trust they know what they are doing. - especially for experienced teachers and GC.
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My daughter got a 34 on her first ACT. I thought she was nuts that she wanted to take it again because she thought she could get one more point. She took it again. Did the practice test the night before on ACT’s website. She got a 36 on the second test. If she wants to do it let her go for it!
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NJ is very difficult to go for free. Our NJ kid is at UCF because it was 18K less per year than Rutgers. Son’s roommates go for free and it is wonderful. Hope he makes the best choice for his future.
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I know a kid with 200k in debt from a bachelors degree. I’ve helped several friends’ kids with college apps and budget needs to be the very first thing determined.
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