But she loves stats…. That’s why the question. I hate math and never went beyond Algebra 2 and college Algebra lol.
Here’s a current thread asking the same question:
ETA: If the $100k is ‘available’ but it is part of your retirement, sounds like you’d be borrowing from yourself. The question is one only you can answer…can you spend those funds earmarked for retirement for education and still be confident of your retirement plans?
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One of my best friends was a math major at a SUNY. She is now working for the largest wine/liquor distribution company in the world doing some sort of math thing LOL. She is making BANK! Colgate is such a lovely school. We go every summer for a swim meet. We just love the little town and the surrounding area. Best farmers market on Saturdays.
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Go back to Dartmouth with the competing aid offers from other schools. They might match.
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Congratulations on your son getting into Dartmouth!
I had a similar choice with my DS and it may be applicable. At the very beginning of the application process, we had enough for him to go to our state university. I was firm in that he’d go to our state university or if he got into a T20, we’d stretch to pay for that extra amount. I did not put any conditions on a specific major. We could afford it. That’s why we were comfortable having him ED to UChicago and he got accepted. Ultimately it was his choice (but I set the initial guidance).
For your situation, it very much depends on can you afford it. Like others have said, if you need to borrow, I would strongly advise against it. If you have access to the funds and can afford it, let your son decide. It is no longer about acceptance rates or prestige. It’s about fit and where he’ll thrive. Optimally, it would have been better had you communicated these conditions(using NPC) prior to submitting applications, but what is done is done.
Congratulations again. Dartmouth is an awesome school, and if he wants to get into finance, it has a very strong program for it.
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You may want to go back to Dartmouth and see if they will increase your aid. I’m a little surprised that an Ivy was less generous than your other options - they are typically at the top when it comes to aid (unless you are talking about merit). If not, I’d think hard about spending an additional $100k on one child if you won’t be able to offer the other 3 the same kind of budget - it can create resentment. Regardless, it sounds like your son has wonderful choices so congratulations!
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To me, this and the fact that the extra $100K would be coming out of money that is earmarked for your retirement make it very risky.
If kid 2 gets into, say, Duke, are you going to do the same thing, or will you say Duke isn’t worth the money that Dartmouth was? Then, say kid three isn’t an academic, but gets into a great art school that costs $100,000 more than you have allocated, does he also get the extra money? And then, kid 4 doesn’t get in anywhere particularly “special“ but the school he really loves is quite a bit more than you have saved, and you’ve paid extra for the other kids, can you tell him no?
I understand that what each of our kids needs is not exactly the same, but I think if you pull $100,000 out of your retirement savings for the first kid to go to college, you have to decide now how that is going to affect and interact with the decisions you make for the next three kids.
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My D21 at Miami of Ohio was deciding between a Math major and Data Science and Statistics major. She chose Data Science and Statistics as she felt the upper level math classes would be too theoretical for her. She hoping to become and actuary.
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What reasons did your son have for applying to Dartmouth? Did he do research on all these schools and decide that Dartmouth was a great fit because of…
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I was a math major decades ago at WPI.
==>> Highly recommend the she takes at least 2 computer science/coding classes, which will help open doors for her/gives her options.
WPI required computer science classes for math major (for most majors), so when I graduated (with Actuarial Science degree, but couldn’t pass the exams), I launched my math+C/S skills at engineering departments.
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I don’t think high school (non-calculus) stats has much to do with the material covered in either math or statistics majors in college. The question will be how much she enjoys higher level math (eg proofs). My S23 is doing AP Stats this year after Calc BC last year and says it’s all very simple. That’s reflected in the fact that colleges generally don’t give math credit for AP Stats and the credit they do give is typically 3 semester credits vs 8 for Calc BC.
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She did AP Calc covid year all online with a class that met by zoom once a week. Transferred to BS and tested into Calc BC but didn’t feel prepared since her first class was basically self taught. She is finding APstats super easy while others in her class are struggling.
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No one knows your financial situation. I would be concerned about the “4 kids close in age”. College prices are increasing every year. Do you have the money already set aside for all 4 kids to have the same/similar amount for school? I am asking because it is difficult to continue to save for the younger children when cash flowing tuition and expenses. It is also difficult to justify why 1 was worth going significantly over budget but the other 3 are not. That is a recipe for resentment. Does paying $100,000 more for this child jeopardize the college savings and/or household spending for your other children?
We found it was expensive to launch our kids for school. There will be transportation, orientations, extra fees, move in costs, and parents weekends that eat into savings/income. We only attended events freshman year and senior year because of budget issues, many other families like to attend many events/activities. With each of our older 2 we budgeted about $5,000 a year over the quoted amounts for extras and fees. Some years it was all gone, other years we didn’t need nearly that much. We are fortunate to live way beneath our means. We are far, far from high earners but we are big savers. Our older 2 both came in way under their budgeted amount but we were still surprised at how much our ability to save for our youngest took a hit. She was just beginning jr. high when oldest went so we figured we had lots of time to continue to save for her school. We did but it was challenging. High school expenses are high (yearbook, prom, activities fees, etc…), college search and application expenses are high (visits, app fees), and college launching is expensive.
We “could” have stretched and spent an extra $100,000 for one. We certainly could NOT have stretched and found an extra $300,000+ above and beyond our college funds for 3 - let alone your 4. College costs skyrocketed over the years between our first applying and now our last. Scholarship amounts have decreased during this same time frame. We were not willing to sacrifice the future of our 2nd and 3rd so that our first could chase prestige. We were not willing to sacrifice their sibling relationships going forward by going all in on #1, leaving fewer choices for the others. Every family has to figure out what they value and every family has different financial situations.
What does Dartmouth have that is worth that sacrifice? Will the degree be $100,000 more valuable than a degree from the #2 school? Will your 4 kids be willing and able to support you in retirement in the event that you can’t recoup the hit to your retirement savings?
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Is her loving stats correlated with it being “super easy” compared to Calc? Just be aware that none of it will be easy in college.
My D18 thought she might do a math minor or double major, alongside her ballet BFA, but the first semester Honors Calc 3 course quickly made her change her mind (despite a 5 in Calc BC). I think my S23 is more likely to stick with astrophysics, but that’s at least partly because his dislike of writing essays is far stronger than the pain of struggling with math and physics problem sets.
Don’t know the answer to this, but probably less of an issue at CSS schools. Also, unlikely to matter if you don’t qualify for a Pell Grant now, and she attends a non-meets full need school. You could run NPCs with a different number of dependents and/or different number of kids in college (not sure that’s an issue for you?) to see how it changes the estimated costs.
I get all of this…anxiety in the face of uncertainty is normal, and GPA requirements to retain merit are a definite consideration. Hopefully the requirements at some of her schools are attainable even with a science major. And once your D finds what she likes to study, she is likely to get the grades needed to keep her merit.
Which of her choices is she leaning towards? Did she just put in an app at SUNY ESF? Many of the additional suggestions that posters identified could still work too.
I always say everyone’s situation is different. The chances a T20 degree is better(more valuable) than say a T80 degree are probably slim. I say this because kids that will do amazing things to earn more money will probably do them anywhere. T20 schools can be a springboard to certain things, but not every student utilizes the reputation.
You probably should ask yourself what other items would you spend that $100K on.
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Math in general has always been super easy and intuitive. So no. I just think she likes stats. She was counting in her head and then telling me how many there were of things while still in diapers and adding with carrying in her head before kindergarten, she often just knows how to do things she has never been taught. She is at a top boarding school, so I am not worried about her not being prepared or expecting it to be easy.
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I just found out DD’s Stats teacher (who is really young)went to Colgate and she is going to talk to her. This will be super helpful.
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I can’t speak to relative strengths of math/applied math/stats offerings at Pitt vs Colgate, but these are such different schools and offer different experiences. Has she visited these schools (and Hamilton as well)? Colgate is a definite fit school, especially for gals it can be tough socially, and the campus is quite remote. I will page @homerdog for more insights.
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First of all, anyone who knows me at all on these fora knows what my response will be, and will yawn through it because it’s so predictable: Nope. Nopety-nope-nope-nope. Not even close. Take the money and run.
But a bit more background and explanation: First of all, there’s some solid research out there finding that if a kid is good enough to get into an Ivy (or a similarly situated college),* then the kid will be just as successful after college whether they go to the Ivy or not. Basically, it’s the quality of the student, not the prestige of the university** that predicts success.
*Research also suggests that a kid being self-confident enough to even just apply to such a college predicts future success regardless of admission status. I’m not 100% certain if this will hold up in an era of ever-wider applicant pools, though—but that’s not at issue here.
**The investment banking sector aside—though there’s anecdotal evidence that that’s changing to match everything else.
Which means that if your son got into Dartmouth, he doesn’t need to go to Dartmouth to have the same shot at lifetime success that an Ivy is alleged to provide.
In addition, it’s important to look at fields of interest than the college as a whole. You list, as possible majors: geography, linguistics, economics, physics, environmental science. This is a wide range (though not as disparate as it looks at first glance). I can only speak with any expertise about linguistics (being a linguistics professor, one with an undergrad degree from a state flagship and a doctorate from an Ivy), but the Ivies—with the important exception of Penn—aren’t really known for linguistics in the same way as, say, a lot of public flagships are, particularly when it comes to their undergrad programs. I mean, I’m not saying that the linguistics faculty at Dartmouth aren’t top-notch in what they do—and I count a couple of them as good professional friends whose work I admire—but rather that you can get as solid an undergrad education in the field at, say, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Maryland, Oregon, et cetera.
That all said, you do get a very pretty green and white mortarboard tassel when you graduate from Dartmouth, so there’s that. But a pretty tassel (that you have to pay for separately anyway) isn’t worth $100k to me. Your individual mileage may vary, though.
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