Hi, so I’m from North Carolina and I’m really interested in Penn, Columbia, and Yale for math and statistics. I really love statistics and have an interest in political science as well. Philadelphia is a great city, and Penn has a great campus. I know they have a decent math program, and I love the idea of their PORES program in election studies. My sister goes to Penn as well, and I would love to go to school with her. However, Penn doesn’t have an actual stats major, they only have a minor. I haven’t been to Columbia, but I know they have a similar urban campus and a stellar stats program. Would that be a better option? I don’t know too much about Yale at all, and I expect that getting into Yale would be a bit more of a stretch than the other two. I do know they have a stats major and I like their residential colleges.
I think that my chances at these schools would partially determine where I apply, because I would really like to to apply ED or SCEA if I can make up my mind by November. So what are my chances at Penn, Columbia, and Yale?
ACT= 32 (29 math, 32 English, 31 reading, 36 science, 8 writing)
Class rank=1 of about 545
UW GPA=3.95
W GPA=5.00
3rd chair alto sax NC Central District All-District Honor Band, 2015
2rd chair alto sax NC Central District All-District Honor Band, 2016
2nd chair alto sax NC Central District All-District Honor Band, 2017
finished 6th in the NC All-State Honor Band Auditions in 2016 and 2017
played in the pit orchestra for the school musical in 2016 and 2017
Varsity Tennis Team, 2015 and 2016
Students for Barrow Campaign Coordinator in 2016
attended North Carolina Governor’s School in Summer 2016
I forgot to mention that I’m a white male, so that will make it tougher to get into any of these schools.
Thank you so much in advance!
@bab54251 Penn actually does have a statistics concentration through Wharton. You could do a dual degree between CAS and Wharton, and concentrate on stat for your Wharton degree. Or you could do the math major in CAS and just do the stat minor as you say. Or just do the Wharton concentration.
https://statistics.wharton.upenn.edu/programs/undergraduate/
A thing to consider is that Penn has a very flexible curriculum and no core, which allows you to double major very easily and take various other classes you are interested in. Columbia has a rigid core and it is harder to double major there. Penn is much more focused on interdisciplinary education.
For statistics according to USNews it is:
- Penn (#10)
- Columbia (#20)
3.Yale (#34)
For math:
1.Columbia (#9)
2.Yale (#9)
3. Penn (#17)
If you average out the rankings for math + stat for each you get:
- Penn (13.5)
2.Columbia (14.5)
3.Yale (21.5)
When looking at Math + Sat as a whole, i dont this the schools have really meaningful differences in terms of strength/quality especially for undergrad. you should base your decision on what environment you prefer. All three have vastly different vibes/cultures.
In terms of chances, Penn gives the biggest boost to its ED applicants out of the three schools, and you would also get a boost from having a sibling at Penn.
“My sister goes to Penn ”
This may give you a hook if you apply ED to Penn.
I’ve been to all three campuses and personally think Penn is the best, which may be biased. I think the amount of stuff to do in Philly is really great and the student body is incredibly social leaving you with no boredom.
Your sister going to penn makes you a legacy. Does your sister also attend wharton? Because wharton would be harder to get in compared to cas and even possibly yale so you might want to consider that aspect.
My DD was accepted at all three of these schools in April. To have a decent shot at any of these schools, you need to get your ACT especially the math score up. If you are considering Wharton, you need to take the Math level 2 subject test. I reccomend you bust your butt studying for the subject test and then retake the ACT. Good luck!
@Penn95, are those grad/PhD rankings? If so, I’m not sure I’d use them to try to measure/rank undergrad program quality, especially given that these are such relative peers academically. All three are probably very good at Stats and Math. OP should probably spend more time thinking about academic fit in terms of the ease of double-majoring or majoring and minoring, distribution requirements and general academic flexibility, courses offered, etc. – which you also touched on. 
I think here we’re looking at the usual fit variables and then ED/SCEA chances.
In terms of early admissions, I would say that Penn is a bit easier to get into than Yale. Penn’s ED admit rate was 22% and Yale SCEA was 17.1%. I cannot find info on Columbia’s 2021 ED stats. Transparency is our friend, Columbia.
Columbia had a lower admit rate than Yale overall (5.8 vs. 6.9%, respectively), but Yale’s admits have higher stats on average – so I’d say they are about equally hard to get into, probably.
Wharton may be the equal of Columbia, at least, in difficulty, and maybe Yale too – not sure if Penn people can confirm or deny that. Through the years I’ve seen some posters say that CAS and Wharton are about equally difficult, while others say Wharton is harder to get into.
@prezbucky I still think grad rankings are a decent measure for the departmental quality of each school and I think it does trickle down to undergrad to an extent. But yes I agree with you that there are no meaningful differences between these three in these field on the undergrad level.
I don’t think one can easily quantify which school is really harder to get in. Columbia gets many extra applications because of location , which drives down acceptance rate, Penn is known to not give as much emphasis on SAT scores in favor of GPA and other intangible factors. So yes in general I think Yale is harder to get into than both Columbia and Penn and I would say Penn and Columbia are slightly easier.
Regarding Wharton and CAS, Wharton probably has a slightly lower acceptance rate ( I would guess 6-8%) but The difference is not big these days. I think it is like comparing the difference in difficulty between Harvard/Stanford and Yake /Princeton. It is there, but it is small. I would personally give wharton the same difficulty level as Princeton/Yale more or less but wharton is obviously way more self-selected.
In any case small differences in chances that can’t be quantified for sure anyway,shouldn’t be major considerations in my opinion.
@Desiree2 the benefit of having a sibling at Penn in terms of admissions chances is present regardless of the individual school the sibling is in and the school the other sibling is applying to. Wharton has a slightly lower acceptance rate but the difference is not but to make it a deciding factor.
Agreed – there is some trickle-down probably in terms of research and rubbing elbows with grad students in upper-level classes. I’m just not sure there’s enough to use grad ranking as a direct/full proxy for an undergrad ranking in the subject.
I do think if a grad program is well regarded, the undergrad version is probably at least decent. But the grad program doesn’t have to be highly ranked for the undergrad program to be good.
If you want to major in math, I might get that math ACT up. In general, for these schools I would aim for a 33+
for math at an Ivy a 29 in the math section isn’t going to cut it. Shoot for a 35-36, it is a realistic goal and for a prospective math major shouldn’t be hard to attain