Penn vs Columbia vs Cornell vs Berkeley for Undergrad Physics

College Search & Selection
1

I have recently been accepted at the University of Pennsylvania, Columbia, Berkeley, and Cornell. I hope to major in physics and eventually receive a Ph.D. I was wondering which program would provide the best undergraduate education in order to get into Ph.D. programs?

2

You could do well from any of these schools, of course, but for physics, Cornell would seem to be a top option. That said, strongly consider general fit as well.

3

They are all immensely respected for their academics and would look good in PhD admissions. They all enjoy huge reputations.

So I think you should choose based on fit:

Academic fit

  • Type of curriculum (Columbia is notable here for its Core)
  • Availability of majors and classes (Physics at Cal may be impacted; Penn has incredible flexibility in which courses are open to you)
  • Calendar
  • Perceived strength of the major (these are all going to be just fine in Physics…)
  • Class sizes (Cal’s will be the largest, probably, overall. For anonymity – which I enjoyed at UW-Madison after rolling out of bed and running to class – that is a plus; for close prof interaction, it isn’t.)
  • Research opportunities (might be important for the PhD resume)
  • Overall academic vibe: level of rigor, intellectual vs. pre-professional, grade inflation/deflation, competitive vs. collaborative, etc.

Environment

  • Location
  • Urban (NYC & Philly) vs. Rural (Cornell) vs. Suburban (Berkeley)
  • Population of school, campus size and look/feel/convenience, etc.
  • Weather

Social vibe

  • Party scene
  • Greek scene
  • Sports scene
  • Clubs
  • Things to do in the surrounding city/town or wilderness (Cornell)

Dorms & Food

Cost

4

@enzogold since you are looking at undergrad it is important to take into consideration fit, overall strength o the school, quality/access to resources by undergraduates, in addition to strength in y=our specific department of interest.

Overall fit is the most important factor here. Are you visiting all of these schools?

5

@Penn95 Thanks for the response. I will be visiting Penn for Quaker Days on the 12th and the 13th and was at Berkeley about two months ago for a regents interview. Based on fit and curriculum I think I will probably end up deciding between Penn and Cal. Financially speaking Penn is slightly more than Cal because of regents; however, both schools are affordable. I guess my main concern is it will be easier to get into grad school from some of these universities as opposed to others.

6

@enzohold given that both are affordable, the difference comes down to the fact that Berkeley has a higher-ranked physics department whereas Penn provides more individual attention and access to resources, research opportunities for undergrads given that it is a smaller and richer school.

I think after visiting Penn as well, it will become clear which one you prefer.

btw this is the office at Penn that helps undergrads find research positions oh campus. thought you might wanna take a look before Quaker days. https://www.curf.upenn.edu

7

Physics is not a restricted or selective major at Berkeley.

http://classes.berkeley.edu/search/class/?f[0]=im_field_term_name%3A582&f[1]=im_field_subject_area%3A58 indicates that the expected class sizes will be:

  • Around 200 in the regular lower division physics courses (7A, 7B, 7C).
  • Around 70 in the honors lower division physics courses (5A, 5B, 5C).
  • Around 100 in the most commonly taken upper division physics courses (105, 110A, 137A).
  • Around 30-60 in other upper division physics courses.

You can check other schools’ class schedules if that is a concern for you.

8

Net price at each?

9

@ucbalumnus I believe that Penn would be around 37k, UCB would be around 28k and Columbia and Cornell would be around 45k.

10

@ucbalumnus, thanks for the info. OP, you’d be in the clear to major in Physics at Cal.

11

Here is the information on declaring the physics major at Berkeley:
http://physics.berkeley.edu/academics/undergraduate-degree/the-major-and-minor-program

12

How much does the price difference matter to you and your parents? How much debt would each entail?

13

@ucbalumnus the price difference between UCB and Penn is manageable and would hopefully entail $0 debt; however, the difference in prices is still a factor that I am considering. I emailed the office of financial aid at Penn to see if they would reevaluate based on the fact that the aid that I received from UCB was technically need-based. Although I do not expect changes in aid, I believe it was worth a try.