Please help me to choose colleges that are my fit. (safety, match and reach)

College Search & Selection
1

Your life-changing help would be much appreciated.

I’m an international applicant from a country which SAT/ACT are not offered. I took SAT subjects last year, but now our currency has changed so much and traveled abroad for taking the test has some difficulties for my family.
(But I’m deciding about taking the tests, my college list affects the decision - I believe I can get 1400+)
I’m studying to get a 100+ score in TOEFL.

Whereas I’m a medalist of national math Olympiad, in Olympiad summer camp we took the international exam at the same condition and time with the real international contestants and I scored 16/42 which was the score of bronze cut-off!

I’ve studied in the best school in our country for girls which has a competitive entrance exam and although I concentrated to get a math medal in high school and we had different classes than other students, I’ve got a 19.7/20 GPA (I think it’s at least top 5 among 200 -my school doesn’t rank)

my subject scores are Math 2: 770, Physics: 750. (I could easily get 800s but I got sick during travel - I’m gonna retake them maybe!)

I’m doing a research with one of my young teachers who is a doctorate student now and I’ve done another with my brother (he’s a professor), respectively about computer science and game theory.

I’m doing an IoT project now in the Sharif University of Technology in a competition of a summer school related to start-ups and inventions.

I’m a professional chess player since 7. I’m also a good teacher and mentor for young girls in our schools and I’ve worked with some charities and enjoyed all the moments teaching little cute girls, too.

I’m also a curious, open-minded, book-worm individual who is passionate about mathematical concepts and math philosophy, computer science and coding and everything related to technology, music and literature, entrepreneurship and social works and many scientific areas such as genetics, cosmology, and cognitive science.

Moreover, I have an inspirational and emotional life story of how seeking for freedom and independent thought, struggling with many kinds of discrimination, led me to an interest in intellectual concepts and finally how I found a way…

I need full-ride financial aid. I prefer colleges in or near big cities.
My chosen major is computer science, the second choice is either mathematics or electrical eng. I am also interested in interdisciplinary majors like symbolic systems, cognitive science, and computational biology.

2

Are you from Iran? Check the travel restrictions to the USA before you get any further on this. You may
need to go to the UK, if no student visas are available for students from Iran. . The UK or Germany may work better.

I don’t know that there are full rides to that many schools in the USA for international students, but
others may know of some.

Being a female Math Olympiad winner may help you with admissions, but it will not be easy to win a full ride,
in the USA, as in international students. Does your government offer any scholarships?

US schools vary with how they handle financial aid for international students, but still the problem remains
that there are travel restrictions in place from Iran to the USA.

If you are an American citizen, then you can apply. If not, most students use cash from home to come to the USA.

3

Congratulations on your hard work and success! You sound like a passionate, idealistic young person, and that’s great.

Unfortunately, financial aid is difficult to secure if an applicant is an international student. And I’m not sure how not having an SAT/ACT score will impact that. Most schools who will give aid to international students are also extremely competitive. Skidmore College and Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut (not Trinity University in Texas) are very competitive schools that I believe offer aid to international students. Skidmore is outside Albany, NY. Trinity is an urban school; despite the name it does not have a religious affiliation (see second link below).

http://www.trincoll.edu/AboutTrinity/mission/Pages/default.aspx

http://www.trincoll.edu/AboutTrinity/mission/Pages/History.aspx

https://www.skidmore.edu

To see others, google “U.S. colleges that give financial aid to international students.”

You might also look at Bard College in New York; Connecticut College (not University of Connecticut); Middlebury College (not urban, in a small town, but great school, very, very competitive admissions); Sarah Lawrence College in New York; St Olaf College in Minnesota (smaller town some distance from Minneapolis/St. Paul); Union College and Vassar College, both in New York; Wellesley College (all female) and Smith College (all female), both in Massachusetts; and Wesleyan University in Connecticut. Some quick research seems to show that these give the most generous financial aid awards to international students, but this is based on quick research, and I can’t vouch for the data.

These are all excellent schools. They have very different cultures. For a U.S. student, Bard, Connecticut College, Sarah Lawrence, St. Olaf, and then maybe Union, though all very competitive, would offer a generic student the best chance of admission, more or less. It’s much more difficult to say for international students–there’s less data and I think it can change more year to year, based on supply and demand. Sarah Lawrence does seem like it might be a possibility, and it’s just north of Manhattan.

Note that some U.S. schools are “test optional” and don’t require students to submit SAT/ACT scores. You could google test-optional U.S. colleges and then see which of the above would not require you to submit a score, which would be great, and probably be your best chance. This is potentially an important point.

So check out some of these. Most are small liberal arts colleges (LACs). You might even contact the admissions representative at one of these colleges who handles international students. Reps usually are responsible for geographic regions, and one or more are responsible for international students. This info is usually available on the admissions website. Ask any questions you have that are not available on the website. Ask about financial aid. Remember to always be positive and forward-looking, no excuses and no complaints about something that the rep can’t control. If they get to know you, they might be able to help you navigate the process, and maybe start to root for you. Again, be very positive and forward-looking in any communication and in any application. That’s the kind of person that schools like to welcome to their communities. And be sure to let them know what unique qualities and what impact you will have on their communities. And you can, as a bright young person from a different place and culture.

Just keep in mind, admission reps are very busy, and very, very busy after early season applications start to roll in, usually in October or November. So keep everything very concise (unlike my answer) :slight_smile:

It is a challenge for international applicants to U.S. schools needing financial aid. The above might be a good place to start. You might also look at European schools, which are much less expensive, unless you get a lot of aid.

Good luck!

4

Can people from Iran get student visas now (travel ban)?
If you’re not feeling Iran the situation is different so can you clear that up?

5

Also, please note that the US colleges and universities’ purpose is to educate students. Do not assume that admission to a US college means you will be employed or be provided a path to immigration.

As a non-citizen, a large majority of employers cannot sponsor you for employment. It is extremely difficult. After admission and your studies, it is expected that you will return to your home country for employment.

6

@Coloradomama, @MYOS1634 and @“aunt bea” thank you all for considering my visa status. But everything is ok! Mr. Trump hasn’t banned student visa as I searched! if you don’t agree with me please give me a source.
I know everything about the employment of non-citizens as my brother and sister live in the USA.
So please help me with the college selection.
@TTG thank you so much for your help. there are a lot of private universities that are need-aware for international students but I don’t know exactly how to choose. and about SAT test, many universities are ok with waiving them but if necessary maybe I could take them.
Is there anyone who can tell me which schools match my character more? (I know for most of the top ones my chance is low but please guide me)

7

I would be thankful if anyone helps me with European and Canadian universities, too. (but still, my first choice is US)

8

If you are talented in math and want a difficult CS program in the USA–

  1. MIT (Cambridge, near Boston )
  2. Carnegie Mellon (Pittsburgh)
  3. Georgia Tech (Atlanta )
  4. NYU Courant Institute (New York City )

All four of those are urban campuses.

But most of these offer little to no merit based aid. (MIT offers none at all) Does your sibling get financial aid from a US college?
Which one? Do you want to go to that college?

I don’t think Skidmore in NY or Trinity U in Connecticut are really that good for math and CS. Both are liberal arts colleges, that may be OK if you want to get to the US and don’t mind a smaller school with less talented math students than you. Knox College in Illinois also gives scholarships to international students too. Its hard to fly to, its in rural Illinois. Skidmore is also really difficult to fly to, very few flights to Albany, and Albany is not much of a city.

But it appears you could get financial aid, as a student from Iran.

Will your government give you anything? Check on that. Check on Iranian-American scholarships too.

I would pick U of Toronto for math/CS in Canada.

Canadian universities are larger and much less expensive than private American universities.
Canadian Universities often do not provide housing and housing could be very expensive in Toronto.

Also some Canadian schools require an IB diploma, do you have that? If you do not , have
you taken AP exams ? They will sometimes replace the IB diploma with about four AP exams
if you have access to any of that in Iran.

Both European and Canadian schools offer THREE YEAR BS degrees. US colleges offer four year degrees,
even if you had the same exact credits that you could bring to a Canadian School like U of Toronto.
So US schools are a year longer, but that may actually allow you to double major or minor, that extra year.

Also a lot of US students study abroad in today’s world, so the credits students bring, are used
to let the student have a semester of play abroad, even CS students do this today, in places like Hong Kong
or the French campus of Georgia Tech, or any number of universities that have agreements with
your home university.

9

You’re welcome!

On the SAT/ACT, it would probably be helpful to take one of them, if it is possible and affordable. But, first, you might google US colleges that are test optional. If some you are finding interesting are test optional, or you can get the requirement waived, then you might be fine without taking it. Lots of schools are becoming test optional, including many excellent ones. They are finding that the transcript is a much better predictor of success in college.

My take on computer science at these LACs is that they will be good programs with strong faculty and strong students. True, an MIT or Carnegie Mellon or University of Washington or Georgia Tech or other similar schools might be first choices for a US student looking to study CS, or a full-pay international. In this international student’s situation, though, I think the top priority is finding an affordable choice. CS is not what these LACs are known for, but most quality LACs are generally going to offer good to excellent programs across the board, although I can’t speak to CS at any of these specific schools.

I know there are people on CC who know British universities much better than me. However, I do have a close family member who attended a Dutch University College. University Colleges are affiliated with larger Dutch universities and are patterned directly after US LACs. I mention them because all classes are taught in English, so they might also work. As noted above, you get a bachelors degree in 3 years, instead of 4. A few years ago, they cost about $12,000 per year for non-Dutch, non-EU students. I don’t know about financial aid. They tend to have a very international focus, and to have lots of international students attending. Some Dutch university programs are in English too.

An overview of Dutch university colleges:

https://www.studyinholland.nl/education-system/dutch-institutions/university-colleges

https://www.studyinholland.nl/education-system/tuition-fees-and-cost-of-living

https://www.rug.nl/bachelors/computing-science/

Delft is not a university college, but is a technical school. CS is taught in English:

https://www.tudelft.nl/en/education/programmes/bachelors/cse/bachelor-of-computer-science-and-engineering/

Good luck!

10

Canadian universities offer 4 year degrees. A University of Waterloo co-op degree takes 5 years. I’m not aware of any that offer 3 year degrees or any that require an IB diploma.

University of Toronto and University of Waterloo are the top 2 universities for CS in Canada with UBC a close 3rd. U of T is more research-focused while Waterloo is more career focused.

Waterloo’s co-op program allows you to earn money during work terms. There are 5 x 4 month work terms for a CS coop degree. Students in CS earn an average of $10000-$15000 per term. There are 8 x 4 month study terms.

Canada allows international students to work for 3 years after they complete their degree with a post graduation work permit. After one year of full time work, you can apply for permanent residency.

11

@Coloradomama Thank you for your helpful response.
But isn’t MIT a need-blind university?! I know getting in it is difficult but it will meet all your needs.
Carnegie Mellon doesn’t give financial aid to international students, also GT but NYC is need-aware for internationals.
My siblings applied for the Ph.D. program and got full-ride scholarships and extra funds, too. (my brother graduated from Columbia University, which is one of my favorites)
My school and government don’t provide any scholarships.
There isn’t any IB diploma or AP exam offered in my country. But when I searched on the website of U of Toronto, it seemed they know well about Iran education system and has required specific requirements from Iranian students based on our system.
Thank you for all the information you gave about Canadian and American universities.

12

@TTG thank you again for the information.
There are lots of private schools which provide a need-aware financial aid for international students.
But I don’t know which are best fits for me. (even tippy top ones)
is there anyone who can tell me which kind of students they’re looking for? and is the kind similar to me?

13

@boulders thank you so much for your response! do you know which kind of student waterloo and u of Toronto are looking for? how do they give financial aid to international students?

14

From what you say about yourself, I’d, off the cuff, think Sarah Lawrence, Connecticut College, Wellesley, Smith, and Vassar would be potentially good fits, culturally. All are urban, or relatively close to a big city. Wellesley has a stunning campus in a nice suburban town outside of Boston. Students can take classes at MIT, though you’d have to research how that works (I know a recent Wellesley grad, an international student, who did that). Hillary Clinton went to Wellesley. Smith is to the west, in Massachusetts, in a great college town, Northampton. Smith has more of a liberal, hippie, feminist reputation, among the most pronounced of any US college. Again, excellent academics. Smith and Mount Holyoke, another women’s college, are part of the “Five College Consortium” with Hampshire, Amherst, and University of Massachusetts at Amherst (the state flagship public university). Students can take classes and take advantage of other opportunities at the other schools.

https://www.fivecolleges.edu

Bard and Vassar are up the Hudson River from New York City. A student can take a train down to the city, though this can be costly. Sarah Lawrence is really just north of Manhattan.

All of these are “liberal” LACs. I’d think you would find St. Olaf and Union to be a little more conservative, though this is just a relative term, given colleges tend to be liberal. And this is largely a matter of reputation and personal opinion. Some might disagree. I don’t know St. Olaf well, just by reputation, and it seems generous to international students. It is in Northfield, with Carlton College, another really top-notch LAC, known for science and biology. I think of Union as being pretty sports intensive, which we felt on our visit there (it is a small school with lots of sports teams, so a high % of students are athletes, we felt that on a visit there). Both schools have a reputation as being strong in the sciences, though.

But go to their websites, and look at other sources, to see what kind of vibe you get from them. And, if any look particularly good, you can communicate with the international student rep, and let them know you are interested and why, and maybe learn about financial aid opportunities for international students.

Again, it’s a challenge for international students who require significant aid, but try to work with them, that’s okay at most of these schools. Be bold, trust in yourself, that’s your best bet to break through. Be positive and make them root for you.

15

in my previous post, I typed @bouders name incorrectly. (excuse me :slight_smile: )
Which ivy league school fits me better?
thank you all.

16

MIT requires international students fill out the international CSS profile and provide proof of their parents income. I think all US colleges will require that information. They will want to see proof of funds for all four years and I don’t know what that requires.

Note this is not the same as PhD support which is competitive and full 100% support for all students who qualify based on their undergraduate records. (International and US students treated the same and its never based on parents income )

Financial aid is based only on your parents income as compared to other international students from some arguably poor counties like India, Bangladesh, Uganda and others.

I don’t know if there is a net price calculator for international students, I don’t think so. Email financial aid offfices and ask how to calculate it. MIT Financial Aid Office May give you some guidelines.

The chances of getting into MIT are quite low but because you are a female Math Olympiad that may help. International admit rates are below 1% but vary year to year. If your parents did not attend a four year college in their home country, you will count as a first generation college student as well.

MIT and Wellesley have a full cross registration process with buses running every hour between the campuses. If you are at MIT, some students take all 8 humanities and social sciences at Wellesley. I don’t know how many core classes Wellesley students can take at MIT but I suspect at least 8, so one per semester is practical.

There is a very simple registration process from Wellesley to MIT and the calendars line up well by design. This cross registration process has been in place for 50 years now and works well for both colleges.

MIT does offer an all girls dorm, McCormick Hall, Women’s Independent Living group and female sororities. There are co ed dorms and coed fraternities but plenty of all female living groups at MIT. 49% of MIT students are female.

Wellesley is an all female college with MIT students both male and female in class with you possibly.

17

Note if you want to study electrical engineering or computer engineering I disagree that liberal arts colleges will work well. At Wellesley you can study physics or CS though and take classes at MIT. Some LACs. may have better financial aid however than the public schools with top engineering and CS programs.

Do you want an all girls school? There are no engineering colleges in the USA that are all girls that I know of. Smith College, an all girls LAC. offers some engineering classes and you can cross register at U Mass Amherst for more engineering. But Smith is in rural Central Massachusetts. There is good busing between Smith and the other colleges in that region (4 LACs and a public school with strong engineering )

18

Based on the few comments about yourself, culturally I’d say Brown or Columbia, but others would work as well. Least likely would be Penn and Dartmouth. Penn has more of a pre-professional vibe than most. I love Dartmouth myself, but it is in a small town pretty far from anything else (true of Middlebury as well, except smaller town). You could certainly apply to Brown and Columbia and any other Ivies. Many will meet financial need. As noted above with MIT (1% for internationals!), acceptance rates are extremely low, practically no one can really anticipate acceptance. Many, many more very well qualified students apply than can be accepted. Supply and demand. But they do accept students.

Note, when you look at admit rates for schools, it can be dramatically different for international students. To a large degree, applicants, US and international, basically compete within a pool, or within pools within pools. For example, I know one excellent public university very well. In-state and out-of-state students are treated as different groups. An OOS student is effectively competing with other OOS students. Schools can also have different admit rates for males and females, based large differences in the number applying, sometimes benefitting males, sometimes females. International acceptance rates can be higher or lower than overall admit rates. And it can be much harder/impossible to know this number.

19

@Coloradomama Thank you so much for your response.
I know the difficulty of being admitted to MIT very well, so I consider it as one of my reach reach(!) schools. But I’ll take my chances, definitely.
You mean I can transfer from Wellesley to MIT easily? it’s very good that if I get admitted to Wellesley I can take some courses at MIT, too! thank you for the information! and also being in touch with MIT students is a fascinating opportunity.
I like engineering (especially computer and electrical engineering) but I’m more interested in computer science because it has more mathematical concepts and requires much more creative thinking. (But I think it’s soon to decide about majors, my options are still open)
No, I don’t prefer all girls schools at all!

20

@TTG thank you for your response, too.
Yes, getting admitted to ivy leagues is so difficult especially for international students. I’m going to consider them as my reach schools. Just will take my chances.
is the kind of student every ivy, Stanford, and MIT are seeking for different from each other? Everyone tells me to find my fit ones! I don’t know exactly how. are they misguiding me?