<p>Is this even real? Geez--I thought myself and other people I know were hard on ourselves with regard to planning to apply to grad school.</p>
<p>LB - I don't think anyone intended to be mean. I think everyone is conveying their personal experiences to give you hope and heart that everything will turn out okay for your d. She sounds like an exceptional girl in all areas includeding standardized testing. If she took her SAT without prepping and made scores in the mid 600s on CR/W and mid 700s on Math, she did a great job! If her goal is to break the 700 threshold for all parts of the exam, she is well on her way. A little CR prep in the fall, which will be great after a little summer break, seems like all that is needed for her to meet her goals.</p>
<p>But many would like you to understand that even if she gets the magical numbers on the standardized testing, it may not get her in certain schools. Not because she is undeserving or wouldn't shine there...but because admissions is such an overwrought process at those schools, predictability and formulas just don't work. Someone called it a 'cr@pshoot' and I tend to think there is something to that statement.</p>
<p>Also, of course we know you love and care for your daughter. I'm not sure, but I think what is happening here is bit of culture clash. Some would interpret pushing and dissatisfaction as conditional love or vicarious behavior; but others would interpret a laissez faire approach to a child's academic upbringing as neglect and bad parenting. I think both are big assumptions...and I've yet to meet a parent here on CC guilty of either.</p>
<p>For the rest of us....I think what needs to be remembered is just because LB has shared his innermost feelings and concerns with us, does not mean he has done anything other than be very supportive of his daughter. A lot of us are just as ambitious for our own children, but we are not quite as honest about it. ;)</p>
<p>LB, What you need to realize is that because of the SHEER NUMBERS of students all applying to the same "elite" colleges, including students from overseas, THERE IS ABSOLUTELY no guarantee that any student will be able to get into an elite college in the next couple of years, no matter how qualified they are- there simply isn't room for all the qualified students. So you need to be HOPEFUL that your D will get the "big envelope" but not put pressure on her to accomplish something that in reality, will be completely out of her hands. That is one of the reasons so many parents whose kids were JUST as qualified, smart, hard working, exceptional, etc. and ended up being dissapointed by admissions outcomes, are telling you to lighten up on your D. SHE CAN'T MAKE IT AN IVY /ELITE ACCEPTANCE HAPPEN BY HERSELF. A lot of the admissions outcomes these days are due to luck and chance, and all that families can do is be supportive.</p>
<p>"So you need to be HOPEFUL that your D will get the "big envelope" but not put pressure on her to accomplish something that in reality, will be completely out of her hands."</p>
<p>Wise words, MPM.</p>
<p>Let's see if I can clarify further with my usual charm: LB, what people are trying to tell you is that your obsession is over-the-top, unwarranted, misses the big picture, and is possibly damaging to your daughter.</p>
<p>good summation TheDaD</p>
<p>This thread would have been a great addition to the book The Overachievers...</p>
<p>Its really hard to psychoanalyze over the net, ( not that it usually stops me)
But this reminds me of when my oldest was about 2- when most kids seems to stop eating and live on couch fuzz, however, she was already very petite, and thin and trying to get her to eat was a battle.
However, I was making it my problem- refusing was a way to show her independence, because I was making such a big deal out of it.
I had to learn to at least pretend I didn't care- to step away from the power struggle.</p>
<p>From the sounds of not wanting to study etc. I wonder if the OPs daughter is backing away, because her dad has made it more his issue than hers.
She is tangential.
If she doesn't study & as a consequence doesn't get into the schools * she * wants to attend, then she will have to deal with the consequences- Thats what they are for- learning that the choices you make affect subsequent choices, is something we have to learn for ourselves.
She knows that she will be out of the house soon and have more freedom with her choices, but he will be stuck with the choices he has made.
I think it is going to be harder on him.</p>
<p>Just to put things in perspective:</p>
<p>My son just received a rejection from Berkeley. They kindly told him that they had over 40,000 applicants, 22,000 of whom had straight A averages. So you can have it all on paper (which my son did, he fit all the listed profiles for acceptance) and still not get in.</p>
<p>CountingDown, you actually have rules?</p>
<p>I think the only rule at our house is "Remember to show up. Your parents paid for this." I wouldn't dare insist on breakfast because I don't enjoy cleaning up barf. (Both of my kids do not do well if they eat when they're nervous.) </p>
<p>As for planning to limit stress and all that, wait until your DS2 has to take two or even three AP and IB tests on one day, with some of them starting at 6 AM. At his school, this is sometimes unavoidable. Unfortunately. But by that time the kids are used to it.</p>
<p>Marian, </p>
<p>More like traditions...but they work. (We also have a family tradition of going out to celebrate big accomplishments -- this week, it's DS1's SAT score results and DS2's incredible turnaround on his latest math test. We have a tradition of coming up with excuses to eat, too.) :)</p>
<p>I dread those AP/IB marathon days -- he is not the greatest under stress like that. We were completely blown off for any sort of accommodations at his EMT meeting the other day despite a stack of evals and informal accommodations dating back to elem school. The school's accommodation to his LDs is...me.</p>
<p>Anyway, he is not going to take SAT-II Bio this year with all his friends -- he'll do it next spring at the end of AP Enviro when he has another year of bio studies and a year of chem under his belt. I just don't see good SAT-II scores coming out of one year of HS Bio, even if it is pre-IB, without a lot of extra studying. He's shooting for strong results without lots of studying above and beyond his regular coursework. On the other hand, he expects to nail AP Gov't, but that class is his thing, and DH and I have both had enough polisci/law courses to help him pull the pieces together.</p>
<p>
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If she doesn't study & as a consequence doesn't get into the schools she wants to attend, then she will have to deal with the consequences- Thats what they are for- learning that the choices you make affect subsequent choices, is something we have to learn for ourselves.
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<p>And haven't we also seen student posters here who hope they get rejected at dad's choices (and act on this consciously or sub conciously) so they can go to their own?</p>
<p>audiophile - so true !! A family member was thrilled and excited last year to be rejected from her dad's #1 choice. She called to report on the rejection and you'd have thought she'd just won the lottery.</p>
<p>Laserdad, please read this post, and try to get some perspective.</p>
<p>For the Nth time, let me state it again. I KNOW that even with perfect everything, it is not guarantee to get into top elite schools. I KNOW that standard test score is only part of the equation ? not a major one for some schools. </p>
<p>However, having perfect everything INCREASES the chance of being admitted. If one is capable, why not try to achieve the best to one?s ability. </p>
<p>In this case, D?s SAT I is not where near perfect nor her capability (she agrees). I came for advises and I got great ones. Best of all, we develop a game plan based on the advises and most seems to like it. </p>
<p>Thank you.</p>
<p>You still don't get it: it's the insistence on nothing but a "top elite school" and the degree to which you appear to be willing to push your D at whatever cost that is disquieting. Or worse.</p>
<p>And this coming from a parent who is something of a hardass in his own right. I've seldom felt so much like Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm.</p>
<p>countingdown- what, no frozen pizza for breakfast eaten in the car on the way to the SAT test?!</p>
<p>there was a great thread on this in Sinner's Alley about a month ago...ie tips about what a "good mother" does and does not do on the am of the SAT test..</p>
<p>maybe some here should read it for a little comic relief :)</p>
<p>"guarantee to get into top elite schools"
"However, having perfect everything INCREASES the chance of being admitted."
And what happens if she is admitted at NONE of the elite schools, which given the acceptance rates due to the HUGE number of smart, hardworking, high scoring, talented students who will also be applying, is more likely than not to happen, then what? EVERYONE IS TRYING TO TELL YOU IS THERE ARE 3500 COLLEGES IN THE USA, NOT JUST 10-12. An ELITE COLLEGE is not the ONLY choice for smart students.</p>
<p>If she doesn't do well on an AP exam she doesn't have to submit the score. That is what I heard. It is too bad the College Board didn't offer a summer SAT. That would solve a lot of problems.</p>
<p>"And what happens if she is admitted at NONE of the elite schools, which given the acceptance rates due to the HUGE number of smart, hardworking, high scoring, talented students who will also be applying, is more likely than not to happen, then what?"</p>
<p>The following is not directed specifically to Laserbrother, but to all of us:</p>
<p>Every year or so, I read about a promising student who has committed suicide because s/he got a "bad" grade or failed to get into such-and-such college or couldn't deal with the expectations of parents and teachers. I think that teenagers especially suffer from the myopia of living within the moment. Yes, we all want the best for our children, but what if we lose them because we, too, got caught up in all the hype?</p>
<p>I see threads here on CC about students with excellent scores and grades calling themselves "worthless" or saying that their lives are "over" because they did not get into the schools they believed they deserved. Some even feel like failures because they only got into the "lesser" Ivies. As adults, we need to provide some balance. If we get caught in the college hype (and it's hard not to if you are the parent of an achiever), then we might fail to see how desperate our children have become under the pressure. At their young age, they might not be able to see that we love them unconditionally even though at times it seems that our expectations mean otherwise. We need to guide them but not push them. We need to hide our own disappointment when they are disappointed.</p>