Hello,
My Daughter is interested in Computer Science major and business minor. She is interested in Stanford, Georgia Tech, UT Austin (Touring), UCal, CMU. We are from Texas.
Here metrics are:
SAT 1580/1600 (780M, 800CR); Her writing is low 15/24 (pretty low); this is the reason she is thinking of writing SAT again; but again she is not one who enjoys writing and wants to do CS doesn’t see the need/value of writing excellence.
SAT Math II: 800 (Math)
PSAT: 1500/1520
AP Courses: By the time she finishes senior year, 15 courses.(including AP CompSi(5))
Some leadership positions in her school clubs. Other than online CS courses, not much CS related ECs (like coding competitions) as her school doesn’t have CS related interest. She is not interested in coding competitions as she is interested in data sciences and AI.
Ethnicity: Asian - Indian - Female
We are not qualified for financial aid.
Please help us with two questions:
Doe she need to SAT again to improve on Writing section? It all depends on if these Universities need writing or not. It looks like Stanford needs it.
How these universities map to CS major and Business minor for her scores.
I think Stanford does require SAT with essay or ACT with writing. They do super-score so that could help (see admissions website).
On a different note, there’s quite a bit of writing involved at Stanford even for CS majors. There are required writing classes and most of the more advanced CS classes have paper writing components.
There is no undergraduate business minor/major at Stanford, the business school is the “GSB” (Graduate School of Business). There is, obviously, plenty of opportunity to learn about entrepreneurship, and lots of undergrads go into business, but unless they have rigged up a program very recently, undergrads are unlikely to set foot on the GSB part of the campus.
She doesn’t need to retake that test - the writing portion isn’t that important anyway (as evidenced by the fact she ended up with a 1580).
However retaking a 1580 would likely be weighted as a negative, ie., Obsessive/robot applicant.
She needs to apply to UTD Mc Dermott. She sounds like the kind of students they want.
I wouldn’t apply to Cal - paying 63k a year to be in a lecture hall with 700 people isn’t a good value. Aim at Berkeley for grad school.
Beside Stanford, include Santa Clara (a safety, if you can afford it) and Harvey Mudd. If you can afford to, plan official visits at all three.
The universities you list won’t really care about her scores considering she’s already got more than she needs on that front. After 8 APs the law of diminishing returns applies, as it does for a 1500+. They’re ‘reaxh for everyone’, meaning odds are against you regardless of stats. What distinguishes admitted students at super selective schools such as these is extracurricular involvement and achievements, impact, etc.
She should consider NETS at UPenn.
For AI/Machine learning she should consider UEdinburgh (top in the world).
She needs to find two acceptable safeties and a few targets (Admission rates in the 20-30% range where she expressed consistent interest starting end of junior year).
Firstly, if she is not interested in coding or does not like it, then she should not be doing CS. At Stanford (and all the other schools on your list) you will have to do a LOT coding. Data Science and AI also requires coding.
Secondly, its a crap shot to get into Stanford or any of the elite private schools especially if you are an Asian American. However, being a female does give you a significant edge at MIT. Your best option is the Turing Scholars program at UT Austin, it is very selective and has a very good reputation. And being in-state in TX, the tuition cost will be only a fraction of a full pay at Stanford or MIT for an equally good education.
Unless she is an autoadmit at UT and also can be certain of getting into her major, you should consider adding some schools that are easier to get into to her list. High test scores and high grades are no guarantee of admission for the schools you listed.
While data science and AI and ML do require coding that is not the primary focus of it. There are a lot of people into CS who are not crazy about coding.
Thank you all for sharing your time and thoughts. This week we visited GaTech, Cal and Stanford. Stanford engineering tour was fine but didn’t gain much knowledge about CS dept. We were hoping to gain additional perspective on how data science, AI related courses can be organized at Stanford UG curriculum. Campus is beautiful and engineering tour guide talked in very general terms. So, gained an understanding on the university surroundings and student interactions etc… which is still good outcome of the trip. I wish Stanford does a session specifically for CS interested kids.
My suggestion to her is NO on SAT retake, UT Touring program is my preference, but will get behind her decision.
She would be eligible for automatic admission into UT Austin as she is in top 3 students out of 200 in her class.
@CA94309 She is not averse to coding but not too excited about coding competitions. She really likes to understand the concepts and big picture well and come up with solutions by connecting dot that are sometimes not easily visible.
@MYOS1634 Thank you for your suggestions on UTD, Penn and UEdinburgh. UTD was on our mind as in-state backup. Unfortunately 15APs are to maintain class rank in her school.
I seem to remember some kids who were autoadmits to UT NOT getting their first choice of majors this year, and I think maybe it was CS specifically. Here is a thread:
If her major is very important, then UT isn’t going to be her safety even with an autoadmit. GA Tech had kids with perfect scores in-state get rejected this year, too. You want to make sure she has a few school that are easier to get into that she’d be willing to attend on her list. Having just one true safety can be depressing to a kid if they happen to strike out on all their other admissions – having choices in the spring is good.
Other schools you might look more closely at to see if they match her specific CS interests are Case Western, Northeastern, or RPI.
As long as she would be genuinely happy to attend them, that is great. If not, you should put more time into the safety/low match search. We do see a lot of kids out here who pick safeties that they think they will never attend, then are really unhappy when they end up with only those choices. Of course that might not happen for her, but it is good insurance to make sure your kid has safeties they really like. That can take more time to find than reach schools (they are easy to find).
@HoustonTxDad Researching this question should be top-of-list for each school you are considering but it’s also probably too detailed for engineering tour at any campus. Stanford’s CS website has very good information that will help shed light on this question (and the other schools should have similar content). Another option is to post your detailed question in a school’s forum.
