The advice from a lot of “old timers” on CC is lead with affordability and finances, and then build the list from the “bottom” up, starting with “sure things,” then “matches,” and then “reaches.” I’ve been on CC more than 10 years, and it is heartbreaking every spring to watch the stories unfold of distraught, highly accomplished students who didn’t build out their “sure thing” and matches" and were disappointed with their options. Schools with an acceptance rate below roughly 35% (people can argue about what the line is) would not be recommended to be a “sure thing,” even when a particular student is in the top 75% of admitted student stats, especially for private schools and smaller schools which are holistic rather than entirely stat based. Some high schools will have much more accurate Naviance etc. information which helps families gauge what specific schools may be for that student, but especially for smaller schools, that may not show who is a recruited athlete who got in ED with coach support etc. Plus, the last two years have been an absolute, unpredictable mess for students. No one is really sure what next year will look like, though the hope is that it has to be better than this year.
With all that in mind, I’d encourage any family to research broadly and not shrink the safety/match list too much or too quickly.
Gettsyburg probably a safety. A target to me is likely in. My system may be off. My daughter applied to 21 - got into all 16 I rated target or safety and into one reach - Washington & Lee.
She was rejected at UNC OOS, Rice and waitlisted at W&M (she jumped off) and Emory (she stayed on but did not make effort other than saying to leave her on).
Her stats were a bit more robust - 3.98 and 4.55 so she likely had more APs and a 32 ACT.
I’m on the PC now but was writing from the phone b4. Vassar, Hopkins, Emory - I’d say little shot. W&M - unlikely. Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t apply - you should apply where you want - but just note that you’d be comfortable going to any school you apply - even safeties.
I think it’s fine to apply to reaches. With Common App, you get 20 schools - and if you get on their email lists, some send free apps. I wanted my kid to get turned down somewhere.
I looked at Bryn Mawr - I thought because it’s tied to Penn, Haverford, Swarthmore it’s harder than it is. Davidson is a stretch…Macalester likely. As I put about American, they’re crazy off in that - if you demonstrate interest (webinars, visit, etc. you can have a 25, 26 and get in). My daughter demonstrated a ton and only got 15K which was disappointing. Then you read on the CC some kids didn’t demonstrate, had a 34 ACT and got rejected.
Also, in the end, money matters. My daughter is going to Charleston - #16 of 17 but as she’s a star for them, she’s getting lots of love and money vs. if she was at W&L, for example, just another kid.
The CC is opinion. So you asked and maybe my opinion is different than your counselors - but that’s what it is. None of us are AOs so the only way to know is to apply.
As the parent of a Poli Sci major who was leaning think tanks/policy, worked in politics for several years and then went to law school – finances matter even more when a student is preparing to enter a field where multiple unpaid (and highly competitive) internships in expensive cities (DC) are the norm. DC area schools, as well as schools in the state capitol, have the advantage in that students can do part-time internships during the school year to build their resume to prepare for the hyper competitive unpaid internships during the summer.
If access to internships might represent a deciding factor, then Hamilton should be considered strongly for its term-length program in D.C., as well as for its highly regarded public policy program on its own campus.
Exactly. Hamilton’s Washington term is over 50 years old, is offered every semester, and coordinates especially well with Hamilton’s excellent government and public policy programs. It certainly isn’t “any old run-of-the-mill” program.
Although I think you misinterpreted the language of my post. The potential “deciding factor” pertained to access to internships, which I then connected to a suggestion of a college with an especially notable public policy program with a long-established D.C. option.
I know you said she didn’t like the culture at Georgetown, but it otherwise would seem to hit all her requirements - my kid who just graduated had an amazing social and academic experience. And you can’t beat the DC connections. The list seems great, but UVA out of state is just as hard if not harder than UNC out of state. Villanova doesn’t seem to fit the liberal vibe as I think quite seriously Catholic? John’s Hopkins is significantly more intense and “less fun” than others on your list. I agree CC advice is overly focused on finances (to the point of trying to convince people not to spend the money they can and are prepared to spend) and is overly negative on admissions prospects for kids from private or feeder type schools.
Yes, on paper, Georgetown is the dream school. And we did visit-- it is beautiful and Georgetown is just almost too perfect to be true. Having said that, from all I hear it is almost impossible to get into and they are famous for waitlisting a LOT of people which I think would be difficult for my daughter to deal with. So, it dropped off her list after leading for quite a while. We nixed Villanova based on our visit (yes, VERY Catholic!) and know UVA is hard to get into out of state, although from all I’ve read in terms of percentages, it isn’t quite as hard as UNC Chapel Hill but yes, they are close. I think my daughter just fell in love with UVA the minute she stepped foot on campus. The good news? My daughter’s college counselor went to UVA both undergrad and grad so she may have better insight than most. And thank you for recognizing the over-emphasis on finances. I understand it is a huge issue for many people but shouldn’t be the first or only point of discussion!
If she builds a list with a some solid safeties and matches getting waitlisted or rejected from a reach should be something she can deal with. SFS is harder to get into than the College, but you can take classes at both, and intra-uni transfers are possible. It is a reach- she just squeaks into the middle 50% of ACT scores- but to not apply at all to a program that she likes and is in the tippy top for her field b/c she might get rejected or wait listed kind of misses the point of having ‘reach’ schools.
Some of the northeastern state schools like UConn and Rutgers have excellent pre-law programs. They don’t just get kids in, but really prepare them to be successful at law school.
As someone else noted, there are a lot of colleges that have Semester in Washington programs, but some of the regional and state schools also have good internship opportunities at the state capitals, where a lot of actual public policy is made.
If you’re still looking for new options, Dickinson could be worth checking out. Plus I’ll add my support for Franklin & Marshall and Gettysburg.
Don’t worry about the financial aspect. Many students need aid and many parents, esp of oldest kids, aren’t aware how much the cost has changed since their day. It’s common for those who can be full pay to say so which tends to eliminate the questions. When nothing is said, those of us posting online merely want to give a heads up. There’s no condemnation intended at all.
It’s Hamilton- of course it’s not “any old run-of-the-mill” program. But I stand over my opinion that it is a positive, not a decider.