<p>I thought I saw somewhere that the majority of students admitted to prep schools came from private schools. Does anyone have any numbers?</p>
<p>Do you sense that there is any advantage in the admission process to having come from private, rather than public, schools?</p>
<p>It varies from school to school; there is no industry "standard."</p>
<p>Thanks hazmat. That seems to be similar to some other numbers that I have seen (but that I can't seem to find right now!).</p>
<p>I guess I am wondering - if Exeter admits are 50/50 (private/public), does that represent the pool of applications that they are receiving. My guess (completely unsubstantiated) is that a greater percentage of private school applicants are accepted because they present a better profile.</p>
<p>But are there other factors, such as contacts between private schools and prep admissions?</p>
<p>My thoughts only. I believe there are strong relations between private schools and prep schools (BS). The Pre-prep BS and private schools k-8th or 9th, all have strong ties with most Prep schools. That's their business, so to speak. But as the Exeter website mentioned and many other BS , the make up is usually 50/ 50 to 60 / 40 private / public. In my area, there is a private school that only goes up to 9th grade and they were a feeder school to Choate. They can deny the feeder remark all they want but they sure had a good double digit percentage get admitted to Choate every year. Until, one of the admission people retired ( forget from which school) and the numbers dropped and new doors were opened. So yes the contacts exist, have to. But, I also know that all these BS make a very concerted effort every year for those prospective students who have no connections whatsoever. I gather from having spoken to Admission people that they recognize that those kids coming from the PS haven't really the chance to excel or blossom until or unless given the opportunity that BS has to offer. Legacy and alumni connections are all legit hooks but if there is what A/O feel is a better kid from Horse Cave, Kentucky who is charismatic, smart, out going and all around good kid, they're going to take Kentucky and pay for him too. The A/O make it very clear there is no given on acceptance prior to March 10th, accept of course rolling admissions. Current parents and alumni are duly advised that "just because" doesn't warrant acceptance. To go back to your initial question, I believe, there are advantages and disadvantages coming from private and public. Personally, coming from a private boys school and entering a coed BS certainly presented distractions. Preparedness and knowing what is expected is beneficial. Athletics, no problem, always to got play coming from private, had to play. The kid coming from PS is not phased at all with the coed scene. A whole new atmosphere and experience from PS. Maybe, a little academic shock in the beginning but if he or she is the right fit and the school did it's homework and did not accept a kid who will be in over his/her head, then the sky is the limit. I'm sure there is a lot more thoughts public vs. private matriculations to BS. In the end, I think it's a wash. Most importantly whether public or private, it will be an incredible, invaluable educating journey, appreciated for a lifetime.</p>
<p>interesting ops...</p>
<p>I happen to know that andover is 55 45 Private.</p>
<p>I also think that kids who come from private or jr boarding schools have better representation. These schools have good secondary placement counselors who do a great job advocating for their students. I dont think public schools have dedicated staff to do that.</p>
<p>I think the other big piece of this puzzle is what percentage of the applicant pool are private vs. public. My son attends private school and all of the students have applied to at least one private high school (most more than one). However, at our public middle school, only a very small handful of students are looking to apply to private high schools. Again, in the interest of creating a diverse community, I would think that the boarding schools would want a mixed between private and public applicants. So, when you get down to deciding the last 20% or so of an incoming class, this distinction might make a difference and then those last few spots might be private vs. private and public vs. public applicants. Of course, what do I know, I have no inner knowledge of adcom activities. But, it would be interesting to know this info.</p>
<p>I would think it's harder to get into Boarding School from a private school. Sure, the Boarding Schools know that most of the kids who go there are good... but if 50 kids are applying to the same school from the same private school, it makes it harder to get in. With public school, if you're the only one applying from that school, or even from that area, I would think that you have a better chance.</p>
<p>hockeymomofthree is absolutely correct regarding placement. The most significant advantage (in the admissions process anyway) offered at the school my boys attend is each placement counselor travels for three weeks in February to meet with the admissions staff of schools where students have applied. They review a comprehensive profile of each student/applicant. Generally, they agree on who should be accepted and likely rejected. In addition, the counselors will advocate for the questionable/marginal applicants.</p>
<p>There are only a few schools that are very unpredictable because of their high selectivity or relative unfamiliarity with the school (e.g. maybe one applicant each year from the school). The placement counselors do a fantastic job identifying appropriate schools for each student, preparing the students for the application process, and coordinating the information/recommendations sent to schools. </p>
<p>The effectiveness (and advantage) of this process is demonstrated each March. At the most selective schools, the acceptance rate is typically 2-3 times higher than the overall acceptance rate.</p>
<p>Most private schools have some sort of an admissions process, which means that the student body of a private school is a select group. It's like trying to gauge the success of prep schools from their college admissions success. As they get to choose the students they accept, each school chooses a significant number of students likely to succeed at the next step. </p>
<p>So, the kids at a pre-prep are surrounded by students who might be interested in applying to Andover, etc. However, they're also a group of students selected because (many of them are) likely to win admission to Andover. And, the pre-preps accept kids with a range of talents, so it's not as if ten tuba players will apply out from the same pre-prep to the same prep school.</p>
<p>The advantage comes in the curriculum, which prepares the students for a prep school, rather than the state's proficiency exams. There will be contests and honors to list on applications. And, the teachers will write very descriptive and supportive recommendations for their students. The pre-preps are also in favor of their students applying to prep schools, and getting in. That's a significant advantage, to judge from the number of applicants from public school who post stories here of their recalcitrant schools.</p>
<p>The much maligned SSAT really helps the student from public schools, who applies to an entirely different system of education than his own.</p>
<p>My D is applying to BS from a public school, and I feel compelled to add my two cents to a few of Perwinkle's observations. Namely:</p>
<p>[Private school teachers will write very descriptive recommendations for their students] with the implication that public school teachers may not and [Pre-preps are also in favor of their students applying to prep schools, and getting in]</p>
<p>How true! In my experience, this stems not from any malicious intent, but from ignorance and lack of resources.</p>
<p>My own experience: When I dropped off my D's recommendation forms, the counselor and principal were both too busy to see me, but the office clerk assured me that she would turn in the forms. I called the school the next day to confirm with the counselor that they had been received. She assured me that they had and that everything would be taken care of. A week later, I called back (to status her), asking if she had any questions or needed me to take care of the postage. She said, "Oh, my goodness. I will get right on that!" Mind you, we didn't get the notion to apply to BS until late November, so w/ the holidays, there wasn't too much time to waste. Three days later, she called me and asked what the forms were for... she had never seen these sorts of forms before. I was not surprised, I doubt anyone from that school ever went to BS. (Indeed, she was pronouncing Exeter as if it was EX-EATER and Groton as if it was GROW-TUN). I explained that they were boarding school recommendations... to some of the most prestigious schools in the U.S. I offered to bring in some money for postage, as I realize that the school has a limited amount of funds available for postage. The counselor said that that would speed up the process by at least a week or two. So I paid the school $40 for postage and brought in a ream of paper (for copying her transcripts), at their request.</p>
<p>Then, on January 15th, I get word that two of the recommendations were not mailed. The counselor states that Mrs. XXX didn't turn hers in. Strangely, this was my D's 7th grade teacher. I inquire why Mrs. XXX was filling out a rec at all, and the counselor informs me that she split the recs up between my D's 7th and 8th grade teachers. The teachers were overloaded and she didn't want them to have too much work. She said that she could see about getting it taken care of the next day... I tried to assure her as calmly (but firmly) as possible that it needed to be postmarked on the 15th at the latest. It was already 3 pm. Long story short, Mrs. XXX had left for the day, but teacher from current year was still at school and stayed late to write something up. She said she'd get it in the mail by the 4:30 pick-up. Hmmm... what could she come up w/ in about an hour? And she used her own stamp.</p>
<p>So was the counselor incompetent? I don't really think so. She's overworked. She's the only counselor in a school of 800 students, grades 6 - 12. </p>
<p>Was Mrs. XXX from 7th grade incompetent? She actually seemed like a lovely lady when I knew her. She taught 7 classes (no free period, to make extra money) and each class had 40 students. She was probably just very busy and BS apps were a back-burner sort of item.</p>
<p>My D has never attended a private school, so I'm not sure what they have to offer. I can only imagine that it's better than this.</p>
<p>My 2 cents.</p>
<p>Private schools which end in 8th grade are by far at an advantage, but not because of a buddy system with the BS, instead it is more like the college prep process of high schools.</p>
<p>PERSONAL SITUATION
My son goes to a private PK-12th college prep school.
I sent my son into SSAT without any prep.</p>
<p>No help with essays, etc. but teachers & counselors were great about timely completing recs.</p>
<p>Only 2 issues -- 1 the registrar neglected to included 6th grade transcript, so we had to get that sent separate -- registar did timely send 1st quarter 8th grade & all 7th grade.
issue 2 -- teacher's who did his recs were busy with college recs too and the college recs were definitely a high priority for the teachers.</p>
<p>COMPARISON
We know a teacher from a private K-8th school. She did recs for all her students. Her students all received SSAT prep help & study groups. The school helped with essay edits, etc where appropriate. </p>
<p>IMO
Teachers at private K-8 where kids are expected to move into a BS/prep school take into account the admission process when issuing long term projects or when kids miss due to interviews and visits. And nothing helps a kid like knowing their friends are completing the same process. Much easier to vent about the dreaded essays.</p>
<p>One thing that CKSABS mentioned that I have been thinking about is the idea that the pre-preps can help steer the students towards schools where they think they will be admitted and be successful.</p>
<p>My child is applying from public school, and while I have used websites and CC to try to guage where she might be a good candidate, I have no idea how things will work out on 3/10. Of course no one does, but I think if I had an experienced person who had seen other students like my child go through this process, I would have a better feel.</p>
<p>I think applying from a public school definentely has its challenges, but also its advantages. </p>
<p>Challenges:
Last spring my d applied to several summer programs and we got a taste of how stressful it would be getting all the recommendations and transcripts we needed. Based on that experience, at the beginning of this school year, my d and I went to each teacher and explained that she was applying to boarding schools, why, where the schools were, the particular advantages for her etc. We got them interested in the process and interested in her succeeding. In September they knew we would be sending recommendation forms and when we sent them in November we told them that they would need to be mailed before the Christmas break. They were all very cooperative. The only problem we had was with the principals report, that was prepared by her counselor. I had to go to the counselor's office a day before Christmas break, with a tray of cookies, sit there for two hours why they prepared the reports, made copies of documents, collated everything etc. I did not leave until they had placed the documents in the mail. I think you really have to manage this process. Before I left every secrtary in the office was invested in ensuring my d had everything in. I was at her school yesterday and three teachers asked if we had any news yet and to let them know when I did. </p>
<p>Advantages:
I think a high scoring kid from public school is impressive. They have no formal preparation like some of the private schools, yet when the kid does well I think it suggests they have the intellect, at least, to thrive at boarding school.</p>
<p>Also, those extra curricular activities and community service don't seem like resume padding or that they are participating as a requirement of the private school. </p>
<p>Also, we had really good conversations with interviewers about how we came to visit their schools. I think it showed a lot of initiative on the part of d and a really geniune interest in the school. </p>
<p>And, we entered the process without any inherent biases towards schools based on tiers. We were more focused on where we felt d would be happy and able to thrive than the advantages of having a certain school on her resume. As a result, we did not limit our choices based on name, but came up with a diverse list of schools across the tiers.</p>
<p>lol, cookie and postage bribery! </p>
<p>I have to say that as middle class parents, we are the bottom of the income scale at Boarding School and I think part of the reason is that the process itself is so difficult. It takes the cooperation of the teachers and coaches, the secretaries with transcripts, an organization-minded parent with the dates all in hand and the persistence to stay in the office until it gets mailed. </p>
<p>I live in an area with lots of kids in poverty. Surely some of them would benefit from Boarding School. Have they heard of it? Could their parents and schools get these applications done? I doubt it.</p>
<p>emdee, I hope you are right about the advantages.</p>
<p>"I live in an area with lots of kids in poverty. Surely some of them would benefit from Boarding School. Have they heard of it? Could their parents and schools get these applications done? I doubt it."</p>
<p>So true! I've always felt that anyone who could manage or navigate the multi-step, multi-year process of BS or Pre-Prep admissions could run a corporation or deserves an MBA. The process is daunting. </p>
<p>But the same could be said of the process for applying for SSI, subsidized health care, Earned income credit, or food stamps. The prize (BS, government aid) goes to the persistent soul with a flare for paperwork, not necessarily tied to income.</p>
<p>Britain attempted to place "young people in care" in boarding schools. For some reason, it has not taken off. Boarding</a> plan for vulnerable children fails to take hold - Times Online</p>
<p>The state would have paid the fees, which are less than the cost of a child "in care."
[quote]
An evaluation found that although young people who took part found it very beneficial, only a small proportion of those identified by local authorities as potential candidates got through the selection process to take up a place. A third of these dropped out.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Programs like A Better Chance and Prep for Prep are great at targeting inner city kids, guiding them through the application process and preparing them for the academic rigors of BS. What is truely lacking IMHO is a process of targeting low income students from less populated areas whether small cities or rural areas.</p>