Preliminary audition CD

<p>D and I are preparing the preliminary CD. We have no idea of the level of performance has to be in order to be invited to the live audition. We need input from pareents and musician who have beeb throuth this process before. Thanks.</p>

<p>The fact that a school even requires a preliminary CD is a good indication that they have a lot more applicants than spaces. If the ratio were only about three to one, they could skip the preliminary round and let everyone audition. If that ratio is a little higher, then they might use the preliminary round to weed out those who have no chance at all and would be simply wasting everyone's time if they auditioned.</p>

<p>If you are looking at top music schools with popular flute instructors, they may get twenty or more applications for every student they plan to accept. In such cases, if your CD is not in the top 10% or so, they will probably not invite you in for a live audition. You want that CD to be as good as you have time to make it.</p>

<p>I know a soprano who was making the audition rounds a couple of years back. She was in all-state choir all four years and all-Eastern twice. Her mother is a professional choir director and had her singing practically before she could talk. Her CD was recorded and produced at a professional studio with a professional accompanist and it sounded fabulous. I was amazed that she was not invited for a live audition at most of the schools that required a preliminary CD. She eventually got into St. Olaf off the wait list and loves it there.</p>

<p>Have not been there yet but there were about 4 schools I looked up in my research that required preliminary CD for flute audition. You best look at the schools requirements, they probably have specific pieces or types of pieces they want on the disc. Too bad it isnt the same for all schools. Fortunately only a handful require the pre audition screening, unless I missed some in my search.</p>

<p>BassDad I wish it was 20 per open spot, that would be an unpopular program. Try 150 for the real competive programs that often take 1 or 2 flute players.</p>

<p>We certainly won't be able to go the professional route to produce the CD. Basically we are on our own. Because of her teachers' schedule, we will have to record each audition piece several times and have her teachers pick the best ones. What I am wondering is the purpose of the prelim CD. Is it to weed out students who mainly play in the school band and yet think that they are conservatory material or does it function like a serious competition that only the best few will be selected to audition live? Thus my question of how good the playing should be. I realize that every instrument is different and flute will be a brutal one. But if only the best few will be selected, the same best few will be in every school's final list. Maybe I will have my daughter ask these school of the prelim CD stats.</p>

<p>Just my opinion since DD is going through this now, but I'm not sure doing a professional CD does you any service. If it is that refined then there is the possibility of alot of editing going on. I would think the colleges would rather hear something less professional with no editing.</p>

<p>I would assume it is the same quality level as CDs produced for summer program auditions. Just high quality CD that you can record yourself or your teacher. I don't think you need professional recording studio, although I would wager there are many that will do that. </p>

<p>It would be interesting to know how many CDs they get and how many end up in person auditioning. Some schools probably get 200 CDs from kids that are at least all state level and they may see 50 in person??? for one or two spots that are accepted. But that is just a guess. </p>

<p>You can probably make as many copies as you need on your computer with little difficulty. Once its on CD, copies are simple. Its a matter of the different requirements of different schools. Several you can use the same piece and maybe one different piece. Some require orchestra excerpts or a third piece. Some give you some flexibility some are very specific.</p>

<p>ie</p>

<p>Flute preliminary audition CDs (all programs except AD):
1. Mozart – Exposition of 1st and 2nd movements of the Concerto
in G or D major
2. Contrasting piece of the candidate’s choice
3. Orchestral Excerpts:
A. Beethoven Leonore Overture No. 3 – measures 328-360
B. Brahms Symphony No. 4, last movement – measures 93-105
C. Mendelssohn Scherzo from Midsummer Nights Dream –
2 measures before P to the end</p>

<p>In theory, editing is not allowed but D's piano teacher thinks that many of them did, especially those auditioning for Juilliard. We always played by the rules when recording CD for summer camp audtions or prelim round competitions. And we will continue to play by the rules.</p>

<p>It seems to me that if a school is going to get over a hundred applications for one or two positions, then they are going to want to use the taped round to eliminate more than the clueless. Even if as many as half of the applicants fit that description, they would still have way too many auditions to sit through.</p>

<p>Editing is strictly forbidden in every taped audition that I have ever heard about. That doesn't mean that it doesn't happen but it takes some experience and discipline to produce edits that would go undetected by trained ears. In fact, some schools now request video recordings in part because they are even harder to edit cleanly with no detectable discontinuities in audio, video or synchronization. Besides, if someone has to edit their recordings to get through the preliminaries, they are not going to stand much of a chance in the live auditions. They are mostly wasting their own and others' resources.</p>

<p>The main difference between studio recordings and those done by most amateurs is that the studio should have an assortment of professional-quality microphones, they should know exactly which of them to use and where to place them relative to the instrument to capture the best sound. The next biggest difference is that the studios know how to set levels appropriately so that the recording is neither too soft to hear clearly nor so loud that it sounds distorted.</p>

<p>I have heard the stories of people getting into their dream school on the basis of a recording they made themselves on a $25 Radio Shack portable cassette player with a built-in mic. I have also heard stories of teachers tossing recordings in the trash after 15 seconds of listening because the poor audio quality made it impossible for them to tell very much about the auditioner's playing. Care to guess which happens more frequently?</p>

<p>As a fairly serious performing musician, an electrical engineer by profession and someone who has spent many hours on both sides of the glass in the studio, I think the pros have something to offer when it comes to making college-level audition tapes. Since there is not going to be any mix-down or editing involved and you can do your own duplication once you have the master, all you want the studio to do is record a stereo track to CD and perhaps a little mastering afterward. It need not be all that expensive if you are well-prepared and focused in the studio.</p>

<p>I sat in on a lecture about recordings that included explanations of how editing could be detected and the gentlemen himself did that kind of sleuthing for many organizations on audition recordings. I know any recording that you buy, such as James Galway are significantly edited and sections of performance mixed from better takes and breathing sound removed, etc.</p>

<p>I agree why would you do that for a preliminary round when the live audition would expose the truth.</p>

<p>Room accoustics and the correct microphone and locations of microphone(s) and comparitive location of piano to the flute are all things a professional might do better. Wish we had the money to consider that option. I have heard some amateur recordings that sounded pretty bad.</p>

<p>I saw a TV show on recording of pop artists and they actually went in and changed notes so they would not be flat or sharp. Guy said you can take anyone and make them sound like they can sing well with modern electronics and enough editing time.</p>

<p>My son has run into a couple of competitions that will now only accept videotape for preliminary auditions because it is so difficult to edit without detection.</p>

<p>The purpose of the preliminary tape is to get a sense of which candidates have a strong chance of being accepted to the school. The actual percentage of applicants invited from the preliminary pool varies between institutions and from instrument to instrument.
As far as recording quality goes - it really doesn't matter too much after a certain point. As long as the tape accurately reflects the abilities of the applicant it doesn't really matter whether it was recorded on a minidisc player or at Skywalker Ranch.</p>

<p>What counts as editing? Let's say the student is supposed to include 4 pieces on the CD. Is it okay to record each piece more than once and then put the best version of each piece onto the final CD? Or is it necessary that all 4 pieces be played back-to-back in a single "take" and that's your CD?</p>

<p>That would not be editing. If you split and paste together a piece or go in and change notes or levels. take out errors or add sound effects etc that is editing.</p>

<p>But you can record as many takes as you want and pick the best, it is still you playing unedited.</p>

<p>Do your very best in the pre-screening CDs, and definitely try a professional studio if you can afford it. That is the best I can advice. I have terrible pre-screening CD experience last year... Order the tracks on your CD so that the one with the best opening is the first track. My best guess is that it takes only a few seconds for them to decide to weed out some one, so great performance of an entire piece is useless if you have a mediocre beginning. That's the nature of the beast.</p>

<p>I agree with thzxcyl. Put your best foot forward. If you don't catch their interest in the first 30 seconds (or perhaps even the first 15) they may not listen much longer.</p>

<p>Just noticed this thread--and at the risk of sounding...well...at any rate, is this discussion exclusive to the submission of recordings and/or auditions for seniors and their respective program applications? Juniors need not be overly concerned at the moment? Thanks. Having said that, does anyone have any experience whereby their children, during typical Junior year visits at particular schools, have scheduled appointments to "audition", or have had the informal opportunity to "audition" for Music Dept heads and/or professors during their visit? Does this happen?</p>

<p>Classical dad - the closest that most juniors come to this is to schedule lessons with teachers with whom they are interested in studying. This isn't really an audition per se, it is more a way for students to learn about a teacher's particular approach and teaching style. However, it would be naive to think that the teacher doesn't form some kind of opinion about the desirability of having that student in his or her studio. This is certainly something that most of us experienced parents on this board encourage students to pursue.</p>

<p>I agree that the prelim tape should show your best effort because the committee will assume you recorded until you had your best take. That being said, here's a story from my daughter's experience that you won't want to happen to you:</p>

<p>In the fall of her senior year, my daughter and her teacher had narrowed down her college auditions to three schools-----the list did not include Juilliard. It so happened that in mid-November Carol Wincenc, the flute teacher at Juilliard came to play the Foss concerto with the local symphony and to give a master class at which my daughter played the Nielsen. After my daughter finished playing, Ms. Wincenc encouraged her to apply to Juilliard. Pretty heady stuff!</p>

<p>But, we only had two weeks to get all of the application materials in before the Dec. 1st deadline. We had less time for the tape, because the accompanist was leaving town the next weekend for the Thanksgiving holiday. We ended up getting a one hour session in a college recital hall where there was time for a warm-up, sound check and to whistle through the concerto and the orchestral excerpts twice. My daughter's teacher had already left town for the holiday, as had the usual hall recording engineer, so we had a college student handle the recording. ----The resulting tape was OK, but not great. It had a number of mistakes in it, and did not reflect her best effort. --Looking back, I think we figured that since Ms. Wincenc had heard my daughter play live, the tape was a formality.</p>

<p>Well, need less to say, we figured wrong. My daughter was rejected without the opportunity for a live audition. Although we could be wrong, since she later was accepted at both Eastman and Northwestern, we feel she was good enough to at least get an audition, and that it was most likely the tape that was the problem. In any event, why take a chance? Submit a good recording!</p>

<p>PatN, are you the PatN from Cinci?</p>

<p>Could you give any advice on the process that helped your daughter narrow her decision to Eastman and Northwestern? Seems flute advice is a bit different than advice for other instruments and very hard to get very much.</p>

<p>She must have been on a great high when Carol suggested she apply to Julliard. What a nice honor. Sorry to hear you had recording problems, its always a headache even for competitions and summer programs to get a good recording made. Doing one for prelim aud has to be even worse. We have met Carol and heard her play. She seems very nice and helpful to her students. Julliard isnt on our list, a bit ambitious and in NYC. The additional expense of NYC is tough. But we are considering trying for her at StonyBrook, although not high on our early list.</p>

<p>Check with the Stony Brook music department before you invest any effort. SB has some very well-known, part time faculty members but often they are restricted to teaching graduate students. My D had a strong personal recommendation and after the 2nd audition, we thought an exception was likely. That was not the case.</p>