<p>just to correct one still-uncontested posterX mistruth:</p>
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<p>The same trend would hold if you charted the % of the class who are NMSC-Sponsored National Merit Scholars, which I have tracked over time</p>
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<p>here are the numbers:</p>
<p>School: 2002 2003 2004 2005 (2004–2005 change) – estimated 2005 percentage of class </p>
<p>Harvard: 396 378 312 287 (-25) – 17.5% </p>
<p>Yale: 180 228 224 232 (+8) – 17.5% </p>
<p>Princeton: 149 165 192 180 (-12) – 14.7% </p>
<p>if you had really tracked these numbers over time, X, you'd know that since 2003, princeton has experienced a 9% increase in the number of NMS scholars, while yale has seen a mere 2% increase, and harvard a curious 24% DECREASE. so, so much for your trend.</p>
<p>With your "percentage increase" terms, f.scottie, keep in mind that this translates to less than 10 students when you compare an "increase" of 9% to 2%. That's not at all relevant to the discussion. The real story is the percentage makeup of the class. The big story in your numbers is clearly the decline at Harvard between 2002 and 2005, coinciding with Harvard losing its place as the most selective school in the country to Yale. But if you go back further than your arbitrarily selected 2003, the numbers will change even more. The fact is that Princeton and Yale used to have virtually identical percentages of NMSC-sponsored scholars hovering near 11% of the class year after year (for example, in 1998, 11.2% at Yale versus 10.6% at Princeton). Clearly, something changed. Princeton got a few more, but Yale got a lot more.</p>
<p>As far as the increase in applications that PtonGrad2000 discussed, here are a few figures over a longer, much more significant, time period:</p>
<p>% Increase in Applications
Fall 98-Fall 05</p>
<p>Yale +76.2%
Columbia +61.0%
Cornell +41.5%
Harvard +35.1%
Princeton +34.4%</p>
<p>Or, from Fall 99-Fall 05:
Yale +58.6%
Cornell +40.8%
Princeton +17.5%</p>
<p>Clearly, Princeton hasn't kept up the pace.</p>
<p>I remember posterX told prospectives a while back that Yale was by god and something else he swore Yale was going to leapfrog both Princeton and Harvard this year... </p>
<p>Seems he was wrong .... again .... surprise anyone?</p>
<p>I don't remember that, but I do remember a few people suggesting it as a possibility. Given that Yale is now the most selective school in the country (which will be reflected more clearly in the 08 rankings), it certainly seems like a possibility in the near term, particularly if USNWR starts using valid data. Also, you seem to forget that there are obviously many other rankings besides USNWR, for example, the fact that Yale had 3 Rhodes and 4 Marshall Scholars this year when no other Ivy had more than 1 Rhodes or more than 2 Marshalls. So, yes, indeed, Yale may have "leapfrogged" over the competition. </p>
<p>Princeton may continue to be #1 in the U.S. News and World Report rag for the next 10 years, but that doesn't seem to be helping their anemic application levels (see above; from 99-06, when Princeton had many years as the supposed "#1", their apps went up only 17% while Yale's rose by nearly 60%). Princeton now has the 4th lowest acceptance rate in the League, after Yale, Harvard, and Columbia. It also didn't make the top 40 in Washington Monthly, ranking almost 40 spots below Cornell, despite claiming to have the same basic demographics as its more cosmopolitan Ivy League brethren that WM preferred probably because of their greater levels of civic involvement. Relatively speaking, its SAT and NMSC-Merit Scholar levels have dropped too. As I said, people consider more than just US News.</p>
<p>That said, there's no reason to bash Princeton - it is an illustrious university. Easily one of the best. But there's no problem in disputing the unfounded claims of Princetonians.</p>
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I don't remember that, but I do remember a few people suggesting it as a possibility
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</p>
<p>I'm sure you don't remember. Perhaps you should remind us about the beastiality club at Yale which you were a very active member? Was it a donkey or a goat that was the centre of attention? Who was the double adaptor?</p>
<p>Since we're talking about yale, can you also enlighten us about mysterious cases of stolen bycicles? I've heard from some very "credible" sources that 1 in 2 bycicles are stolen each month at YALE and generally the owner can find it again (in a different colour of course) if they look around the slums of New Haven. Is it a ritual you guys have to steal bikes for fun? Must be because its unsafe to venture off the high security campX styled security yale has...</p>
<p>I don't think anyone has a problem with the ranking. Like I said, it would be even better if it helped them get a few more apps. As far as the bikes, you're thinking about Columbia.</p>
<p>posterX is a self-identified "HS Class of 2012" student, yet he's been singing the praises of yale on college message boards since at least 1997. a rather precocious kid, wouldn't you say?</p>
<p>I'm a national merit scholar who chose Princeton...but I don't really see what the big deal is. It's not as if these colleges directly compete for NMS students, since they aren't named until after acceptances are mailed. A useless statistic, if you ask me.</p>
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[quote]
As far as the bikes, you're thinking about Columbia.
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<p>Safe to say not many find need to bike around our compact and uneven grounds. No, bike thefts sound very New Haven, though the least of problems there...</p>
<p>Any avid cyclist knows that NYC is where bike theft can be a lucrative career. Anywhere else, bike thieves are amateurs.</p>
<p>The percentages of NMSC-sponsored NMS students, iv4me, have been a commonly used measure of selectivity as far back as anyone can remember. These are the top 2500 students in the entire country. Nobody competes for them directly, but the fact that they end up clustering at the very top schools - with about 40% of them clustering at HYPS, and with much, much smaller fractions at any of the other Ivies or elites - means that this is easily one of the most objective and best measure of selectivity. </p>
<p>As far as the high school thing, please note that I selected "other," not "student." Could that mean I was looking on behalf of someone interested in the class of 2012?</p>
<p>Going back to the question, how come Princeton's apps have stagnated despite the school being ranked #1 in USNWR year after year?</p>