<p>Ok so for a while now Princeton has been my dream school. It's near home, offers great research and would allow me to explore my interests in the fine arts as well as have an astrophysics major.
I am however concerned about the environment at Princeton. I am without a doubt STEM oriented person and I hope to do a minor in math along with astrophysics, so I want to be surrounded by STEM oriented people (I just find I make stronger bonds with those people because we typically can relate more and I just LOVE nerds!!!).
Because of this concern I'm considering to apply early to MIT instead of early at Princeton, and I would really like some input on whether Princeton could offer me that kind of environment. If it does that would be perfect and I will do EA at Princeton!!</p>
<p>This is my deviant art page so you can see my interest in art is not unwarranted:
[url=<a href="http://xochellexo.deviantart.com/%5Dxochellexo">http://xochellexo.deviantart.com/]xochellexo</a> on deviantART<a href="go%20to%20second%20page%20of%20gallery%20for%20my%20better%20work">/url</a>
I have commissioned/sold/published artwork and designed logos for businesses
Doubled up in Advanced Art soph year --> AP Studio Art: 2D (5) --> AP Studio Art: Drawing</p>
<p>I have also shown active interests in the math and sciences:
Co-founded Science Olympiad team at my school 3yr (pres)
Founded Science Bowl team 3yr (pres)
President of Youth Environmental Society 3yr (helps local environment and raises money)
Active member of Science League (No officers) and Robotics (head of design)
Doubled up in Chem/Physics soph year --> AP Chem (5) --> AP Bio and AP Physics C
Self taught Precalc over the summer --> Calc BC (5) junior year --> Calc 3 over summer --> linear algebra this fall --> Diff Eq in the spring
Concentrated study in Astrophysics this year
Attended Physics of the Atomic Nuclei Programs at MSU and Notre Dame
QuarkNET internship at Rutgers University
Biochemistry internship at Rutgers University
Member of the Cyclotron guild at Rutgers University</p>
<p>I know Princeton has an amazing astrophysics program, which is what I want to major in, but I am worried that there wouldnt be enough emphasis on the STEM fields and STEM people should I go there. So should I EA Princeton or EA at MIT and other schools?
If any of you know about the environment at either school, that would be amazing to know about:)
THANK YOU for all of your input! I really appreciate it!</p>
<p>If you really want to be around STEM people all the time, then Princeton might be too liberal artsy for you. Not to say there is no STEM oriented people there (they’re everywhere), but I am sure there are probably many more at a place like MIT. However, if Princeton is your dream school and you are comfortable with the idea of being around STEM and non-STEM people then you should use your EA there. And I promise, there are going to be plenty of nerds in the at either of these schools, even in the art and humanity departments (despite MIT being all mathy and sciency). And if you want a more meaningful education, you might want to go to Princeton because there is not as many STEM people there. In the end it is up to you. I wish you luck with your decision. Remember have have matches and safeties, though in case neither of these work out for you ('cause you never know).</p>
<p>First of all, it is true that, in general, Ivies are not top tier in Engineering (though even this is not of concern for Princeton, which is ranked top 10 in engineering in many rankings), but they are excellent places for pure science, such as physics. Princeton has top-notch programs in sciences and math. I personally know many excellent future scientists going there. I would understand if you were concerned about Yale, since it significantly leans towards the social sciences/humanities side of things, but STEM at Princeton is really excellent. For Pure sciences, Princeton is just as good as MIT.</p>
<p>Another thing to consider: SCEA at Princeton has a significant statistical advantage in terms of admissions, while EA at MIT does not (in fact, one year the EA rate for MIT was less than the RD rate). And with two top schools like this, you really can’t go wrong.</p>
<p>The Princeton nerd culture is very strong and Princeton does extremely well in all rankings of STEM fields. Princeton STEM majors also do extraordinarily well in the tech industry. </p>
<p>Heres a ranking that Bloomberg just published for the top ten undergraduate colleges for Tech CEOs. Given how much smaller Princetons graduating classes are than the other schools on this list, its position at the top is even more remarkable.</p>
<p>Thank you! Nihilus, that statistic actually really helps as does knowing that about Princeton.
Also thanks Latin4Life, I will take that into consideration. My biggest worry is that it would be too liberal artsy because I just would like the be surrounded by STEM nerds but it does seem to be the only thing wrong with MIT.</p>
<p>Would either of you know how the rigor of Princeton and MIT compare? I have told MIT is very intense and though I work well under pressure, I wouldnt want to kill myself. Since they are both top tier schools I would expect theyre similar but I am curious</p>
<p>Edit:
To Pton, do you know about the graduate studies statistics? I plan on going for a PhD after undergrad.</p>
I found this to be quite amusing. How do you gauge if someone is going to be an excellent scientist in the future? You probably know many smart people going there who are majoring in science and doing quite well, but I wouldn’t go so far as to say they are “excellent future scientists.” </p>
<p>Anyway, OP, I would suggest visiting these two schools or talking to people who go to these schools to gain more of an insight about the environment. You can PM me if you want. There are several MIT grads around here. I was stuck choosing between MIT and Princeton also. I was going to be a science major. About halfway through freshman year, my major changed drastically. I became a social science major. I was lucky to have gone to Princeton, where I could change my intended major and still be in classes with top notch people and top notch professors. MIT has a strong humanities program, but nowhere near as strong as Princeton’s. </p>
<p>There are definitely a lot of STEM nerds at Princeton. Of course, you’re going to find more at MIT, but you’d probably get tired of encountering predominantly only one type of person all the time. Right now, your worries are almost pre-mature. You should apply EA to the one you want to go to more. Then, you can apply RD to the other one. If you want to play the statistics, Princeton would probably be the better EA choice. However, it’s your decision. Then, after you find out if you’re admitted to one or both, you can ask this question. Perhaps the answer will be decided for you by admissions anyway. Good luck!</p>
<p>Tiger, I have very little interest in the humanities other than the fine arts (I’m weird I guess…) because I just love physics (AH particle and astrophysics <3), chem, bio, math, engineering etc. Though that is a value that Princeton has in which I would be able to pursue pretty strong art (it’s not RISD but hey I’ve heard pretty good things about the program and I have gone into the art buildings since I live like 15 min away from Princeton)
I was also asking this question because it would help me decide where I would want to go more (and thus know where to apply early).</p>
<p>As for grad prospects with Princeton, sorry I didn’t mean to make it unclear. I was curious about the statistics of other grad students from princeton at other universities (like how many graduate from Princeton to go off to a top grad program?)</p>
<p>I appreciate your response!! I do like the idea of flexibility artwise at Princeton</p>
Oh. I can’t find exact statistics, but I do know that many, many from Princeton go to top grad programs. That’s because grad programs heavily emphasize research and publications for admissions. Princeton’s unique senior thesis compels research for all undergraduates. Additionally, Princeton’s unparalleled focus on undergraduate students affords undergrads more research opportunities. Thus, many Princeton grads go on to top graduate programs.</p>
<p>My son just graduated as a physics concentrator with a certificate in applied mathematics. He could have surrounded himself with STEM types 24/7, but he preferred more diversity. As for grad school prospects, they are good for Princeton STEM grads. He seemed to be on track for admittance to top physics grad programs, but early in his senior year he received a job offer that was too good to pass up.</p>
<p>Is it easy to get into research early on? I know I will be applying for the PPPL internship for high schoolers next summer (I applied this year and didn’t get it) and if I were to go to Princeton next year and get rejected from that program again, I would probably want to look into getting research started right away with some professor. I am already connected with one in the astrophysics department, but how willing are they in taking on pre-freshman/freshman?</p>
<p>Sherpa: How many classes are typically needed to get a certificate? For example, what math classes after calc 3/diff eq did your son take?</p>
At Princeton, of all places, it would be easier. Because Princeton is devoted to undergraduate teaching. There are twice the number of undergrads as there are grads, and no professional programs. Thus, professors are more open to undergrad research. But that depends on professor, of course. It also depends on your past experience and how much time you’re willing to dedicate to the lab. From what I’ve heard, professors prefer students who are willing to dedicate several years to the lab, to make up for the training and development. </p>
<p>As for freshmen, I know two who worked in chemistry labs as freshmen. I mean, the opportunities won’t fall in front of you - you have to ask and go looking for them, but that’s the general rule. As a freshman, I also did some research, in the social sciences.</p>
<p>@ 93Tiger16, Hasty wording makes for awkward observations</p>
<p>@xochellexo </p>
<ol>
<li><p>Princeton has a very rigorous program as well. All top schools, of course, are rigorous, but Princeton has a few added challenges. The grade deflation policy there, which has been in place for several years, means that to get an A, a student really has to do excellent work. (don’t let this worry you, btw, the effect of deflation on STEM majors was apparently insignificant, since STEM is already hard)</p></li>
<li><p>At top colleges, most undergrads do research (many pride themselves on this fact and display the statistic in pamphlets an info sessions). If you want to do research in college, you will certainly get the opportunity. I applied for PPPL as well this year, and was rejected, along with everyone else at my school. Very few opportunities for internships are available to high school students, even fewer in areas as exciting as the PPPL, so the competition is incredibly tough. Also, my test scores are some of my strengths, and the PPPL app, I think, didn’t ask for them. You might fare better in that your EC’s and schedule are excellent, and your test scores don’t matter since the app doesn’t consider them.</p></li>
<li><p>While Princeton’s grad schools may be below some other schools in rankings, that is mainly because it focuses on an undergrad experience. The grad school presence there is small, especially compared to schools like Harvard where the college is, arguably, overshadowed by the HLS and HBS.</p></li>
<li><p>I’m applying to both Pton and MIT too, this year. Visit both campuses if you haven’t already. Learn about their culture. You can’t go wrong, but if you get the golden opportunity of being able to choose between the two, you want to be well researched for your decision.</p></li>
</ol>
Grade deflation is very real and as the above poster said, you really have to do A-level work to get an A. But I find that to be very fair and it has been very fair in my classes. I got A’s on what I thought I deserved A’s on. It really should be standard across colleges, but it’s just sad that so many colleges have grade inflation today. There was virtually no change in STEM majors, as the policy was intended to target the humanities, where grading is more subjective. In fact, you’ll find that STEM is graded similarly almost anywhere you go, especially at MIT. </p>
<ol>
<li><p>The only rankings that matter here, to the OP, presumably, are the rankings for math and physics. According to USNWR (take it as you will), Princeton is ranked #2 in math, tied with Harvard, and #5 in Physics. But I do have to say that Princeton has an excellent physics program. I know a graduate student in the program and she came to Princeton because of the reputed strength of the program. But Princeton is strong in many other departments in the humanities as well, as you can see here: [Best</a> Social Science & Humanities Programs | Top Social Science & Humanities Schools | US News Best Graduate Schools](<a href=“http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-humanities-schools?int=3.7e+60]Best”>http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-humanities-schools?int=3.7e+60)
This is also the school that brings you Paul Krugman, Nobel Laureate in Economics; Peter Singer, renowned utilitarian philosopher and involved in several renowned international organizations for ethics; Robert George, recognized by some as the world’s most influential Christian conservative thinker; Osamu Shimomura, Nobel Laureate for bringing you the green fluorescent protein; and Christopher Sims, Nobel Laureate in Economics, to name a few. </p></li>
<li><p>This will definitely be easy for you, since you live in Jersey. Princeton is only a short car ride away and you can come up for Preview if you get in. MIT is only a train ride away and you can go up there too, for their Preview day.</p></li>
</ol>