Hmmm. Am I the only one who doesn’t think that MI or WI would not be a good fit? They are both great, or at least vg schools, but I don’t think of them as hippie, crunchy schools located in a small, cute town. AA and Madison are cities…maybe not big cities, but cities. The campuses are both known for their big time D1 Athletics, and student energy. WI is certainly known as a partying school, and MI can keep up, also.
No offense, and it’s probably too late, but it sounds like your D is LAC material. I could see somewhere like Carleton being perfect from your description of her and her wishes.
Yes, she’s applied to a few LACs – namely, Macalester (she was admitted EA), Middlebury, Wesleyan, Kenyon and Smith. We haven’t heard from any of them except Macalester, which she is definitely curious about. She hasn’t really made up her mind on big vs. small, so I thought it might be useful to read about the experiences from the big schools and be able to compare and contrast them separately from the LACs, which would offer a very different experience.
Pay attention to each airport’s tendency to have weather delays during each college travel season. Being stuck at O’Hare overnight because your first flight was delayed while the one you wanted to connect to left already is no fun.
Yep, been there… more than once. I’m sure it’ll happen in her travels at some point. She’s a well-seasoned traveler and we’ve gone through it as a family so I’m sure it’ll be a hassle but not the end of the world.
Be careful of accepting additional connections just to chase airline miles. Remember that an additional connection adds a few hours of travel time (or much more if a missed connection occurs due to airline delays) – is your time worth whatever benefit airline miles on your preferred airline may give (especially as airlines devalue airline miles)?
For example, if your job pays you at a rate equivalent to $50 per hour, an extra two hours for a connection costs you $100 of your time at the rate your job pays (and an overnight for a missed connection would cost $500 or more of your time). Would getting airline miles on your preferred airline for one way be worth that much compared to a non-stop on some other airline?
Nah, I just like that she’ll get automatic premium seating/boarding priority on United and if there’s a problem i can call the dedicated line and get someone to fix it If there’s a direct flight on a different airline, you can bet she’ll be on it (ie, Delta’s SFO > Detroit)
Here’s a question since we talk about distance and travel here.
Is Oregon the West Coast UVM? I ask - because with a somewhat hippie/liberal vibe (Eugene and Burlington), maybe it’s the West Coast solution - should UVM be the ultimate favorite but lose points for difficulty of access?
in Niche, for what it’s worth, UVM is #3 liberal and Oregon #10 - out of 1700.
Michigan has a Residential College housed in East Quad that is roughly 800 students and makes the university feel very, very small.
Combining the vibrant intellectual atmosphere of a small college with the resources of a large research university.
The Residential College (RC) is a four-year interdisciplinary liberal arts program within the College of Literature, Science and Arts (LSA) at the University of Michigan-Ann Arbor. Founded in 1967, the RC is often described as a living-learning community; this is because RC students live and learn in the same physical space: East Quadrangle Residence Hall. The RC community encourages and welcomes participation by everyone associated with it – staff, students, faculty, friends, and alumni.
The RC curriculum is interdisciplinary and engages students in creative exploration of the humanities, the social and natural sciences, intensive foreign language study, and the visual and performing arts. We seek to foster a genuine appreciation and lifelong passion for learning; not merely individual quests for knowledge, but preparation and encouragement that lead to effective and responsible engagement in the real world.
By combining typical residence hall facilities (dorm rooms, lounges, dining halls, etc.) with the academic and artistic resources required for a liberal arts education (classrooms, creative arts studios, faculty offices, performance and exhibit spaces, and student support services) the RC makes a unique contribution to higher education – a small college fully integrated with a major and highly respected public university.
Another huge benefit of the RC is that it guarantees housing on central campus the first two years.
DH and I lived in EQ all four years and took many classes right there in the dorm though I wasn’t officially an RC student. I majored in English where the majority of my classes were just across the Diag at Angell Hall. Michigan felt tiny to me as I rarely left central campus, never once went to north campus (at the time, north campus was mostly engineering/medical), and never went to football games (I don’t do crowds). DH lived on my hall and was an RC student majoring in Econ/Poli Sci. He rarely left the dorm or Diag for classes either. For us, East Quad WAS Michigan.
Another plus for the RC; East Quad has a rep for being the hippie dorm.
My kid went to Wisconsin out of state, had an amazing academic and social experience, so I can share some info about his experience. In terms of setting, Madison is a smaller city but has both great nature and great urban-ness, so students can find what they love. My kid loved the bustling, high rise dorms, whereas others love the Lakeshore dorms with nature trails and green space. Campus adjoins State Street, a hipness-haven. Great foodie scene with lots of farm-to-table restaurants and weekend farmers’ market at the Capitol. Liberal politics in the city, suburbs and surrounding areas will be more “purple” and “red.”
Travel: there is the Van Gilder coach bus service between O’Hare to campus, with departures every hour, give or take. The bus trip is about 2 hours 45-50 min.
Academics: highly ranked Poli Sci dept (my kid was double Poli Sci and History major). Lots of other excellent departments, plus incredible breadth of language offerings among African, Middle-Eastern and Asian languages. Honors program is different from many schools – it is not a separate college or dorm or experience but rather an “a la carte” way students can enhance their academic experience. A student could meet the Honors program requirements and graduate with “Honors in the Liberal Arts.” Or, they could just take Honors classes in the areas they want in order to dive more deeply into a subject. A student can also do Honors in their major. Students who complete the requirements for both Honors in the Liberal Arts and Honors in their major graduate with Comprehensive Honors. At least a few years ago, all admitted students are invited to apply for the Honors program and I think it’s worth the extra few essays. Check the due date for Honors applications because, at least a few years ago, those dates were linked to your own acceptance date and was not a fixed date for all students.
Campus culture – like most flagships, it’s big enough that everyone can find their “peeps.” There is definitely a hippie/counter-culture element within the student body. There are also students into Dungeons and Dragons, greek life, engineering etc. Students can live in a residential learning community which can help to find their “peeps.” Chadbourne is one of the residential learning communities in a centrally located dorm with several hundred spots.
Congrats to your daughter on having some great acceptances this early in the process. There are no bad choices among them, just different!
I was going to say Mac, because of her interests, but it is certainly not in a small, cute college town. A big, sorta cute part of a city, maybe? It’s a smaller college, but there are at least 4-5 colleges within a mile or so, and U of M isn’t far, either. She could do worse.
Wes might be a good choice given her interests, pretty artsy. Don’t know if I’d call the town cute, but I liked it, in a working class sort of way. Midd is impressive also, and might be a fit. S1 visited all three, as well as Carleton, Swarthmore, etc…
Love this! I will encourage her to research the Residential College. She has said she wants to live on campus for at least 2 years - and earlier in her search, she wanted an on-campus community for 4 years, but I think she has let that slide a little. I love the idea of her having a smaller, more containable version of U Michigan while also having access to the many resources and opportunities of a huge school.
OOPS, I think I replied to the wrong post! But I also love what @Midwestmomofboys wrote about Wisconsin… that blend of urban and outdoors, big enough to find your people, access to internships at the capital, etc. You are right – this is going to be a tough call.
I’m getting the sense that OU is a West Coast UVM, too. And she’s admitted to the honors college at UO, too. UVM will definitely lose points for location.
Even though most student move “off campus” at Michigan after one or two years, off campus housing is often just as close or closer than dorms. So, although for most students campus housing is only guaranteed in year 1, she will likely be no farther from classes or activities in off campus housing than she was in a dorm.
In addition to the RC, there are also living-learning communities, and after freshman year she could consider applying for co-op housing. The latter may appeal to her hippy inclinations because of the nature of the housing arrangement. Also, from what I understand, it’s some of the most affordable housing at Michigan.
I haven’t been to UVM, but UO (also known jokingly as UC Eugene) certainly has its share of outdoorsy vegan liberals.
That said, the Phil Knight family money and Pac-12 status (Autzen Stadium and Hayward Field venues) probably gives it a more college-sports-machine vibe than UVM.
UVM is the most like a private college, which is probably why it was on the original list of public Ivies. 3/4 of the students are out of state, Undergrad enrollment is only 10,000+, and dorms are organized around themes. The campus is very walkable. Burlington is a great college town and the university is right there, so it’s easy to take advantage of what the town has to offer. In less than 2 hours by any mode of major transportation, you can be in Montreal. The outdoors are close by in Vermont and New York’s Adirondacks are a ferry ride away across the lake. On the negative side, male:female enrollment is 40:60, which research suggests is not good for young women on a college campus although that is now how that demographic is overall among college students nationally.
Oregon is the second smallest at 18K and has a 45:55 male:female split. Eugene is another great college town.
Michigan and Wisconsin are large Big Ten universities, each about triple the number of undergrads at UVM. But UW has the largest class size among these 4 universities and UM has the smallest. UW in the state capital is a great location for a political science major and the setting on the lakes is spectacular. UW is 48:52 male:female and UM us about 50:50.
Just going to state the obvious - U of Oregon has the mildest winter and amazing nature in the state - of the ones on this list. It is also road trip distance to fun Oregon beaches. There are lots of rules about development in Oregon with the resulting easy access to the ocean. I’ve been to all these places for work - except Ann Arbor Michigan which I only visited for personal reasons at the University Hospital with sad memories due to a young relative hospitalized there, so I barely remember anything of Ann Arbor except mean cafeteria workers and some grumpy nurses at the ICU and a few other very kind nurses who seemed to be angels. Anyway, loved all of the other towns. Maybe not Dec to January though except Eugene.
You are right! Oregon is stunning. One of my favorite states. For some reason my D22 is very interested in experiencing the full-on 4 seasons… especially winter. I do wonder if she’ll tire of it quickly, but I think it’s a life experience worth having… even if you do hightail it back to CA after you graduate!
I live in the San Francisco area and grew up and regularly travel to Burlington, Vermont. For the last 30 years I have never had more than one connection in a place such as Chicago, New York, DC to get there. Never would dream of taking a bus from Boston to Burlington. BTV airport has daily flights from Jet Blue, United, American… And UVM is quite close to the airport - 7 minute car ride according to google maps.
We looked at UO for our son just last year and it is lovely but not easily accessible by plane. It is hours from Portland and the local airport has a very limited schedule. Because out son wouldn’t have a car we thought it was too hard to get to but he choose elsewhere for adifferent reason.
Yes, northern airports face winter weather interruptions but there were travel problems due to hurricanes for our son this year. So everywhere has its issues.
I would summarize with go with the best match as far as program and city.
Actually, of all the schools mentioned, Michigan is the best for journalism (UW-M is a close second). No need to “cobble together” anything. The Michigan Daily is one of the top ten college newspapers in the country and is a big feeder to The Wall Street Journal. The current deputy managing editor of The New York Times is a Michigan Daily alum. I’m a journalist, and when people ask my advice about what to study, it’s always this: Whatever you want. Just make sure you go to a school with an independent daily newspaper and join it on the first day.
BTW, you WANT the campus newspaper to be independent of the school (all excellent campus newspapers are), not part of a class or subject to a faculty adviser or dependent upon school funds that could influence the content.
If there’s a direct flight on a different airline, you can bet she’ll be on it (ie, Delta’s SFO > Detroit)