<p>Hi!
My question is:
Is going to a public high school and graduating valedictorian with great grades and a good number of extra curriculars better than going to a prep school and graduating with all a's (maybe not top of class) and an okay number of extra curriculars when it comes to getting into an Ivy League school like Harvard or Stanford?</p>
<p>If your only objective is getting into HYPS, then either path is a crapshoot.</p>
<p>If surrounding yourself with consistently bright, motivated, inquisitive minds and having an intensive bonding and transformative experience is the objective, then pick boarding school.</p>
<p>@GMTplus7 it isnt i was just wondering…</p>
<p>@dancer: I’ll bite.</p>
<p>For the past few years, the valedictorians at our local public high school have gone to Ivies. Based on this small sample and what I know about my daughter, I would say that her chances of getting into an Ivy might be better if she went to the local pub (where she would have an excellent chance of being the valedictorian) than the BS she attends.</p>
<p>As GMTplus7 hints at, I think MANY prospects think that going to Andover or Exeter means a straight shot to the Ivies. Since even the As and Es of the world only send 30% to Ivies, that means that 70% go somewhere else. So ask yourself if you think you could be in the top 30% of an A or E vs. being the valedictorian at your local public HS.</p>
<p>I have always been of the opinion that kids who are going to get into Ivies are going to get into these hyper selective schools no matter where they attend HS.</p>
<p>@SevenDad i think i kind of understand what you are talking about. Thanks!</p>
<p>There was an article in the June 2012 Phillipian, Andover’s online student paper, regarding a yearly poll of students “How much does prep school hurt chances at highly selective schools”. For the first time, the number who thought it hurt more than helped was higher than those who thought it helped more than hurt. Andover and Exeter each sends less than 10 kids out of a class of over 300 a year to Harvard on average (check out their yearly statistics under their college tab), and they have many legacies and athletic recruits. </p>
<p>Even the valedictorian at a public high school (there are 27,000 of you) has a slim chance at the Ivys; 50% of kids with 2400 SAT scores are turned down.</p>
<p>So consider Ivy admission something of a lottery; odds are slim any way you play the game. How do you want to spend your 4 years; you will never be able to repeat high school.</p>
<p>Here’s why you “might” consider boarding school - and it has nothing to do with Ivy’s. BS is to expensive to use as a potential conduit. But there are other reasons:</p>
<ol>
<li>Your school doesn’t challenge you.</li>
<li>Your school doesn’t offer sports or classes that interest you.</li>
<li>You want more exposure to students from other parts of the country and/or the world</li>
<li>You’re wanting to stretch and test your wings before college.</li>
<li>You want smaller class sizes and an environment where students are some of the best and brightest in the world</li>
</ol>
<p>etc…</p>
<p>If you can stay and be valedictorian - great. But some schools have experience with public and private schools whose students at that level still aren’t ready because of the school’s lack of competitive academics. I know some students who are bright and highly recruitable, and I’ve met others who have straight A’s and aren’t prepared for college.</p>
<p>Just depends. On what you need academically and personally, and which school best provides it.</p>
<p>Another factor is where your PS is. If it’s an East Coast suburb then your odds are lower versus a strong prep school. If it’s a less represented geography, then your odds may be better staying home. You also have to keep in mind that many of the admits to Ivys are hooked candidates so they fill many of the slots coming from the BS/prep schools. </p>
<p>Grades are also a challenge as many BS/preps have severe grade compression. It’s often older students (“redshirts”) who get the As because they are repeating the material they’ve already learned in prior years. That’s why you see the oddity on apps of “10th grade applying for 10th grade, etc.” In short, it’s a very complex question to answer.</p>
<p>Ivies aren’t the main goal. Go to BS for the experience of BS, which includes more difficult classes, more diverse peers, and stronger athletics.</p>
<p>I agree with both Sevendad and Exitmitalum. I know it is hard, but if you choose boarding school, it really has to be for the reasons set out out so well by Exie – need more challenge, small classes, etc. I would add that I think graduates of BSs enter college being able to “hit the ground running”. They’ve already adjusted to being away, and have learned to maximize and balance their time. </p>
<p>But if your goal is solely to attend an Ivy, public school just might be the better option if you are certain you will graduate at top. I think there does seem to be an unstated preference among AOs for public school kids as opposed to BS kids that appear to have gotten the best opportunities. Also, remember that when you are applying from BS, you are really competing against the other students from your BS. Harvard is not going to take 20 students, even though these are top students from around the world. I would guess that at least 75% of BS kids apply to at least 1 or more Ivies. Whereas at public schools, maybe it is the top 10%. Grading at some BSs can also be deflated; for instance, the top GPA might be a 3.85. Yet, BS have to compete with public high school kids that have a 4.0. Granted, AOs know that classes are very rigorous at BS, but these are just considerations to make when considering BS.</p>
<p>But then I also tend to agree with Sevendad’s opinion that “kids who are going to get into Ivies are going to get into these hyper selective schools no matter where they attend HS.”</p>
<p>IMHO, the top boarding/prep schools tend to be a disadvantage for IVY /top college admissions, for the following reasons:
- The more rigirous the classes, the more of a ‘GPA killer’ the school is. Eg, getting an unweighted GPA of, say, 4.0 in a public school, equates to maybe a 3.6 in a top prep school - not too impressive even for many of the state schools…
- Competition with an extremely bright pool of students: it is much, much harder to be in the top 5% or 1% or whatever % said to be in the ballpark for HYP admissions.
- The challenging workload at a top prep school may become so heavy so as not to leave any significan time for a meaningful extracurricular. Think how much time realistically will be left for a serious athletic pursuit. Chances are, pursuing a sport at a recruitment level (one of the stepping stones to an Ivy) requires a huge time investment - something not realistically possible given a top prep school workload. And anyone attempting it, is risking a lower still GPA or a plain nervous breakdown.</p>
<p>All in all - prep schools are not worth it as an Ivy jumpstart.</p>
<p>This is where you may be wrong, moonchik. Exeter and Andover send a huge proportion of their students to Ivies every year compared to regular schools. Sevendad makes a very good point.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>That’s because BS select the top students from all over the country whereas a public school has to admit all resident students in their district. If boarding schools were to accept all students that apply, not just the top, their college admit results won’t be any better than PS. So it’s not the school that matters, it’s the incoming student body.</p>
<p>While I agree that BS does not necessarily make it easier for a student to get in to an Ivy, I’m not sure it’s for Moonchik’s reasons. </p>
<p>Ivies are well aware of the difficulty of prep schools, and so a 3.7 from a top tier school may well get a student as far or farther than a 4.whatever from an unknown high school. Agree about the difficulty of being in the top 5% of the class, but most prep schools don’t rank, and the academic index no longer considers class rank. Still, a student who would be taking all AP classes at regular high school might well find accelerated classes at bs much harder to manage. </p>
<p>While it is true that demanding academics limit extracurricular involvement, this is more of an issue for kids who want to have leadership roles in a bunch of different e.c.'s; most students at demanding boarding schools find that they need to focus on just one or two primary interests. However, the resources available at b.s. almost guarantee that those e.c.'s will be top-notch. </p>
<p>Finally, boarding schools make time for and emphasize athletics, some might argue to a fault, and from what I’ve seen, it is actually quite easy to be recruited as an athlete. Teachers and coaches are well connected to Ivy League coaches, and the coaches will often come to the school to recruit. Boarding school sports, too, are often the sports most recruited at Ivy Leagues, and bs students are valued because, generally speaking, they are well prepared academically and score higher on standardized tests. In my kid’s case, Ivy League recruitment would not have been possible without boarding school. </p>
<p>However, as others have pointed out, it IS harder for the generally excellent student to stand out in a sea of other generally excellent students at boarding school. And so many students at bs have hooks–legacy, athletic, highly qualified URM’s–that those Ivy spots can fill quickly.</p>
<p>In the end, though, if you can get past the Ivy thing, I do think that a good bs is a great guarantee that you will be admitted to an excellent college.</p>