Public Interest Law

Graduate School Law School
1

<p>Many students looking into law school have started threads with questions regarding the big law firms which is great but doesn't really help me. My question is whether my interest in public interest law is feasible? The other day my professor joked about how a good percentage of students go into law school with public interest law in mind but eventually let go of these aspirations and opt for big law firms. I understand that the debt is a major factor in an individual's career choice. I also am vaguely familiar with Loan Forgiveness programs in certain schools, but I want to know if these programs truly help? Do law school graduates that plan to do public interest work go straight into the organizations? I've heard before that even these organizations want lawyers that have had experience in firms.</p>

<p>To summarize:
Is public interest law feasible?
Does anyone have statistics on the percentage of students from top law schools that go into public interest law?
How useful are loan forgiveness programs in allowing students to pursue lower income careers?
What are the possible paths a graduate may take to join a non-profit organization?
Are there opportunities to do lots of pro-bono work in firms?
If yes, would you really have the time to do it?
I've heard that some firms hire lawyers to do ONLY pro-bono work, is this true?</p>

<p>Does anyone know a lawyer in this field? I'd appreciate hearing about how they got to where they are and if they enjoy their position.</p>

2

<p>I can answer some of your questions.</p>

<p>First, get US News & World Reports, grad school edition. The back has an index with schools and what percentages of their students go into different practice areas.</p>

<p>A lot of your questions depend on where you go to law school. If you graduate from Yale, you can have a really good shot at even the most competitive of public interest organisations; also, you'll get amazing forgiveness of your loans. Once you get beyond Harvard, Yale, and Stanford, loan forgiveness for public interest becomes both less generous and not guaranteed. Many schools will limit your loan forgiveness to about $10,000/year (which, with debt that runs you at $20,000/year and a $35,000 salary, isn't enough), limit it to a few years, and don't guarantee it to all students who do public interest. Furthermore, almost all schools take your spouse's income into consideration when calculating your loan forgiveness.</p>

<p>Lower-ranked schools often cannot afford to give LF to all their students, because they lack the financial resources of well-endowed schools and because many of their grads go into public interest. </p>

<p>That brings up something else... if you want to be a public defender, you can get hired from nearly any school. If you want to work in a fancy public interest job (US Attorney's Office), expect to get top grades at a top school to be competitive. </p>

<p>While some law firms may hire attorneys for pro-bono purposes, I doubt that they would be students right out of law school so much as more seasoned attorneys. </p>

<p>Look through nalpdirectory.com. If you browse law firms, you can see billable hour requirements, averages, and whether or not specific firms give credit for pro bono work.</p>

3

<p>Try to contact the legal aid in your community. I work at a Legal Aid right now ... paralegal while an undergrad. They make ok money, work in sometimes crappy conditions, but help a lot of people who would be screwed without organizations like legal aid, pro bono work, etc. </p>

<p>Two attorneys I know started off as paralegals or did their externship at legal aid and got hired right after law school. Some are volunteer (but still paid) generally with private practices who come in once a week to help clients and get paid $100 an hour (in southern CA).</p>

4

<p>I'm interested in public interest work but not so much positions as a public defender or work in government. I have a more specific interest in helping victims of domestic violence in organizations like House of Ruth, Inc. or Next Door Solutions to Domestic Violence. I interned over the summer as a children's program coordinator at Next Door and this entire school year (I'm a sophomore at Pomona College) I will be interning with House of Ruth in the Temporary Restraining Orders Clinic which will give me some insight into the life of a legal advocate for a small nonprofit. Seeing as these types of programs are less popular than those like the public defenders, how do you think these programs would go about hiring their lawyers?</p>

5

<p>If you are interning there, the BEST advice you can get will come from THEM, not a message board where none of us are intimately familiar with that area.</p>

6

<p>The key with public interest law is to consider your debt load. </p>

<p>If you are interested in more local public interest opportunities -- public defender, local prosecutor's office, local DV work, state/local government, etc.-- your best bet, honestly, is probably to go to a more "regional" law school that gives you more scholarship money. Loan repayment programs are never guaranteed, even at some of the top-notch schools. If, however, you have more lofty public interest aspirations -- lobbying in DC, or working for more well-known nonprofits, for instance -- you probably should look at the school's ranking and reputation, as well as the strength of its loan repayment assistance.</p>

<p>Also, if you are interested in the US Attorney's Offices (as someone mentioned earlier in the thread), be aware that the US Attorneys do not hire students straight out of law school, no matter what law school they come from. You have to have at least two years of experience to work there.</p>

<p>I turned down a top school to go to a more regional school (still in the top 50, though, and a great school) that offered me substantial scholarship money. My school doesn't have a strong public interest program, but that's OK. I'm interested in state/local jobs anyway, and I have plenty of ability to network with attorneys in the area on my own. I don't regret the decision. I have to do more of the legwork to finding my own job, which means a lot more "work" for me in that respect, but I will graduate with a debt load that is manageable even if I get no assistance repaying my loans.</p>

<p>Incidentally, a lot of the key to finding any public interest job is networking. Public interest employers aren't like huge law firms; they generally don't take on huge summer associate classes or give offers at the end of your 2L summer. PI employers usually don't know far in advance that they will have openings or have the resources to fill those openings, so they recruit later in the year than most firms do. Many students looking for public interest positions don't have offers until the spring of their third year -- compare this to the situation of the big-firm summer associates who get offers by mid-September. So it can be more stressful, certainly.</p>

<p>My advice: Contact local organizations like Legal Aid or the DV shelters you mentioned. Volunteer with them. Meet their lawyers; ask them questions and learn from them. Never underestimate the value of connections and mentors.</p>

7

<p>Thanks to everyone that has posted. I will certainly consider the benefits of going to regional law schools and contact the lawyers at the organization.</p>

8

<p>It's my understanding that debt forgiveness programs are very good at all of the private law schools in the top 14. It's only the publics among the top 14 which, understandably, don't have good loan forgiveness programs. Some lower ranked LSs also have good programs--investigate each LS you are considering. </p>

<p>Yes, a FEW firms hire lawyers to do only public interest work. One of my law school classmates has been a pro bono attorney at a major firm for many years. The firm has a pro bono program which involves many associates. Those associates need to be supervised by someone with experience, just as those who work for regular paying clients do. He fills that function. </p>

<p>Many bar associations have pro bono projects and at least here in NYC, some large firms count time donated through the bar association in billable hours, as long as you can prior firm approval. That often means getting experience in your field. So, for example, a real estate lawyer might be involved with pro bono help to an organization involved in building low-income housing. That experience will help in his for profit job. A firm might be willing to give credit for that, but not to a real estate attorney who wanted to help on domestic violence cases. It varies by firm. </p>

<p>There are some programs which fund jobs for 1-2 years. One example is the Skadden Fellows. (Google.) </p>

<p>The most prestigious private interest jobs, e.g., the ACLU, are among the most competitive positions out there. Hillary Rodham Clinton worked for Childen's Defense Fund, which was back then--I don't know about now--one of the most difficult jobs to get. Going to a regional firm in most cases will remove you from consideration for such jobs---not always, but you'd need a lot of extras to be considered...like 5 years of work for non-profits before law school. </p>

<p>LOTS of NGOs "hire" law students for summer jobs, usually at low or no pay, and screen them for permanent positions, just as firms do. Some law schools have stipend programs to help students with lower incomes take these jobs during the summer. There's a very prestigious NGO in "my" building and it has LOTS of what are in effect "summer associates" who work for free. Less than half are given offers. </p>

<p>Other organizations partner with local LSs for clinical experience and tend to hire people who have worked in the clinics (for LS credit) during LS. </p>

<p>I don't mean to be rude, but I wouldn't take the word of someone still in law school for whether someone seeking to build a PI career will regret going to a regional law school rather than a top one. It's too early for them to assess the impact of the choice. It also depends on the region. I suspect that you are from Indiana and want to stay there, Indiana U's LS is an excellent choice. If you want to work in LA, DC, Boston or NYC--areas which attract a lot of grads from top LSs, no matter which field they want to practice in--the top 14 LS may matter much more. One of my kid's friends works for the federal public defenders in a large city not on that list. There was OBSCENE competition to get the job.</p>

<p>A lot of the data you seek about LSs is available on the LSAC site, though you may have to hunt around a bit for it.</p>