There is speculation in the PSAT thread regarding receiving a letter inviting students to participate in the Stanford Summer Pre-College program (The speculation is that usually only high scoring students, PSAT score in the top 5%, receive the letter. Of course PSAT scores have been delayed this year so…)
So, I was wondering if anyone feels that there is a correlation between college mail a potential student receives and their test score?
My D16, who had very average scores, mostly received unsolicited mail from middle ranked schools that were fairly equal to her scores and regional location. Of course there were a few outliers on either end of the “rank” spectrum but the bulk of mail was consistent with her scores. She never received the “Stanford” letter.
My D18 took the PSAT in October and one AP Human Geo exam as a freshman (received a 4). Recently received the “Stanford” letter and so far the unsolicited mail that she has received has been from higher ranked schools like U of Chicago (who I know spams everyone, lol), Boston U, Vanderbilt. I will be shocked in D18 scored in the top 5% on the PSAT.
Do you feel that the mail that your student received was random or more targeted?
Speculation runs rampant while waiting for scores and admissions notifications right?
Some mailings did appear to be targeted but both kids did get some mailing from schools that they were not qualified for based on their academic stats so we figured they sent to pretty much everyone.
DS has heard from Yale (gorgeous mailing), Columbia (frequently), Vandy (though we visited there), UChicago.
He’s got good stats ACT and GPA wise, but he’s not in the upper stratosphere that I frequently see here on CC. He also did not take the PSAT (homeschooling mama dropped the ball on that one).
This thread caught my eye as my kiddo took the PSAT in October. Not sure if the mailing box was checked. My child received an email from Boston U this week about a Pre-College program. Have not see any paper flyers. Maybe it is only a stateside thing?
Of course it’s correlated. Let’s use some common sense here. How do you think colleges buy their mailing lists from the PSATs? They buy names above whatever cutoff they designate. The same way the local Mercedes dealer buys a list of zip codes where the average income is over $x. The same way the pizza parlor bugs a list of zip codes within 5 miles of the store. This is Basic Direct Marketing 101, if that. There is absolutely no meaning to any of it any more than I think the Mercedes dealer personally wants ME to come in for a test drive. They don’t even see the names. Third party companies stamp and mail.
It’s no different from buying advertising space / time either. Fish where the fish are.
I think the question that comes up a few times a year is whether the college board sells data before releasing scores to test takers.
In this case, have they sold a list of top scorers to Stanford (or Stanford’s marketing company) before they let those test takers know they are a top scorer?
In my experience its definitely correlated. My D did not do well on the PSAT and when the mail started coming it was from many lower level schools. Then she improved her SAT scores substantially and the mailings changed. Suddenly things were showing up (both email and snail mail) from top 20 competitive colleges, including some ivies. I don’t know how they know, but they know.
My kid got lower tier schools before, and after high scores. He only got UChicago otherwise. By lower tier, I mean places I’ve not really heard of that are lower tier. His psats weren’t nearly as good as his final score. So I think it is a correlation to the pre test.
Pizzagirl is right. Of course they are correlated and yes it is basic marketing 101. And they don’t mean anything. I told my kids not to check the box for mailings after my oldest got inundated
My older kid got all kinds of mailings, mostly from smaller schools I’ve never heard of. I heard mention on this site of mailings from top schools which she did not receive, unless maybe they got lost in the huge pile. She is a National Merit Scholar, and I can’t believe her scores missed anyone’s percentile cutoffs. So, I think there may be other factors in their marketing and I would not read too much into mailings or lack thereof. Second one took PSAT for the first time this fall and has not received any mailings at all yet. That was her first college board test.
There is marketing and then there is interest. The national merit semifinalists usually attract letters from schools which dole out large merit scholarships for naming them the school the kid wants to attend.
Any student can simply start receiving a whole bunch of flyers by flagging a check box stating they would like to receive information from colleges.
One can also get colleges interested when they take the SAT, ACT, AP exam etc. I have seen cards from some top schools specifying how they got your name. Then there is that other little piece of information pizzagirl mentioned - the colleges have outsourced most of the marketing and a third party is sending these out using the input from collegeboard or ACT board. Suffice it to say the admissions officers don’t have a clue that our kids exist until they start talking to the school counselors to find out who is good at their school or until the kid’s application hits their desk.
“In this case, have they sold a list of top scorers to Stanford (or Stanford’s marketing company) before they let those test takers know they are a top scorer?”
Sure. What does one have to do with the other?
Is there no one on CC who has worked in marketing, direct mail or advertising?
THIRD PARTIES do this. No one at Stanford is sitting poring over a list. They ask the third party direct marketing company to obtain an electronic data file of kids with scores over x (or whatever other criteria). The third parties administer the mailings. Don’t even remotely kid yourself that “Stanford” sought out your kid.
This is how every single direct marketing campaign in the world works, so why the naïveté about this - it floors me. I don’t think the general manager at the car dealership is personally inviting me for a test drive or that the president of Williams Sonoma specifically wants me to buy peppermint bark.
I’ve always felt that students aught to be able to opt into mailings based on criteria the student can establish. D16 had certain requirements. 1. It must be a school within 6 hours of our home. 2. Have a student body over 10,000 students 3. Have a dance minor. 4. Be able to study some sort of pre-physical therapy. If she had received most of her mailings from those schools much less paper would have been wasted and the marketing more affective. In today’s world it would seem that such information would could be easily processed and schools would waste far less money and resources marketing to kids that are truly prospects.
Our D is a good student with a strong ACT, however, she had zero interest in any of the Ivys or top tier schools simply because they really didn’t meet her wants (too far) nor did they market themselves to her interests. She received mountains of mail from various LACs in New England all of which she never bothered to even look at. She received many invitations to come to engineering weekends and she has zero interest in becoming an engineer.
In the end our D ended up applying to 4 schools and visiting some 12 schools. Unfortunately the literature we received, even from the schools she chose to apply to, did little to help in her decision. I think a marketing plan which targets the things that students want and gets them to both the website and directs them to the people who can answer their questions and give them information either on line or at a visit would be much more effective.
I also think there is big data analytics in play . . . nothing personal about it, other than you fall in whatever categories are established as the parameters.
Our neighborhood (zip code) has the “whiff” of full pay about it. Not that we fall in there, but marketing companies don’t know that.
“I’ve always felt that students aught to be able to opt into mailings based on criteria the student can establish. D16 had certain requirements. 1. It must be a school within 6 hours of our home. 2. Have a student body over 10,000 students 3. Have a dance minor. 4. Be able to study some sort of pre-physical therapy. If she had received most of her mailings from those schools much less paper would have been wasted and the marketing more affective.”
Why? These are just mailings. If you don’t like them, throw them out. I don’t get to “opt in” to mailings from the pizza parlor or the car dealership. If they annoy me, I throw them away. I really do not get why people see these mailings from college as fundamentally any different from any other marketing effort whatsoever or why they think they are more “special” or indicative of interest or any more or less ethical than any other type of mass mailing.
Anyway, the whole freakin’ POINT is that these colleges are trying to attract people other than “those people who have already heard of them.” That’s why they aren’t just mailing to the zip codes immediately surrounding them. If you were the president of XYZ University, of COURSE you’d want people across the country to know you existed.
Because it would be more helpful for students looking for colleges and likely cheaper and more effective for the universities. There is a reason Rolex is more likely to advertise in Architectural Digest than Better Homes and Gardens, even though I believe the second has a much larger distribution, they are more likely to reach their intended market. If information is available that identifies someone who is looking for exactly what you offer then I think it would be a great investment. We live in Ohio and her geographic requirements alone means that we may have missed some universities in the six state area.
“Anyway, the whole freakin’ POINT is that these colleges are trying to attract people other than “those people who have already heard of them.” That’s why they aren’t just mailing to the zip codes immediately surrounding them. If you were the president of XYZ University, of COURSE you’d want people across the country to know you existed.”
I appreciate what you saying, however, while Columbia, Harvard and few others we had mail from may have enough money to relatively randomly send literature to every one who met some basic criteria I can’t imagine that Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute does and that was one of her stalker schools that kept wanting her to become an engineer. I can fill up the recycle bin as well as the next guy. It just seems like there may be a better way.
Alas, soon this will be all over. I for one may miss getting mail other than local solicitations, political mail, and of course bills.
Maybe it is only a stateside thing?