<p>I'm brazillian and I'm currently a junior at High School and I, predictably, aim for an Ivy League or one of the great names in the U.S. First of all, I'd like to know how is the international student scene in these colleges, as in do international students actually stand decent chances of getting in?
Also, I'd like to have realistic options based on my grades and such. The information I have is most likely very superficial and might not be as much info as needed to give me those options but I'd very much appreciate if an analysis would be made, even if not very reliable.</p>
<p>2013 - Sophomore Year
I got an overall score of 81% in the year, which would translate to a 3,2 GPA (not sure if that's correct)
Class Vice-President
Theather Club</p>
<p>2014 - Junior Year
I got a score of 87% (so far), which would be a more or less 3,5 GPA (also not sure sorry)
Member of Senior Trip Committee
Some (not finished yet) hours of voluntary work
Also i'll be Senior Class President next year. </p>
<p>You will be compared to other students from your country. The ivies are extremely difficult to gain admittance especially if you need financial aid. Most students applying to the ivies have nearly perfect scores. They typically have won international awards.</p>
<p>Ivies and such like to admit international students who are exceptional at something. They might be exceptional students, exceptional athletes, exceptionally wealthy, etc. </p>
<p>A 3.2 - 3.5 GPA would be pretty average in the US and your extra-curriculars don’t sound special either. Based on what you’ve written, you don’t look like a good candidate for the top universities to me.</p>
<p>As per the other users, the Ivy League and the tippy top universities are probably not realistically in your reach right now. The chances are low even for a domestic applicant, and for international students it will be even harder. Can you afford the tuition at those places anyway? If not, look for schools that will offer you merit or need based aid to internationals or start at a college in Brazil and come to the U.S. for grad school. What are you interested in studying? We can start with suggestions that way</p>
<p>Is 81-87% exceptional in Brazil or is it pretty average? (In some countries where you can get 0% or 20%, 70% means you’re at the top of your class… in others, it means you’re almost flunking out! We’d need an estimation as to what % in your year get these grades and how frequent that is in your country, ie. is it top 50% nationally or top 5%…)
In the US, those results would be pretty average - students who can aim at universities ranked 75+, perhaps 50+ as reaches.
For universities and LACs ranked in the top 25, you’d need to be exceptional both academically and outside of class, which means being recognized nationally (or even internationally for schools ranked in the top 10). You’re competing with the best students in the entire world; being the best in your school isn’t enough…
You need to prepare for the SAT or the ACT, as well as the TOEFL.
And the KEY question as an international applicant is: how much can your parents afford? $5,000? $10,000? 30,000? 65,000?</p>
<p>Alternatively, you need to be lucky. My friend was denied by schools like Grinnell and Reed but admitted to Columbia. He had good grades, good test scores, flat essays, and came from a not-THAT-competitive-country. This doesn’t mean that you should apply to all the “Ivy League” schools to try your luck. Cases like his are rare. I’m not sure about what the competition situation is in Brazil, but you could find out if you go to your local US educational foundation (something called ‘American International Education Foundation’). </p>
<p>And yes, as MYOS indicated, we can’t offer much advice unless we know your test scores and financial situation. </p>
<p>Thank you guys, you really helped.
By the way MYOS, that is something that concerns me. As you mentioned, yeah 81% to 87% is pretty great in Brazillian standards, I am as a matter of fact top in my class and have more or less the best grades in lots of the subjects (of which we don’t get to chose which we want to do, as in other countries.). But are international standards really taken into account? As in what you’ve mentioned. Thank you. </p>
<p>Shawnspencer
I’m very interested in Economics, Finances, Business and Management so my course choices would be Economics or Management Sciences. </p>
<p>Yes, they’re taken into account - of course!! (I wouldn’t have written it otherwise, but just realistically, counselors may not know all educational systems so you need to give them a way to compare results, but since raw numbers don’t mean anything on their own, it would be pointless for them to think an 81% in Brazil is the same as an 81% elsewhere. Numbers always “mean” something and the meaning must be taken into account to select the best students.)
I would recommend Economics, since more good colleges offer it - Management can be a good major but only at a few colleges (Notre Dame, Stern, Wharton…) and at most colleges business majors tend to be less demanding. Finance requires more math so it’s often a strong major at most colleges but an applied math major with a finance minor would get you further - as an international, the odds of your finding an H1B job with a BS are almost non existent, therefore a major that readily allows you to go on to a Master’s degree would be best. Do apply at these super selective schools, especially if you have strong math skills (calculus, statistics, probabilities) but don’t limit yourself to this major and look at programs with economics, economics with math, or applied math.</p>
<p>Hello Luke! I’m also from Brazil (Paulista!) and my grades are somewhat similar to yours. I’d say 3.5 GPA , but remember… You and I are going to have to send our “historico escolar” to a credential evaluator in the US so they can convert our grades to the GPA format. I’m pretty sure almost all American universities require that! In my case I’m applying for the top universities in Florida (which will be my state of residence!). </p>
<p>But just some personal advice from a Brazilian to another Brazilian… Ivy Leagues are great, they have name, etc… But focus on something more realistic. There are thousands of EXTREMELY qualified Americans that get rejected from the Ivies every year. If you think about it… Getting into ANY university in the US is better than practically any university in Brazil (maybe except for USP, but still).</p>
<p>Another thing which the others mentioned (Thanks MYOS!) is financial matters. Since your school has “Presidents” , I’d assume it’s a private school and therefore you’re “comfortable” financially. However, in order to obtain the student visa, you’re going to need to show USCIS that you have enough funds for ONE year of university. This is perhaps the greatest obstacle for most international students, especially those like me (not financially blessed, but very good academically). </p>
<p>Just summing it up. Ivy Leagues are beautiful, but try something more in reach. In any case, I’m sure you already knew about the visa processes and what not, but if you have any more questions, you can PM if you’d like. We’re on the same boat afterall! Boa sorte cara!</p>
<p>^ for the record, in the US, “excellent” would be 3.75+ and most Ivy League applicants have a GPA close to 4.0. Unweighted GPAs can go up to 5 or higher BTW but unweighted GPAs go up to 4, meaning all A’s (ie., you were top 3-4 in every class you took in a college-preparatory curriculum including the most advanced or difficult classes your school or country offers.)
3.5 is half A’s, half B’s, which is not bad, but wouldn’t qualify as “exceptional” (at all).</p>
<p>I see and understand that. Though, i’d like to understand how does that conversion you speaked on in terms of comparing results between countries.
Unfortunately my school does not provide advanced or difficult classes, and I don’t think that’s a very common practice at schools in Brazil to be honest.
I plan on working on my EC’s probably tutoring and working, also volunteering and trying to improve my GPA’s.</p>
<p>Truth is Luke, you and I won’t have a “weighted GPA” since AP classes simply don’t exist in Brazil. Hopefully it won’t be our downfall, which would be just plain unfair.
On the other hand… The credential evaluation service should recognize that we had classes in ALL subjects, for three years, different from most Americans if I’m not mistaken. I’d bet you and I had the same subjects actually…
Physics 1/2, Math 1/2,
Chemistry 1/2 (Organic/Inorganic), Biology 1/2 (Genetics/Life sciences?)
Sociology, Philosophy, History, Geography
Portuguese 1/2 (Literature/Grammar) AND English and/or Spanish</p>
<p>So yeah. Wanna talk about courseload? Look at that xD
15 subjects. For three years. </p>
<p>In all major American universities you will be judged by the criteria of your own country. You will not be judged in comparison to Americans. American admissions committees are very familiar with the academic system in Brazil: you will hardly be the first Brazilian applicants they have dealt with. Likewise, American admissions officers are very aware that not all countries offer the same kind of extracurricular opportunities available in the U.S. Your competition will not be other Americans - it will be other Brazilians/Latin Americans. </p>
<p>Is that so katliamom? Well that makes me a little bit more hopeful on my chances of getting into NYU Stern or any UC’s, I didn’t know that was how it worked, thanks, it was very helpful :)</p>
<p>Luke, the big problem for most international students is not where they can get in - but what can they afford. There is little financial aid for international students. There is NO financial aid for international students at most of the famous public schools (like the UCs) Like PurpleTitan mentioned, NYU is among the popular private schools which don’t give very much financial aid. </p>
<p>If you can afford $40,000-60,000 per year, then there are very many very good schools which will be happy to accept you.</p>