<p>“Not only does Yale have fewer recruiting spots than other schools, but it also maintains the strictest admissions standards for recruits in the Ivy League, athletes and coaches said.”</p>
<p>Almost.
"…over the past four admitted classes, Brown has had seven teams with AIs under 200, “while Dartmouth and Penn had five, Columbia three, Yale one, and Harvard and Princeton none,” Simmons wrote in the report. (Ruth Simmons, President of Brown)</p>
<p>. . . which would make the gap between Ivy League athletic recruit who has the minimal Academic Index vs. the typical Ivy student admitted on academic grounds about the same as the gap between an athlete with a 2.5 high school GPA and a score of 700 on the CR + M parts of the SAT vs. the typical student admitted on academic grounds at one of the “sporting brethren.” I would be willing to guess that most of the students admitted on academic grounds outscored 1140 CR + M when they were in middle school, if they took the SAT as part of one of the “Talent Searches.”</p>
<p>This was actually a follow-up to post #15, in case the . . . looks weird.
Re the later comment by gibby, I’d be surprised if athletes really needed 700 per section, at Harvard or anywhere else. I wouldn’t be surprised that a number of the athletes had 700 per section, just that I think the floor exists for a reason.</p>
<p>^^^the 176 minimum AI floor is almost irrelevant. That would one of 3 or 4 kids at one of the least selective Ivies. I’d guess there are fewer than a dozen ‘floor level’ recruits in the entire league.</p>
<p>FWIW, D competes at an Ivy and coaches did indeed tell us 700 per section was the standard they were seeking.</p>
<p>According to the most recent Common Data Set available on line for Harvard, the 25th %ile scores were 690 CR, 700 M, 710 W. It seems improbable to me, frankly, that the athletes have to meet or exceed the 25th %ile–although, again, I don’t doubt that quite a number of them do. </p>
<p>I’d guess that the standard they are looking for actually depends on the sport (and sport revenue level), the athletic talent of the person in question, and the typical scores of the athletes in that sport. For example, I feel fairly confident that HYP can fill the fencing roster with students who have 700+ in every section. The same could be true in varska’s D’s sport–not sure what that is.</p>
<p>With very, very few exceptions, women athletes are used to raise the gpa level of the incoming athletic class. There are a few women who might go to standford or UNC for soccer who are purely going to be the stars on the Women’s National Team. But, those girls don’t go to Yale, most of the time. </p>
<p>Basketball, Football and Hockey (even women’s hockey) are the only sports where you are going to find an Ivy willing to drop their expectations, and then, not very far, and then, NOT AT YALE.</p>
<p>Yale just doesn’t do this.</p>
<p>FWIW-- I have no dog in this fight, I just happen to know the recruiting world, and this is the one school where they have no committment to athletics. They just don’t. I’m not going to go on Princeton or Dartmouth, or even Harvard and say the same. But at Yale, if you can’t make the grade, they aren’t going to take you. Even if it means another losing season. They just don’t care.</p>
<p>That is interesting, and I didn’t know it, poetgrl. Very useful information for the CC community in general. </p>
<p>So you think the OP was just mistaken, then? Normally, I’d think that a HS sophomore would have 1 1/2 semesters of HS grades, and possibly no SAT’s at this point–so that in general, it would be hard to predict that the student would meet the academic standards.</p>
<p>No, I don’t necessarily think the OP is mistaken.</p>
<p>These kids take their SAT’s early. I’m sure you are aware that the SAT covers very basic knowledge.</p>
<p>Also, they are sophomores who are in a full time sport AND doing well in AP classes.</p>
<p>These kids do exist. Yale and Harvard and Stanford and Princeton want them very badly and the coaches know this.</p>
<p>Put it this way, if you are going to be a truly recruited athlete, as in you will do nothing but play and they will come and find you? There are other types of athletes who fill out the forms and ask to be recruited, which is also valid. But, if you are playing in the tournaments the scouts come see, they come and see you even when you are freshman. They can’t talk to you, but YOU know you have to take your SATs early. etc…</p>
<p>Not all athletes, very few, in fact, fall into this category. Of the ones who are really that good, few would rather go to Yale than to Stanford or Notre Dame, or a school with a really good sports program. But, some are really looking only to leverage their skills into the best possible college degree they can get. (women are in this category, since, as you know, very few female athletes can have a career in this as adults).</p>
<p>So, some will go to Yale. The ones who go to Yale are the ones who priveledge academics over athletics. When you hear an athlete has chosen Yale, they are very likely to be the most studious of studious. Even highly bright athletes who don’t want to study all the time are more likely to choose princeton or dartmouth. And, many more, would choose stanford or a top ACC team. (Keep in mind we are talking about a very small self-selcted population, here.)</p>
<p>^^^ The OP posted an article that described a verbal commitment from coaches, however:</p>
<p>“Admissions decisions will be communicated only by official WRITTEN NOTIFICATION from the ADMISSIONS OFFICE, by notification in Early Action, Early Decision or “regular” processes, or by “likely letters” after October 1, which are confirmed by one of those notifications. NO OTHER INDICATION OF A POSSIBLE POSITIVE ADMISSIONS RESULT IS OR SHOULD BE CONSIDERED RELIABLE.”</p>
<p>Gibby, you can tell yourself that all you want, but it isn’t true, in reality.</p>
<p>If they waited until senior year to give out verbals they wouldn’t even have a team, not even a team of the brightest students.</p>
<p>AND, if they didn’t honor their verbals, it would take two years before they didn’t have a team.</p>
<p>The Ivies are not competing for different kids. There are a small pool of kids with top stats and top skills, and they will commit early and you will lose them. Sorry, but while that may be the “official” written policy, the practice is different, and they do honor their verbals, or everyon would go somewhere else.</p>
<p>poetgrl, I know the Ivy recruiting game from firsthand experience - sure, an Ivy coach will make every effort to honor his word to a recruit, if word get’s out that he doesn’t he loses credibility. But the coach will offer nothing more than - 'if you can pull the grades and test scores, I’ll support your ap"
If you want to call that a verbal commitment, do so at your own risk.</p>
<p>I too am very familiar, both from my own daughter’s experience and from the rest of the club where she plays, which sends everyone to a D1 school to play. I can promise you that the only girls who get verbals from the Ivy’s have the grades and the scores and always get in, as well. If that were not the case, they could not recruit from the club, anymore, as everyone is fully committed by the end of jr year.</p>
<p>That said, not all the girls get verbals from the Ivy’s, no matter how much the coach would like to have them. They don’t have the grades or test scores.</p>
<p>^^poetgrl, I’m not trying to be antagonistic, but if you say things like “they always get in”
you’re just not painting an accurate picture of Ivy League admissions. The posts on this forum come up as future search results for kids who need some input to evaluate their recruiting offers.</p>
<p>Varska;Poetgrl: Are the current magic numbers to pass muster for Ivy Admissions 2100 SAT (translates to what in ACT?). D’15 may fall in about this range when she takes the tests and has the skill set to play her sport (softball) at this level of D I play. She will not ever be the next Jenny Finch, so the AI will not be lowered to permit her admissions.</p>
<p>Threesdad, 2100 SAT (translates to 31-32 ACT) should put her safely in the recruitable range throughout the league. (It’s not rally a magic number, GPA is a factor, too) She will need to be an outstanding player, though, to garner any support with admissions - even with solid academics.</p>
<p>threesdad, I don’t know about softball, only soccer and hockey, but I will say that your daughter should go on to the athletic sites of all of the colleges she would be interested in playing at, and going to school at, and fill out a recruitment form.</p>
<p>My D was playing at the level where the coaches came to her, but from the people I know who go the route where it’s more a combined effort of reaching the coaches and making tapes of her playing to send to coaches and then filling out the forms… Have you gone onto the athletic recruits board on this forum? Go there, too.</p>
<p>Yale isn’t really athlete friendly.</p>
<p>But, there are places like Dartmouth and Princeton, which are, also schools like Amherst and Williams and the D-3 schools in that particular league really like a smart athlete.</p>
<p>Poet: She will do as you suggest, she is just beginning the process. I was just looking for a benchmark as she will ask "Dad - what scores/GPA do I need to have a realistic chance for Ivy, NESCAC, etc schools to recruit me. She’s not at the elite Top 25 softball level but will want to graduate on time with a degree she can earn a comfortable living with.</p>
<p>In my experience, with female athletes, your daughter wants to be close IN the admitted students range. Schools tend to use the women to boost their athletic GPA’s and not the other way around.</p>
<p>But, she sounds bright, and instead of being stuck in a lottery situation, this could be a hoook for her, which is great.</p>
<p>Poetgrl: Thank you for taking the time to respond. If you follow the CC HS Class of 2015/College Class of 2019 or the Recruited Athletes Tab in Specialty College Admissions, you’ll see how she’s progressing.</p>