<p>nysmile,
Sorry, but you do sound judgemental. And wrong too. Both my kids worked during HS and during the summer. Much of s#1's savings was money he earned fixing people's computers, during his summer internships, job as a camp counselor, etc. He spent one summer doing volunteer working a lab -- that was, obviously unpaid. Younger s had minimum wage jobs since his jr yr of HS, and worked for a neighbor this past summer. Both boys have been very, VERY committed to volunteerism and community service too (both won awrds for their work) and they fit this in around their jobs, their schoolwork, etc. They learned to budget their time as well as their money.</p>
<p>This has nothing to do with control. Sheesh. Older s is 22 and off the payroll. He graduated, pays all his own bills, and has developed excellent financial management skills. He just checked the other day-- his credit score is 780!! Not too many can top that. Control?? Nope-- he is free of our influences-- though he occasionally calls for our advice because he truly respects and values it. Younger s understands how much $$ we have set aside for his education. That's why he chose the school he did, with $38k or more a year in scholarships, so that he can budget the $$ we saved for him to put towards med school. They have learned how to manage their money and I am quite proud of them.</p>
<p>jym626, both your sons worked and learned many valuable lessons from doing so. They managed to work, volunteer, and do well in school. What I was interested in is the number of young adults who don't work, who don't earn a portion of their spending money, and who rely solely on the money that their parents give them. I was surprised by the number of young adults on CC who don't work during the summer or breaks to help pay for some of their own expenses during the school year. Perhaps this has to do with the upbringing of the parents or the area of the country where people are brought up. Where I was brought up (Eastern LI), it was/is a right of passage to get your first summer job at around the age of 14 (definitely by the age of 16). We live in a tourist area and the local kids work at all kinds of jobs during the summer (retail, camp counselors, food industry, babysitting, landscaping, etc.) and sock the money away for college and spending money. It's very common here. It was common in my generation and is still common today. The kids balance sports, jobs, EC's, volunteer (it's a HS graduation requirement here to have a certain number of community service hours), and still manage to have time to hang out at the beach. Maybe now people can understand why I'm so surprised to find out that what is common in our area is not as common in other locations.</p>
<p>Actually, nysmile, S1 has two "friends" who are in that boat. They go to school and don't work and then they don't work all summer long. My three children all have had jobs since they were 16 (we didn't want to get into anything that involved a work permit-so before that my D did a LOT of babysitting and my boys washed and detailed cars.) Only our 2 sons are left in college and they don't work during the school year, but have had summer jobs that have made them a nice amount of spending money. We don't give our kids any money when they are out of school. Even S1 has remarked that he can't believe that his friends haven't worked a day in their lives and feels that they have no clue about the real world or the value of money. </p>
<p>S2 is a freshman in college and his best friend was accepted to his #1 college and chose to defer in hopes of making a junior hockey team in Canada. His goal is to get on his college's hockey team. His "job" this summer was to work out and play as much hockey as he could. He made the team. He also, didn't work. His parents, though, have taught him to manage money and he is a very mature kid. </p>
<p>I know his parents feel the same way as cptofthehouse. We live in a pretty affluent community and MOST kids work all summer, if not, all year long.</p>
<p>I live with my parents and go to NYU. My parents give me $25/week for eating expenses while at school as I have no meal plan. I work 15 hours/week during the school year to have spending money as well as cover books/transportation (and the rest of the eating expenses). I do find time to do extracurricular activities (a time-consuming club sport, being an officer of a club, and volunteering on a weekly basis). I don't always work a paid job during the summer and have often chosen non-paid internships instead, which perplexed my parents, but what other 18-year old saw a woman give birth?
NYC is NYC, and yes, I cannot afford everything the city has to offer, but that is life. I don't often buy "stuff," but I do go out for sushi, or to see a play/movie. And there are fun activities that don't cost money!
I am able to save some money (not as much as my amazing parents, who came to the U.S. with less than what I have in my bank account now) and cannot really complain. I don't judge those people who have the means to give their children an allowance so the children can concentrate on their studies. There are indeed many well-off students who have a good head on their shoulders as far as personal finances go and are fortunate enough to zero in on their passions. However, I have also met a few who fill the holes in their lives with $300 shoes, blackberries, and booze.</p>
<p>I don't understand what's so wrong with not working.</p>
<p>I have never worked a day in my life, but I know how to manage my money and I spend very little. I know the value of money because my parents taught it to me. I doubt I could've learned it better by working at McDonald's or Tilly's all summer.</p>
<p>Quite frankly, my job right now is to be a student. I'll be happy to earn my own spending money next year and ease some of my parents' financial burden. But really, I doubt I'm going to "Learn valuable lessons" from working in the student union or the bookstore, other than perhaps how to work a cash register.</p>
<p>One of our acquaintances is a true "hockey mom". Her high school son, like the Republican VP candidate, went to a high school in Michigan, maybe even the same one, I don't know. He never worked a day in his life in high school, because with the crazy rink time, the heavy hockey and heavy duty academics, he had not time. For him, the payoff was great. He has been drafted to one of the NHL teams, AND got a full 4 year athletic scholarship. For now he is "on call" to the team and attending school. I doubt he has a part time job. His job was school work and hockey.</p>
<p>So every case is not a matter of the kid not wanting to work but an expressed decision that there were things that were more valuable for the family and the kid than work. </p>
<p>I agree that there can be that danger that a great disconnect can occur between work and entitlement if a kid does not work. It can also affect his attitude to menial work that may be detrimental. It can result in a kid not learning to handle money. However, I know many people who are terrible with money who worked all of their lives. It's not a cause and effect thing. I think ultimately when no one is looking and you have your own life and money, your discipline, organization, record keeping and awareness skills are going to be what makes you good with your finances.</p>
<p>And if the kid doesn't get drafted, decides not to go to college, and doesn't get a job, he can always join the military. (Sorry, I just couldn't resist)</p>
<p>It seems penny-wise and pound-foolish for me to pay $50K/year and let my kid works for $10/hour to support her spending. There is no do-over for college, especially when a student is undecided. DD does not work because she has to keep her grades up. I told my daughter to stop spending. So far that seems to work, she still has $200 left, out of $600 of her summer earnings, before the semester is over.</p>
<p>I don't believe work is the only way of teaching our kids to have work ethic, inner strength, appreciation of money, ability to do time management... At the same time, if your kid wants to get a summer internship or go straight into work force after graduation, then it is important to have some work experience. It is the reason I asked my daughter to get an office job freshman year. It did help her to get her summer internship this summer. As an employer, I am always reluctant to hire anyone that has never worked before.</p>
<p>
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It seems penny-wise and pound-foolish for me to pay $50K/year and let my kid works for $10/hour to support her spending.
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I disagree generally. Your premise assumes that the student would be otherwise spending almost all their time in academic pursuits and this is rarely the case. Working 8-10 hours per week generally has no impact on their studies or most other activities at school. My D was a CS major with a chemistry minor which most would agree is a very difficult combo, especially at a tough school like UCSD, yet she still managed to work 8-10 hours per week. This wasn't because of me pushing her into it but rather because she wanted to. All I did was caution her to make sure it wouldn't impact her studies. As a result she gained valuable connections and experience from her on-campus job and additional connections, experience, and a great job offer from her off-campus paid internship. My other D decided to work as well, also an on-campus job that's a small number of hours per week, yet she's involved in a different way on-campus as a result. The experince is also directly related to the type of work she'll do upon graduation and will look very nice on a resume.</p>
<p>Quick calc - 8 hrs/wk @$10/hr = $80/wk = $346/mo - enough to support extraneous speding and even save some. </p>
<p>Most students can easily find 8 hrs/wk to put to non study related productive use although it might cut down on partying a bit.</p>
<p>Some kids can do this; some cannot. Also some kids may get more valuable connections and experience relevant to their fields of study by taking non pay opportunities. They may not get the opportunity to work a job that pays AND is related to future prospects. I worked in the cafeteria during college. The pay was decent but no future opportunities or any relation to my studies at all.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I disagree generally. Your premise assumes that the student would be otherwise spending almost all their time in academic pursuits and this is rarely the case. Working 8-10 hours per week generally has no impact on their studies or most other activities at school. My D was a CS major with a chemistry minor which most would agree is a very difficult combo, especially at a tough school like UCSD, yet she still managed to work 8-10 hours per week. This wasn't because of me pushing her into it but rather because she wanted to. All I did was caution her to make sure it wouldn't impact her studies. As a result she gained valuable connections and experience from her on-campus job and additional connections, experience, and a great job offer from her off-campus paid internship. My other D decided to work as well, also an on-campus job that's a small number of hours per week, yet she's involved in a different way on-campus as a result. The experince is also directly related to the type of work she'll do upon graduation and will look very nice on a resume.
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</p>
<p>I gave my advice based on my undergraduate experience. I had to work to support myself in college, but when it came to midterm and final exam time, I did not have proper time to study for all the exams. I got so depressed looking at my freshman year grades that I wished I hadn't work.
My daughter is now experience such crame time. It depends on what kind of grades you expect your student to pull. All Cs, all Bs, or all As?</p>
<p>I agree that it'll depend on the type of job and its flexibility. My Ds have been fortunate to find on-campus jobs which are very flexible with hours and if there's a MT or final coming up will allow time for study. My D's off-campus paid internship that turned into a part time job (doing software development) also was very flexible - they knew there were times my D wouldn't be able to come in for a week or so during major tests or heavy lab project times.</p>
<p>When I went to college many years ago I supported myself fully and had to work a lot of hours at a 'regular' type of job and that did have an impact. I wouldn't recommend that if it can be avoided but the flexible small hours job should be easy to manage.</p>
<p>On campus jobs are perfect, they should allow you to take time off when needed for mid terms & finals, etc. My DD has worked a campus job for her first three years; now in order to participate in internships she is not working this term and missing that money, but just tightened the belt.</p>
<p>When our son first when to college, we gave him an allowance and a credit card (for emergencies only). He didn't have a part-time job. Well, the first month went ok. THEN, he started going out to lots of restaurants, movies, bowling, whatever. We got a Visa bill for $450, we complained. The next month was about the same. Then we took the credit card away and told him that he needed to get a part-time job to pay for all this "extra fun". (We also realized that if he had a part-time job, he wouldn't have so much time to "waste money.")</p>
<p>Well....our son was also able to snag a job on campus as a "tutor." The school pays the tutors so that the students can get tutoring for free. So, he works about 12 hours per week afterschool (usually between 2pm - 5pm on Mon thru Thurs). What a great job - no working at night or on weekends!!! The job only pays about $8 an hour, but he gets paid whether any students show up or not (he's allowed to do his homework if no students need tutoring). The job provides regular "pocket money" so we don't even have to provide an allowance anymore. He goes to school, he goes to work, he goes back to his dorm to do homework, and on weekends he can have fun. </p>
<p>If a student has too much "free time" and doesn't earn any of his own money, I do think that he/she will have a harder time adjusting to "real life" where "non-work time" is not "all fun time."</p>
<p>Believe me, having a part-time job (10-12 hrs/week) does NOT mean that the kid isn't going to have time for FUN! Don't forget, their school hours are not like your work hours. They are often out of school by noon or 2 pm (and my son has NEVER had a class before 10am!!) They have PLENTY OF TIME to work a few hours.</p>
<p>Letting students have a part-time job is helping them get ready for real-life. My point is that students who have too much "free time" are less likely going to be able to adjust to real life later. I am very much in favor of students having SOME free time - but I can tell you from experience - having no job usually means having too much free time (and blowing a lot of money).</p>
<p>BTW.... my son is an Applied Math major with 2 minors (physics and computer-based honors), so he doesn't have an easy schedule. However, he still has plenty of fun time apart from his job and his studies.</p>
<p>In real "adult life" free time is a luxury that can only be afforded when job, chores, family demands, home demands, and yard demands are done.</p>
<p>Fair warning, those parents that feel that their offspring ought to be earning their own money in college should consider this. Campus jobs (at least four years ago when I graduated) paid about 8 bucks an hour. I was able to put in about 20 hours a week meaning that I made less than 150 a week. The remainder of my living expenses was made up by credit card debt. It would be cheaper for all involved if you forewarn your children about this before they decide how much to take out in loans. Wouldn't you rather see your children do well in classes and make it into graduate/professional school rather than work as many student hourly hours as possible and build credit card debt (also bad habits) that will haunt them through their young adult years. With the cost of tuition, it seems as though many parents are cutting off their nose to spite their face.</p>
<p>Campus jobs are often hard to come by. Many, if not most, go first priority to the work-study students (I laughingly refer to work-study jobs as ones where they go to "work" and sit there and "study" :) ) . As for UCSD_UCLA's example, there aren't many jobs for college kids, let alone HS'ers, that pay $10/hr. Most are more in the minimum wage range-- (Somewhere between $6-8/hr). By the time taxes and everything are withheld, there is barely enough left to pay the gas. That said, our son did work some of these minmum wage jobs in HS, before gas prices went totally through the roof. Older s was self motivated-- he built up his own business. Younger s was less internally driven. He thought he should merely negotiate for a bigger allowance or try to convince us that we should pay for everything (the rationalizations were, and still are, priceless). So, if he wanted more $$ than we gave him for his allowance, he had to earn it. Once he started earning $$ and realizing what it was like to be out in the workforce and the lowest man on the totempole, his attitudes changed a bit.</p>
<p>I am impressed with students like HGFM, who learn the value of a dollar without having to work a paid job. That is impressive. These kinds of kids "get it"-- they learn from their parents, they learn to budget, to find deals and coupons and bargains. They don't have to have the newest branded-logo-fashion-statement-garment, and they don't live above their means. They probably heard the word "no" from their parents and were not showered with spoils. I was one of those kids too. I started to work summers after my first year of college. Before that I babysat, but that was about it. </p>
<p>My boys were not spoiled. They didnt need to have the fanciest stuff or the latest video games (well, they wanted them, but didnt often get them except as birthday or holiday gifts) unless they paid for them themselves. They did need cash though. They had one very expensive habit. A girlfriend. Strong motivator for $$$.</p>
<p>Your household sounds like mine. We don't get very expensive things from our parents except as birthday or holiday gifts, and I only have my car (which is a '99 Chrysler which I only got because it's my mom's old car which no one drives anymore besides me) as long as I keep my grades up.</p>