Recent grads: Join Equity or Stay Non-Equity: timing, pros/cons...discuss

College Majors Musical Theater Major
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<p>@momcares… please keep asking the questions that I know I need to know and don’t know the answers to or haven’t even thought of to ask. You ask great questions that I follow with great interest. I agree that this is probably above a mom’s pay grade but I am still finding some job security here and there because of the things I do know (thanks to many of you in CC) that the student on the ground who has no time to read, doesn’t know. I am beyond grateful to the veterans that still volunteer their expertise. You know who you are :-)</p>

<p>So much of the MT and Theatre forums are understandably dedicated to the “getting into college” part and a declining percentage to the “being in college” part. In the blink of an eye, suddenly there is this “what’s next after college” part that will get awfully interesting as it looms large. I’m glad some space is dedicated to it.</p>

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<p>As your kids go further through their college training and then out into the professional world they will certainly know more than you in this (and many other) areas and that is how it should be. They will do things differently than you would have and they will make mistakes you would not have, that’s how they learn and become independent. There will probably come a time when they will have enough of your “help” and “suggestions” and have a good talk with you, basically telling you to butt out, and they will be right in doing so (although we won’t like to hear it!).</p>

<p>Now, what I’ve seen from my friend who runs a small theatre company outside of NYC, there are different tiers of Equity theatres and depending on how big the theatre is (number of seats), a certain number of actors must be Equity. If they find a non-Equity actor that they want to hire (most of their plays have less than 5 people) then they have to offer him/her Equity membership if they don’t have the required number of actors already cast. It is a process and I’m not sure what it is or how extensive it is but I know she has mixed feelings about having to do this. As a mom and actor she loves the idea of helping a young actor get an card but as a Producer, not so much! I know they are always balancing Equity vs non-Equity for their casting as it’s more expensive to hire an Equity member, so they don’t go beyond their required number for any play.</p>

<p>One more thing for this discussion is the rule where if you’re a member of any acting union (SAG/AFTRA or Equity) then you are not supposed to work non-union in the other union. For example, if you’ve joined SAG/AFTRA for a film or tv show then you are not supposed to work a non-Equity show. People do, but it’s wrong, and you don’t want to get caught.</p>

<p>Union vs non-union is not simple or easy. I fought to keep my daughter out of AFTRA when she was young because I didn’t want it to mess her up when she wanted to work summer stock while in college or when she graduated. Fortunately the person on the phone when I was begging to keep her out was reasonable; my daughter was “must join” and the woman on the phone said it was my daughter’s last hire, if they saw her name again she would have no choice but to join. She’s had some great experiences in non-union productions and it still strengthens her resume. She’s almost ready to become union but holding off on it was right for her, not for everyone, but for her.</p>

<p>Trust the college your child goes to and trust your child’s interest in his/her career, it might not be your way, but it’s theirs. And we’ve all made mistakes in our 20s, most of which are fixable.</p>

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<p>Thanks so much to all who keep adding to this discussion. I’m learning more with every post and really appreciate it!</p>

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<p>And those of us who come behind you, AND have offspring who do not read, are grateful. There’s always the next bend in the road to be thinking about.</p>

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<p>Yet another question. Does audition order actually matter? Do most audition cycles end before they see everyone, so being seen earlier can mean the difference between being seen and not being seen at all? </p>

<p>I think the Equity website says all Equity actors have to be seen before “non-professional” actors. Does this mean any actor with Equity but no agent will always be seen before any non-Equity actor with an agent? Does this apply at any theatre that has any Equity contracts? What if the non-Equity actor with an agent has scheduled an appointment first?</p>

<p>I can imagine situations where auditioning with non-Equity actors could work to someone’s advantage, possibly allowing them to stand out more in a crowd.</p>

<p>I’m guessing this is also an area open to lots of variation, but I’m curious about how things generally work.</p>

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<p>Hi MomCares. I can try to answer this since my D has an agent and is equity in NYC. </p>

<p>Open Calls, EPAs and ECCs are always before agent appointments. </p>

<p>At Open Calls, all auditioners, equity and non, are seen in the order of the sign-in list, or they wait in line. Whether everyone will be seen depends on how many people show up. Open Calls generally start at 10am and end at 6pm with a one hour break for lunch. It is often split Girls before lunch and Boys after lunch, or vice versa… </p>

<p>At EPAs and ECCs equity is always seen before non-equity even if they walk in hours later. There is no guarantee any non-equity will be seen. Non-equity auditioners get to the call very early in the morning to create their own sign-in list but it is unofficial and the equity monitor is under no obligation to adhere to it. </p>

<p><a href=“http://www.actorsequity.org/faq/QADetails.asp?cat=2&locator=188”>http://www.actorsequity.org/faq/QADetails.asp?cat=2&locator=188&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Agent appointment auditions do not take equity or non-equity into consideration. Casting gives everyone they want to see a specific time, usually with a 5 - 10 minute window. </p>

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<p>nice post amtc!</p>

<p>The rules posted on the AEA website pertain primarily to required EPA (Equity Principal Audition) or ECC (Equity Chorus Call) where all Equity actors will be seen first and non-Equity will be seen if time allows. This does not pertain to agent submissions, or appointments where a casting director calls in actors for appointments. Only to the “open calls” for the most part. <a href=“http://www.actorsequity.org/CastingCall/procedures.asp”>http://www.actorsequity.org/CastingCall/procedures.asp&lt;/a&gt; </p>

<p>“I can imagine situations where auditioning with non-Equity actors could work to someone’s advantage, possibly allowing them to stand out more in a crowd.”</p>

<p>Being a member of Equity does not necessarily mean that the actor is more accomplished as a performer than a non-Equity actor, so it would not necessarily be an advantage… and most productions have so many different auditions dates, locations, etc… that it would likely be moot, anyway.</p>

<p>Equity is a union that guarantees minimum salaries, pension, health, working conditions, etc… Membership is not vetted by a common body looking at performing skills. It is granted either through the EMC (Equity Membership Candidacy) Program… where actors and stage managers can earn points for working in non-union in a union house which participates in the program, or by being hired on an Equity contract for a specific production, or through being a member of one of the other performing arts unions, and meeting specific criteria. <a href=“http://www.actorsequity.org/membership/howtojoin.asp”>http://www.actorsequity.org/membership/howtojoin.asp&lt;/a&gt; </p>

<p>In my experience alumni of our program end up getting their cards when they are ready, want to, and depending on the “market” in which they want to work (ie. NYC, Chicago, DC, Boston, etc…). Some right out of school, others a bit later </p>

<p>There is quite a bit of non-union work for young performers, and many of these opportunities are cast by the same casting directors, and directed/ choreographed/ musical directed by the same directors/ choreographers/ and music directors as Equity shows… so working some non-union contracts at the start of your career can be a good way to build your resume and contacts. </p>

<p>Once you have your Equity card you may no longer work non-Equity contracts, so weighing the timing of accepting the Equity contract in your career, and the profile of the job where you are bring offered the contract is something that most young people should probably do before accepting the contract. Ex. Broadway show… probably accept the job with the Equity contract :slight_smile: … small regional theatre, maybe not (although, maybe yes… it really all depends on the point you are at in your career, the job itself, short and long range professional goals, etc…) </p>

<p>:) – cross posted with Nightowl2</p>

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<p>@NightOwl2 and @KatMT - Thank you so much for taking time to explain all of this!!</p>

<p>Are appointments by agent submissions almost the equivalent of a pre-screen, so those appointments are held nearer in time to when callbacks for open Equity calls might be happening? Can I assume that not everyone submitted by an agent is actually given an appointment? It’s been my impression that most casting happens for folks who are specifically called in, rather than through open calls. Is this generally true?</p>

<p>FYI, I ask these questions mainly so I can keep up in understanding some of what’s happening in D’ life. I do make a concerted effort NOT to interject myself into her decisions – even when she solicits my advice which, happily, she still does frequently. I’ve gone out of my way not to meet any of the faculty or administrators at her college, or the directors and casting agents she works with (except when they go out of their way to introduce themselves), as I view this as her school and her career. She’s not entering the field as a child actor, so I see my hands-on role as ending with high school, aside from being the ever-loving mom. She has LOTS of amazing and generous mentors, so I ask these questions here in part so I don’t spend all our conversation time learning the basics that she’s long since understood.</p>

<p>Again thanks to all who offer insight here!!</p>

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<p>Hi MomCares. I guess you could call it a prescreen if casting is not familiar with the auditioner. In other words if from the headshot they fit the type but casting has not heard them sing or act before. Or maybe they did hear them sing but have no idea if they can act so they bring them in. Generally however, agent appointments allow actors to skip a step. Most of the actors with an appointment are being seen at the same time those from the EPAs etc. are being brought back in for a second look. </p>

<p>Definitely not everyone submitted is brought in for an appointment. Happens all the time, especially when casting really gets to know you and have decided you’re a specific type. </p>

<p>Most bookings happening through appointments is true for tv/film. I’m not sure the same is true for theater. People do get cast at open calls. My D was one of them and that’s how she got her equity card and her agent. It’s almost impossible for ages 18-22 to get representation without prior credits. </p>

<p>At the BFA program my daughter is in her non-equity friends audition much more than she does. Most of their auditions are non-equity but some have gone on to final callbacks for Broadway shows. And yes, a few booked and are currently in Book of Morman, Newsies, and Bridges of Madison County! </p>

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<p>@NightOwl2 - Again thanks for sharing your knowledge!</p>

<p>

How do clients know for sure their agent has really submitted them? Do agent-submitted people find out they won’t be seen before the open calls are held, or by the time they find out have they already missed them?</p>

<p>Once you have an agent, are you still allowed to attend open calls or is that discouraged?</p>

<p>

Is this a choice on your D’s part, or does she feel that having her Equity card and/or her agent is hindering her chances? Did she get her card and/or agent before graduating? Is she glad she took a card, or has she expressed regrets?</p>

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<p>

Is there any straightforward way to gauge the relative merits of various regional theatres if you are unfamiliar with them? For example, in our area the two LORT theatres both do primarily straight theatre. Some local Equity regionals that hire many more MTs are actually larger houses, and may have larger subscription bases, than the local LORTS. So is LORT really the highest “class” of regional theatres, or is there some other way to gauge their relative merits as employers (and resume line items)?</p>

<p>I know kids can struggle with this when choosing summer work. For example, I notice that some well-respected (and large) regionals offer VERY short contracts. Do kids sometimes get/take Equity cards for contracts that may be as short as 3 weeks? Is that smart? I also know that in past summers D has had offers from regionals she knew nothing about and had a hard time deciding if it was work worth taking. Is this something you just decide based on word-of-mouth or are there some objective measures to research?</p>

<p>Engineering work is easier to figure out. ;)</p>

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<p>@MomCares This is exactly what I was talking about with my son. He worked one show for three weeks and took his card. Was it smart? Only time will tell. I thought he should not have; he thought he should. He is back there again this year and perhaps would have to take it??? Not sure. It is his career and his decision and he had other people guiding and advising him who know FAR more about all of this than I.</p>

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<p>MomCares, clients don’t know unless they ask. And most clients don’t ask because agents are too busy to answer every client asking about every audition. And yes, D has missed open calls and EPAs because she was waiting for an appointment and did not get one. IF you have a really good relationship with your agent it’s ok to ask occasionally but not on a regular basis. But even if they say yes, you were submitted, it doesn’t mean you will get an appointment.</p>

<p>No regrets! My D got her equity card before graduating and her agent submits her for everything she is right for. It’s just been very slow lately.</p>

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<p>Every “Equity” theatre operates under a some kind of Equity agreement. In our area, this includes:</p>

<p>LORT - League of Resident Theatres (premier theatre in town, resident company, primarily plays)
WCLO - Western Civic Light Opera (large MT house)
SPT - Small Professional Theatres
LOA - LORT Letter of Agreement (summer festival)</p>

<p>The WCLO in our town brings in slightly less than the LORT ($14 vs $15 Million). The LORT engenders more cricital respect and has an actual resident company, but the WCLO may draw more patrons overall. Given a choice and an apples-to-apples comparison, the pros that I know would probably pick the LORT over the WCLO for a job, but if you are in MT then most of the work is with the WCLO (and the opera, which also does a musical every year). I am pretty sure that the LORT would look better on your resume in NYC than the WCLO (but many pros come from NYC to work at the WCLO).</p>

<p>Some LORT’s are fairly small, but my guess is that they represent “relatively high-class joints.”</p>

<p>At least one of the SPT’s in town is very, very good while being very small.</p>

<p>Since many of these theatres are non-profits, you can pull their financials (990’s) through Guidestar (it is free to register).</p>

<p>You can find a list of all the EMC theatres here (and the list includes what kind of Equity contract they operate under):</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.actorsequity.org/docs/emc/emc_theatres.pdf”>http://www.actorsequity.org/docs/emc/emc_theatres.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>@EmsDad - Thanks! For me this thread is proof positive that there are known unknowns, and LOTS of unknown unknowns wrt Equity and agents. :)</p>

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<p>D’s high school actually had the local Equity rep come do a Master Class with them on “Equity.”</p>

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<p>For all I know, D has had classes on Equity, too. As I say, I’ve tried to help her think while staying in the background as she has weighed her options over the years (including college choices), and fortunately she’s always had knowledgeable mentors she could go to for solid information and good advice. And she has so far always seemed comfortable with her choices after making them. Hopefully all of that will continue, but I figure the more I understand of her world the better conversationalist I can be. </p>

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<p>Thanks katMT.</p>

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<p>Another question - is the physical card different depending on how/when/where you get your Equity card, or are all AEA cards created equal? For example, is a post-college card from Broadway identical to a card from a 3 week summer regional run, a card gotten via EMC points, or a card gotten through a childhood local TV commercial? Is a card earned in San Francisco the same as a card earned in NYC? Obviously the resume is different in each case, but are the Equity cards identical? </p>

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<p>I hope they are not different since the dues is the dues ;)</p>