<p>I think RSI cares about how good you are at what you do, the best people get the best places regardless of race, and if Asians tend to be the better race at math/sci, then so be it.</p>
<p>Look at the scientific community, publications don't occur because the author is of a certain race, it's dependent on what you wrote.</p>
<p>@A-Card: I'm guessing essays and recs (especially recs).</p>
<p>I love discussions like these haha!</p>
<p>@ A-Card: There are A TON of ways to display your uniqueness other than belonging to some rare race; you just have to be able to articulate it well enough. </p>
<p>Disclaimer: I do indeed believe that this is a discussion-worthy topic, so for the sake of maintaining this healthy discussion, please don't take it personally if I critiqued your arguments.</p>
<p>I think DMRenrel and shortcut both have strong points. However, in the way I understand them, both arguments are flawed.</p>
<p>Shortcut was wrong in critically stereotyping Asians. But let's be real here, you guys. As a Rickoid informed me, there are kids who get into RSI (Asian and not Asian) who don't have social lives, period. So much of science is not just sitting at a desk and doing math problems; science is about ideas, exploring, and perhaps most importantly, communicating. I would guess that those kids who have non-existent social lives don't necessarily add a lot to the RSI experience. This is where I believe that shortcut is right. Honestly, what's the point of being able to compute the most difficult math problems if you don't have normal social skills and can't even carry on a normal conversation with the person sitting next to you? Having said (or typed, rather) this, his argument should not have been directed to Asians. By putting more weight on things like leadership and community involvement, as VPof09 suggested, the "social" problem, I strongly believe, would work itself out, as a large part of being a leader is having the charisma and sociabililty that attracts people.</p>
<p>DMRenrel also has a valid point, but I completely disagree with his comment about how the school year is scientifically mediocre and socially thrilling, while the opposite is true for RSI. The school year is only scientifically mediocre and socially thrilling if you choose for it to be. And I don't believe that RSI is, or even should be, the contrary. RSI should be both scientifically fun/productive AND socially stimulating. But his point about maintaining a completely unbiased system, (coming from an Indian here) is certainly fair. </p>
<p>It seems like there must be a (better) way of admitting a more diverse group of students to RSI without compromising the level rigor of research, allowing for a more enriching RSI exeperience. (This is what the argument essentially appears to be in my eyes: the "too many Asians who have no social skills" vs. the "completely meritocratic system that selects the worthy.")</p>
<p>However, I think this is a point we can ALL agree on: More than 80 qualified students apply to RSI every year. We are all qualified in our own respect. (We believed in ourselves enough to even apply and complete a lengthy application. We have experiences different from others on this thread, which define us, and we all have unique research interests.) As another Rickoid told me, there are many students who get in who don't deserve to get in, and even more get rejected who should have been accepted. Looking at the pictures of last year's RSI admitees was a bit personally upsetting. If I had to guess, more than one African American who applied to RSI was qualified and deserved to get in, but only one was admitted. (Can you imagine how that one African American girl felt?) That bothers me. "Sacrificing" a few spots for a more diverse group of students is something I wholeheartedly support. And plus, if those few students whose spots were "sacrificed" truly were interested in science research and not just in the prestige and glory of putting "RSI" on their resumes, they would pursue research opportunities elsewhere. If you are passionate enough about doing research, you will. </p>
<p>Only 80ish kids get into RSI. I don't at all believe that the 80 kids who get in are the most qualified, as that latter Rickoid told me, and is (wrongly) the base assumption of DMRenrel's argument. I bet several hundred who have applied are more than qualified candidates for RSI. I believe that after a certain point, the admissions committee has a few hundred superb applications from a diverse group of students sitting in their hands and that anyone from this prestigious group would make an awesome RSI admittee. Choosing 80 (of the best) from a few hundred stellar students with amazing grades and test scores and who are passionate about math and science research is a crap shoot (and can result in admitting students who don't deserve to get in). Why not choose a diverse group of students from those several hundred instead of choosing a large majority from one particular background?</p>
<p>My apologies for the MANY typos.</p>
<p>I've got to say, that was well said. You have a very valid point about there being more than 80 qualified applicants. I think there is a lot to be said for being able to communicate and spread your passion, to talk your ideas over with others. Have you guys read about Olin's admission process (I think it's Olin anyway)? They invite a certain number of people based on a reasonably traditional process then observe them interacting socially and whatnot...it sounds like a nearly ideal process to me.</p>
<p>That was superbly written, Potential!</p>
<p>To Potential, very well said, indeed. </p>
<p>Photos can be deceiving; however, pictures do tell stories. The stories here are not that appealing, at least, visually.</p>
<p>To shortcut,</p>
<p>Out of morbid curiosity (as always... poor cat), what exactly do you mean by "appealing...visually"? I sincerely hope you're not thumbing through those pictures of Rickoids (after an exhaustive journey from all over the U.S./the world) like you would thumb through e-Harmony profiles. Of course, I'm not sure what you would be doing on e-Harmony either, so I guess it's a bad comparison...</p>
<p>Hahaa imagine going to RSI to look for a boyfriend!</p>
<p>Potential's ideas make a lot of sense to me, provided the last 100 or so supposedly "equally top" applicants are first chosen blindly, i.e., without the admissions committee being aware of an applicant's race or background.</p>
<p>
[quote]
are the RSI state readers located in mclean, virginia, or are they located elsewhere?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>CEE doesn't make the identity of any reader public, but they are volunteers from a number of science-focused organizations. This year's committee included faculty members from two (non-VA) universities, a member of the MIT admissions office, a researcher from NIH, and a faculty member of a state science and math high school. In the past, they've had people from biotech company labs and other corporate research facilities.</p>
<p>In the past, folders were copied and physically shipped to the readers, who read the files over a period of several weeks. I think they have finally moved to scanning the folders and sending the files electronically. Your update should have gone to your readers fairly quickly after you sent it in.</p>
<p>Your readers probably weren't from VA.</p>
<p>(No Asians were harmed in the creation of this post.)</p>
<p>lol. Thanks for making sure no Asians were harmed. :)</p>
<p>Funny thing.. I had a dream last night about being an RSI alternate and it sucking to be so close to getting in... and then my mom came in and woke me up telling me that she didn't think I was going to get into RSI (she reads another forumn that apparenty parallels discussion here). I was like.. thanks.</p>
<p>But back to the discussion, I really wouldn't mind them doing the whole 100 qualified applicants down to 60 thing. As long as they're choosing from a perfectly qualified pool, I'm all for it. (Secretly, being asian aside, that'd probably help me.. in terms of like ecs and leadership and not being a total nerd and being cute ;) haha jk about the last part and maybe the second to last too.) I just don't want the entire world to be... let's create perfect little bubbles of programs made of just the right diversity and all that.. when a program is focused on science, math, and research... we need people good at and focused in science, math, and research.</p>
<p>Oh and don't drop RSI too fast as a second eHarmony (no, I haven't been there.. or RSI)... nerd camps are deceptively .. interesting. (and looking through the pictures, there are a few normal ppl thrown into the mix.) Okay forget this last paragraph, NOW.</p>
<p>haha classof09.......</p>
<p>Have they already made their decisions. I know decisions are not out yet, but do they bascially know who is accepted?</p>
<p>The post was well written but looks at RSI centric world only. Here are some of my thoughts,</p>
<ol>
<li>There are excellent summer science programs that focus on minorities only who are very interested in science but may fall short of RSI e.g. MITES, Caltech's YESS and many others. If RSI is meritocracy then let it be. No need to dilute things just to be politically correct. You wouldn't want a less talented Asian to be in an NFL team just to meet diversity goals would you?</li>
<li>Many kids who get in to RSI are either 1st generation or immigrants. They worked hard despite not having grown up in the system. I personally know families where parents can't speak good English, don't know what looks good on apps etc. just because they do not know the US system. Only thing they have is a tight knit family that is committed to see the kid succeed. But, it is the kid that goes and identifies opportunities and competes for it. If they qualify for RSI, don't they deserve it? I think the whole thing starts with parents. If parents are able to motivate, kids respond. If the parents focus on things other that education, then the kids turn to other things.</li>
<li>Diversity is very misunderstood and misused concept often for political ends. I can understand the importance of diversity in a social sciences setting where a discussion can bring in various points of views. But, diversity in sciences and math!! I think this is where America needs its best of the best to maintain its lead. </li>
</ol>
<p>It is my personal opinion that entitlements should end in America. Giving out freebies, stops people from trying. In this competitive world, we should encourage trying hard and achieving be it sports, arts, science or math.</p>
<p>Unless I misread his post, potential's saying that my original argument - go with the top 50 people, period - had the exact same flaw yours has: there isn't a top 50 people. There's got to be more qualified applicants than CEE can afford to take in a given year, so why not try to have some diversity? And I don't necessarily mean ethnic diversity, I mean personality types, whether or not that happens to also mean ethnic diversity.</p>
<p>How do you know this privatecitizen? If so, do you happen to know if decisions have been finalized yet?</p>
<p>One could say that privatecitizen is "in the know," or something like that.</p>
<p>This is interesting, we're on page 67 now, last year the letters arrived when people were on page 46</p>
<p>Started with the user topasz on the East Coast who received it on 3/22/07</p>
<p>...This wait is killing me it's like waiting for AP test scores...</p>
<p>This wait is even worse than AP Test Scores (higher chance of scoring a 5 on an AP Exam then getting into RSI). I fear that the small 'rejection' letter will come anytime this week. If you look at the brochure it says that decisions come "the last week of March."</p>
<p>Who is really is privatecitizen?</p>
<p>I just read through most of privatecitizens posts, and I am almost certain that privatecitizen is Cliff Bowman or another adcom member in disguise. Although sometimes, his posts are disguised to sound like a high school student, it is almost clear that some of the opinions he presents are from the position of an adcom. </p>
<p>Ex:
"Students whose schools have a "direct-send" policy for official transcripts should include an unofficial transcript with their application and follow it up with an official copy sent from the school directly to CEE. The unofficial copy allows CEE to proceed with processing your application, but they do want an official copy for final selection." -privatecitizen</p>
<p>In the past, privatecitizen has answered questions regarding RSI solely in the perspective of the CEE. Moreover, he hid his email so that no one can see it which leads to more speculation.
It doesn't really matter who privatecitizen is, but it is very interesting how privatecitizen almost always responds to the RSI (2008) thread with responses in the view of the CEE! Also, at one point, he mentions that he is part of an admission committee.</p>