<p>Philly is absolutely awesome too. It's up there with NYC and Boston.</p>
<p>^ (Shhhhhhh! That's supposed to be a secret.) ;)</p>
<p>Penn may be slightly more prestigious but it's area is crime ridden, and rice is more laid back and in a much nicer area. I'd choose Rice.</p>
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<p>Haha good joke....Philly is nowhere near Boston or NYC, its a second rate city be serious....</p>
<p>^ Only to the culturally uninformed.</p>
<p>I sent a kid to each school (Penn and Rice). I believe Rice offers a better overall college experience and that Houston is a lot better place to be. I grew up in the Philadelphia area, so I have some basis for my opinion. I lived in Texas (not Houston) for almost 30 years. I think Penn is wonderful in many respects, but coming from Texas you are going to have quite an adjustment to Philadelphia and the attitude of many of the Philadelphians. I am a proponent of going away to college and getting out of your comfort zone, so you might need to look at some other schools, too. There aren't many negatives about Rice, actually, unless you want major college athletics which you aren't going to get at Penn, either. What about Vanderbilt?</p>
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I've lived in both Houston and Philly as an adult (still have friends in Houston and visit), and couldn't disagree with you more. I guess it depends on personal taste and preferences, and what cultural institutions and amenities you like to take advantage of, but I find many things in Philly that far surpass what's available in Houston. Not that Houston doesn't have much to offer, but it's clearly not "a lot better place to be" in terms of its cultural offerings and amenities. Not to mention Philly's unexcelled location less than 2 hours by train from NYC and DC.</p>
<p>Dude to anyone who travels and knows cities, philly is absolutely a second class city. its dirty it has a high crime rate and its food and cultural scene cannot compare to NYC or boston. My mom and many family members/friends went to Penn and this is confirmed by them as well, its nothing against the school, just the city. ALso I don't think Houston is that nice either, don't get my wrong. The best cities in my mind are Boston, NYC, LA, and I guess Chicago and San Francisco would be up there as well. O and DC was pretty nice also...but more of a "government" city than anything else.</p>
<p>Bescraze, you have no idea what you're talking about:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Philly has the Philadelphia Orchestra, one of the "Big 5" orchestras in the US, and one of the finest in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Curtis Institute of Music, one of the finest conservatories in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Philadelphia Museum of Art, the 3rd largest art museum in the country, and one of the finest in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Barnes Foundation, one of the largest private collections of Impressionist and Post-impressionist art in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Rodin Museum, the largest collection of Rodin sculptures outside of Paris.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Pennsylvania Academy of Fine Art, the oldest art school and museum in the country, and one of the finest collections of American art.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has one of the finest museums of archaeology and anthropology in the world (which happens to be on Penn's campus).</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has more works of mural art and outdoor sculpture than any other city in the country.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the Brandywine River Museum in Chadds Ford, which contains one of the finest collections of Wyeth Family (e.g., Andrew Wyeth) art in the country, and is a mile from Andrew Wyeth's house in the heart of so-called Wyeth country in the Brandywine Valley.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has one of the largest and most significant collections of historic sites and neighborhoods in the country, including the largest collection of 18th-century structures in the country.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has over 2 dozen professional theaters (including the country's oldest theater--the Walnut Street Theater--and the world's oldest opera house--the Academy of Music), and over 40 professional theater companies.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the largest urban park in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has more public gardens and arboretums than any other city in the country.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has the largest indoor flower show in the world.</p></li>
<li><p>Philly has a terrific food and restaurant scene (it's been called one of the best restaurant cities in the country by both Gourmet Magazine and Conde Nast Traveler Magazine), and Center City, alone, has over 200 sidewalk cafes and the Reading Terminal Market--one of the oldest and largest indoor farmer's markets in the country.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I could go on, but I think I've made my point. Anyone who thinks that Philly has a second-class cultural scene--espescially compared to cities like Boston, San Francisco, LA, Chicago, and DC--really knows very little about either Philly or culture.</p>
<p>How you feel about Philly and Houston depends on whether you prefer a city layed out centuries ago with row houses, dense settlement, and full of history versus a city which is car and freeway dominated, relatively clean, new and comfortable, but with almost no interesting history or architecture (except for modernist and post-modern). Although I'm Texan, I would take Philly any day. There are major weather differences, too, obviously. If you define culture by museums and orchestras, both are terrific, but Philadelphia the more outstanding of the two.</p>
<p>Wow Bescraze... have you lived in Philly? I assume not. I've lived here my entire life. 45 percenter is absolutely right.
I think the coolest thing about Philly, though, is that even though it is incredibly old, beautiful, and history-filled, it is still a "planned city" (one of if not THE first) so that center city is laid out neatly with no crazy windy roads going in strange diagonals.. it's all laid out like a piece of graph paper, and even though city hall is relatively far away from penn, looking down from across the river from campus you can see it in full view.</p>
<p>I thought about applying to Rice, but after talking to my cousins who actually lived in Houston, I decided not to. They have since moved. The atmosphere, they told me, is not really vibrant. It is neat and "modern" and all, but that isn't what I want... I want excitement and culture, and Philly certainly has that.</p>
<p>As for crime, you must be referring to a decade ago? I lived in West Philly for over half my life, and except for a few seedy areas it's improved immensely. Although Penn's campus was never unsafe, it is even more secure now because the surrounding area is much, MUCH nicer.</p>
<p>Philadelphia is not New York City. But it is still a wonderful city, and judging by the number of condos going up, it's not going to be getting any less wonderful.</p>
<p>With Philadelphia's rich history (as the site of the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, and the first US Capital), great restaurant scene, and pedestrian-friendly design, it is a particularly great city for college students. I would say for college students it is better than New York, as Philadelphia doesn't overwhelm traditional on-campus life as the Big Apple does.</p>
<p>And Penn is particularly well-positioned in the city. It may be the only major urban university where you can walk to the downtown core!</p>
<p>Philadelphia can not be seriously considered as one of the world's greatest cities. However, it is still a great city with a bright future ahead of it, with its great history, great environmentally friendly layout, great location between the two nexus cities of American power</p>
<p>are we going to talk about the schools or the cities?</p>
<p>Having a great place to spend one's leisure time with friends and lovers is an important part of the college experience.</p>
<p>Having spent my entire life in New York City, I have to say I was very impressed by Philly, and the prospect of going to college in Philly was intensely exciting to me. It felt familiar yet so unfamiliar. Obviously there are some hot zones one should have the common sense to avoid, and this rule of thumb pretty much applies to all major metropolitan areas.</p>
<p>Penn. Broaden your horizons and get out of Texas.</p>
<p>Philadelphia does have great history, museums etc. It is also expensive, dirty and coarse. Houston isn't any bargain- and I wouldn't want to live there- but the area around Rice is wonderful. To me, it is a nice place to go to college. There is convenient shopping- including the stuff college kids need like Target and grocery stores. All of that is a huge hassle at Penn. And there's the weather..... Texans are a lot nicer than Philadelphians. I am put off by the attitude of the City of Brotherly Love residents every time I'm there (which is at least 6 times a year). I recently spoke to a Texas family with a recent Penn grad. The kid loved Penn- the parents hated everything about the city and going up there to visit. I'm just sayin'- it's not a particularly easy city for a Texan.<br>
I could give you example after example. My son recently had some orthopedic surgery in TN that required some follow-up back in Philadelphia. EVERY aspect of the process was 900% more difficult in Philadelphia. We ran into one rude, unhelpful person after another just trying to get appointments, get the information we needed- EVEN with the TN surgeon calling directly. I asked the TN doctor if he was surprised at the difficulty and he said "I am shocked." This is the case with much of what you will try to do in Philadelphia. Just be prepared. There are good points- just be prepared for the people.</p>
<p>^The sports fans in Philly boo their own teams and players. They are not a nice people. I think Obama said people in Pennsylvania were "bitter" or something (at least that's somewhat true of Philly). For some of my southern and midwestern friends they have a tougher time adjusting to one of the less friendly mid atlantic cities. </p>
<p>Penn is as safe as you want to make it. Unless you are venturing out into dangerous areas late at night (why in God's name would you), you will probably last 4 years without getting mugged, shot, or killed. </p>
<p>
[quote]
There is convenient shopping- including the stuff college kids need like Target and grocery stores.
[/quote]
Penn has a grocery store on campus too along with 2 CVS's. Granted, there are no Targets, but we some how make do here at Penn.</p>
<p>Take what MoWC says about Penn with a grain of salt. Her views on Philly are valid (though you might not share her opinion) but her views on Penn's college experience are slanted towards her son's less than perfect years at Penn.</p>
<p>Venkat- my son is fine at Penn and likes a lot of things about it. He didn't care for a lot of things about his freshman year- and he was not alone in that opinion. Big classes, bad teachers. Soph year was a lot better except for having his room broken into, his computer stolen and then there was the matter of being assaulted by a state police officer and handcuffed spring fling weekend.
He liked most of the soph year classes.
My opinion of Penn and Philadelphia is entirely my own. I have spent a LOT of time there- both growing up and on many, many business trips and personal trips. It's a rough city and is not for everyone. Great if you love it, but don't try to convince anyone that it is a gentile and gracious place.</p>
<p>well i'm glad to hear that he had more fun his sophomore year. i wouldn't tell anyone that philly is a town with the nicest people you'll ever meet. was your son on campus or off campus when his room was broke into? there was something about a kid who stayed behind over a break and went into unlocked rooms in a dorm if your son was one of the people affected by that (he probably wasn't one of the girls who the pantie bandit stole from).</p>
<p>It's just a matter of cultural preference. As a Texan who has also lived in NYC (admittedly not Philly), I do not agree with MomofWC that Texans are nicer than Northeasterners. Texas and the rest of the South just have different social conventions. There is an emphasis on politeness here, which can make dealing with people in stores have more of a warm, fuzzy feeling, but that doesn't mean the people are truly "nicer." Check out Texas' crime stats, political leanings, death penalty stats, the stats on poverty and lack of concern with a safety net --- that's not all so "nice" in Texas. To call Philadelphia "coarse" is a pretty demeaning. The family that MomofWC refers to who can't even stand having to go there must have a very delicate sensibility indeed. I just don't see it. I think Philadephia is an exciting, vibrant place. As to schools, UPenn and Rice, what a wonderful choice to get to make.</p>
<p>He had plenty of fun freshman year, too. Fun wasn't the issue. :)
He was in a house just off campus- one of the slum-landlord row houses.
I'm glad so many people like Philadelphia. I like many things about it. I could not stand to live there. I went away from there for college and never even considered moving back. Penn is a great university and I'm glad my kid has the opportunity to attend. I have a lot of years of experience with many cities in many parts of the country, and I still maintain that Philadelphia is coarse and gritty. Not a bad thing for some people, but I think you can do better.</p>