<p>@mamalumper wrote: “the existence of a “culture” which is what some, including me, take issue with.”</p>
<p>What do you mean that you take issue with it? I take the “culture” to mean that there are systemic problems with exacerbate the problem. Do you disagree with that, or something else?</p>
<p>The Cville Police Dept. recently told Time Magazine that a formal investigation was not underway, because the victim had not made a criminal complaint.</p>
<p>How would police investigate a two year old alleged gang rape without the cooperation of the victim, I wonder. There is certainly no evidence anywhere.</p>
<p>That’s right, I think that sexual assault is a problem everywhere but I don’t think that there is a “culture” at UVA specifically that makes the problem worse. </p>
<p>I’ll probably get some flack for saying this, but does anyone but me feel that Jackie has an obligation to cooperate with the police? After all, she took the step of going public with her story? How can she possibly not assist the police in conducting a full investigation? </p>
<p>Wow, I just assumed she WOULD be working with the police. I don’t see them making any kind of case otherwise.</p>
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<p>Woah, slow down there… Who’s said anything about 500 Facebook friends - and extrapolating that into a survey of 1250 female students? No wonder a statement like “his female friends” seems fuzzy. Sorry, I was actually talking about real “friends” - you know, the kind you see and talk to in person, and are in clubs and groups together, do activities with. Yeah, that’s not quite 1250. </p>
<p>But, thanks for reminding us that the meaning behind current students’ first hand experiences, large or small, isn’t as important an issue than the semantics of how my son’s comment was written. Whew… glad we caught that before it got out of control! Just to be on the safe side: after conversations with his friends (it’s a bit of a hot topic right now on grounds for some reason) my son is not aware that any of his friends, or their friends, have been sexually assaulted. :)</p>
<p>Now, back on topic, even with a large assumption of a group of 1250, why would it be hard to believe that no one in that set could be the victim of a sexual assault - especially if you doubt the 1 in 5 statistic, which itself would equate to about 7000+ female students who are in that 4/5 group? I think the point of all of this is, regardless of what statistics on paper may indicate as a possibility, it’s very important to hear first hand experiences when terms like “rape culture” have been thrown around to determine if there is in fact an underlying culture problem, or if it is the same sexual assault issue (while still arguably terrible) as other universities. The issue for UVA to determine is, do they need to address how they handle sexual assault cases, or is there a bigger more pervasive problem in culture/environment that needs to be addressed. </p>
<p>“There were 12 million female students this year that entered college. If you use the 1 in 5 figure you get 2,400,000 women from this class who will be raped. If you use even the most conservative of figures (1 in 40) you get 300,000 women. The actual figure is probably somewhere inbetween, but to me that doesn’t change the point of the discussion at all. A problem is a problem is a problem. Even 300,000 puts you at a VERY big problem!”</p>
<p>300,000 women who experienced sexual incidents that may or may not include force and includes grabbing or fondling. That’s WAYYYY different from rape. It’s not at all good, but let’s not imply that either of those rates indicate 300,000 -2.4 million actual rapes.</p>
<p>A frustrating element in this whole issue is the requirement to constantly be clarifying that nobody in this discussion is pro-rape. I’m a UVa grad, I fully expect my daughter to attend next year; I would have no desire for her to walk into the Rape Central caricature that’s being assumed as fact in many public fora. I want meaningful structures set up to ensure public safety and effectively deal with victims of sexual assault. I would like programs set up to make male students less likely to attempt rape, although I have no idea what those programs would look like outside of “see? we’re doing something” sensitivity training that probably just makes the sensitive more sensitive, and has little effect on the insensitive. And I would like all of this to occur without infringing on due process, because living in the US should mean that both the guilty and the falsely accused have rights.</p>
<p>But I strongly disbelieve the RS account, for the reasons cited above and in many places elsewhere on the web, and I do not want that or misstated and misinterpreted data to dramatically hurt UVa. </p>
<p>^^^^^^ One “program” that would make male students less likely to attempt rape is to have a very public police investigation of Jackie’s allegations. The police and the University need to send a very strong message that these assaults are felonies and the offenders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. In other words, a strong dose of “scared straight” is needed here. Jackie needs to do the right thing and cooperate with the police…NOW!!!</p>
<p>To question statistics is not to say there is not a serious problem. However, the more reliable studies show that a relatively few number of predators are responsible for most of the sexual assaults on campuses. It is not a rape culture of very large numbers of guys. That is particularly why we need aggressive criminal prosecutions - so that the predators are not allowed to continue to prey. At many campuses, too many have gotten away with it for too long. </p>
<p>Expulsion is a first step, but may just move the problem to another college or another town. That is what happened with Hannah Graham. There were reports at two other colleges that her alleged killer had raped women there, but he was not prosecuted in either case. In at least one case, the victim needed to be hospitalized for physical injuries. He was apparently just told to leave each college, and the second college probably never knew about the incident at the first college. Then he allegedly found another victim in Fairfax County, and then found Hannah Graham stumbling through downtown Cville at 1 am.</p>
<p>^^^^^^ Back in the '70’s when I was an undergrad at Virginia, the Cavalier Daily would publish a black box on the front page whenever someone was expelled for an honor offense. It always caught my attention and was an ominous reminder of the severity of the punishment for violating the honor code. Public police investigations, trials, convictions, and jail sentences for those found guilty of sexual assualt would, in my opinion, stop all but the sickest serial rapists.</p>
<p>“and then found Hannah Graham stumbling through downtown Cville at 1 am” Wow, those images of Hannah still haunt me. This has been an incredibly painful time for anyone with any connection to the university </p>
<p>From today’s Cavalier Daily.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.cavalierdaily.com/article/2014/12/sullivan-hosts-sexual-violence-discussion”>Sullivan hosts sexual violence discussion - The Cavalier Daily - University of Virginia's Student Newspaper;
<p>I don’t know about the rest of you, but in my opinion, President Sullivan needs to be spending more time demanding a police investigation and less time with these genteel panels and receptions.</p>
<p>I thought there was a police investigation ongoing, although unless the victim is co-operating there is not much investigating police can realistically do at this point, either.</p>
<p>How can you truly investigate if the person alleging a crime doesn’t want to cooperate?</p>
<p>^^^^^ I don’t know. It’s just frustrating as hell that Jackie lays this out there, causes all of this uproar, and won’t help fix the problem. </p>
<p>^^^ That is what is frustrating to me as well. Nobody in their right mind with any connection to UVa, let alone humanity in general, would think that 7 people raping you is going to be condoned by anyone. Could it have happened? Yes, and I’m sure UVa wants to get to the bottom of this. The school is in a no win situation here. They can’t say exactly what they know because of privacy concerns and also don’t want to appear insensitive to what is a real problem that needs to be addressed, nationally. </p>
<p>U-Va. fraternity to rebut claims of gang rape in Rolling Stone</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/u-va-fraternity-to-rebut-claims-of-gang-rape-in-rolling-stone/2014/12/05/5fa5f7d2-7c91-11e4-84d4-7c896b90abdc_story.html?tid=sm_fb”>http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/u-va-fraternity-to-rebut-claims-of-gang-rape-in-rolling-stone/2014/12/05/5fa5f7d2-7c91-11e4-84d4-7c896b90abdc_story.html?tid=sm_fb</a></p>
<p><a href=“A Note to Our Readers”>http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/a-note-to-our-readers-20141205</a></p>
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<p>So publish an embellished, sensational story and throw your source under the bus. </p>
<p>I hope Rolling Stone has some good lawyers.</p>
<p>I’m sure they do. I just read the Post article - it seems Jackie wasn’t completely truthful either. But how can you not even verify the smallest of details? </p>