<p>Does anyone knwo the average SAT scores that one would need to get into these schools? And if you have a low SAT score will they overlook that if you have good grades and are talented enough to get in?</p>
<p>I think the answer varies from school to school. At NYU and University of Michigan, for instance, I am pretty sure that students must first pass an academic "muster" (which includes GPA and standardized test scores) before being allowed to audition. (I am certain that UMich vets kids academically first and then decides who can audition. I also know that NYU cares -- A LOT -- about scores and SATs. But I am not sure that NYU vets the academics FIRST. Soozievt? I just know that they vet 'em!)
If you are asking about CMU, I believe that somewhere on that school's Website, you will find average mean SAT scores for admitted students to the various divisions, from their engineering program to their College of Fine Arts. I am told by others here that, at CMU, the audition is really the most important aspect of your admissions package, but how important (in terms of %), I don't know. Anyone here? Keep in mind, however, that CMU has the reputation for being an extremely academically rigorous and selective school.</p>
<p>Re: NYU.....academic review is 50% and artistic review is 50%. However, there is no academic review FIRST (as in the case of UMich) and the processes are simulataneous. Also, you can't be admitted just academically or just artistically but it is a combination.</p>
<p>Re: CMU....the audition counts 90% of the decision. However, that leaves 10% of the decision. CMU takes VERY few students and so with talent being equal, other factors will come into play and so a strong academic profile would be helpful. There are average SATs for each college but I don't know for the theater program itself. For CMU itself...the mid SAT range (25-75%tile) of admitted students is 1290-1470. However, CMU, like many private universities, does not just admit by numbers but by your entire "package". Sometimes a lower SAT is compensated by a very strong GPA, rigorous courseload, outstanding ECs and recs and essays. Also, 25% of those admitted to CMU itself, have SATs below 1290. Their rate of acceptance is simply just lower odds but not impossible odds. The decision doesn't just go by numbers alone. Your chances can't be evaluated by that one factor. I'd say someone with a low or average GPA, no Honors or AP classes, low class rank, mediocre ECs, fair essays and an 1100 SAT is not going to look good against an equally talented person who has a stronger package there. But if someone has a high GPA, challenging HS course load, above average class rank, strong essays, significant ECs and achievements and good recs, then an SAT of 1200 might not be a killer there. So, it is hard to judge on that one piece of data. But as NMR says, CMU itself is a very selective university. It is just that the academic profile counts only 10% of the admissions decision for the BFA there. Nonetheless with so much competition for so few spots, having more than artistic talent ups your chances. </p>
<p>However, there are other BFA programs with lower academic qualifications needed to get in. You seemed to be asking about more than just CMU. So, for instance, some BFA schools where lower academic stats will have a better chance are, for example....Hartt, UArts, BOCO, Point Park, Marymount Manhattan, Roosevelt.</p>
<p>As far as I understand, faculty members at the College of Fine Arts (CFA) make a recommendation to accept or reject an applicant based solely on his/her audition performance or portfolio. The list of candidates who have been recommended for admission is then forwarded to a central CMU undergraduate admissions board that will check if the pre-selected applicants meet the minimum academic standards required by the university. In other words, your academic credentials are only reviewed by the admissions board if you meet first the necessary artistic requirements in the auditions or portfolio. Another difference is that a computer science, business or engineering applicant normally needs at least a 700+ SAT Math score plus two SAT II subject tests (in Math and Science) to get into CMU, whereas, for a CFA applicant, a 600 + Math score and no SAT IIs are probably enough (provided he/she has a satisfactory audition or portfolio of course). Keep in mind though that the acceptance rate for CFA as whole (i.e including the schools of drama, music, art, architecture, and design) is relatively low (approximately 20 %).</p>
<p>I don't think that there is a hard and fast rule that a CFA applicant must have a 600+ math SAT. I believe there is a minimum combined math/critical reading score that must be met, but I have heard of candidates for acting and musical theater who have lower than 600 on their math SATs and higher on their critical reading and still got in.</p>
<p>When my S had an admissions interview at CMU, he was told by the admissions counselor that "if the drama dept. wants an applicant, we look to see if he passed math" (implying that as long as the course was passed, that was good enough!)</p>
<p>There is never a "hard and fast rule" as far as college admission in the US is concerned considering that, unlike in other countries, the selection process here is not entirely objective. In any case, the 2006 middle 50 % SAT range for admitted CFA students (including architecture, art, design, drama, and music majors) was</p>
<p>Critical Reading: 590-680
Math : 610-710</p>
<p>Note that I'm not saying an applicant will be automatically rejected if his/her CR or Math scores are below 600. In fact, 25 % of the admitted students do have a combined CR+Math score that is less than 1200. I'm just saying that chances of admission in that case are lower, especially if the candidate doesn't stand out in the auditions.</p>
<p>I agree with bruno. There are no hard and fast rules and cut offs and the entire application is reviewed. That said, an applicant needs to pay attention to the MID 50% range of ACCEPTED students to that university or the school within the university. Like Bruno indicates, 75% of those accepted have a combined CR/M score above 1200. So, 25% of accepted students had an SAT below 1200, so some do get in. However, as he says, their chances of admission are lower, that's all. And of course the admissions office is going to look at their entire package of GPA, level of rigor of HS course load, grades, class rank, essays, recs, extracurriculars, etc. It is not like some state university that uses a formula for numbers. A high GPA and rank might compensate for a lower than average SAT for that university. However, somone with a combined CR/M SAT of lower than 1200 has a lower rate of admissions to that school than someone with a higher SAT. The facts speak for themselves. Don't use 1200 as a cut off to get in but if you have below 1200, your odds are lower; it's a fact. So, when so few applicants get into the BFA in the first place and it comes down to selecting those few, it does help to have a stronger OVERALL academic/application package in terms of the odds of being chosen over someone with a weaker package. If it comes down to two people being recommended after artistic review and one person has 1350 SAT, a GPA of 3.9, a class rank in the top 10% of the class, took the most rigorous HS curriculum offered at their HS, and has significant experiences and accomplishments outside the classrooom, good essays and recs....they are going to look more favorable than someone with an 1170 SAT, a GPA of 3.5, a class rank in the top 30% of the class, a less demanding curriculum, some ECs with no achievements or leadership of note, and so so essays or recs. That's just how it is. Applying to colleges, even BFA schools, involves selecting schools where one's "stats" fall in the ballpark of admitted students to that school, as well as evaluating the rate of admission at that school in terms of selectivity. A low rate of admissions decreases the odds in and of itself. When there is a low rate of admission, it sure helps to have stats in at least the mid range of previously accepted students to that college. There are exceptions, and kids with lower than mid range stats for that school do get in, but they are admitted at an even LOWER rate. Remember that someone who may have gotten in with a 1180 SAT may have had very strong stats and qualifications other than the SAT score itself, to compensate. You can't just go by person X had this SAT score and got in and so I can too because I also have a lower than 1200 SAT. That person may have been one of the few accepted with a lower SAT and had things to override that. It is not just a numbers thing at a school like CMU. For every person you know who got in with lower than 1200, there are likely three people who got in with substantially higher SATs. My own kid was on the Priority Waitlist there and her SATS are higher than any of the numbers bruno posted....in other words, higher than the mid range of accepted students. When a school takes so few for the BFA and there are more talented kids than they can accept, you can bet that a strong academic package will be an asset.</p>
<p>I had a personal interview with a CMU undergraduate admissions faculty member and he specifically told me that academic records are not reviewed until after auditions have been compelted so that they only have what, 20 students' academic history to review? He looked at my transcript alone (no SAT scores) and said I would be fine academically, so I'm pretty sure SAT scores aren't that important in this case...</p>
<p>My D and I just returned from meeting with an admissions officer and Drama Dept rep. Audition is 80 - 90% of the admissions decission - we were told this expressly. Acacdemic standards are "relaxed" from normal requirements. We were also told that no one can recall a student the drama dept really wanted getting rejected by admissions based on academics. So it would seem that as long as you don't come across as a slacker academically and have respectable grades and SAT's, there shouldn't be a problem on the academic front.</p>