SCEA Advice...

<p>Ambitiousmind07 - As a side note you may find interesting, you are one of four names taped to the wall above my computer. I am not sure when I wrote the names but they represented the beginning of a list of people that I had noticed gave helpful advice. Way back I also started a thread w/ regard to DDs scores and I had been surprised at the time that you were not one of the responders. If you are interested in giving your input here is the link to that thread: </p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/527115-act-score-value.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/527115-act-score-value.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Do you mind my asking what scores you are working with?</p>

<p>ivyleaguewannabe - I don't have as much experience as many but I would hope for Yale's sake that they would find your EC's appealing which I guess goes back to your original point. Your scores. The following link, for YALE Common Data Set 2007-2008, is interesting if you have never looked at the CDS for a school.</p>

<p>Smoda61 - Thanks very much for the compliment! That really means a lot, but I'm really only sharing facts that I picked up from web-browsing and campus tours. (Nevertheless, I'm always eager to share helpful information that I learn with anyone willing (or in the need) to listen.)</p>

<p>ivyleaguewannabe - Your scores/ECs/accomplishments/course rigor are all wonderful! (I personally love your internship duties.) You definitely do not have much to worry about. In fact, you seem to be the type of person who truly is a strong and accomplished student, but standardized tests simply taint your record (not in a bad way, just adds mixed feelings toward your overall application). My advice is the same as before: take the ACT in Sept. if you can and definitely retake the SAT I in Oct. (I'm not sure if this will make you feel any better about your standardized test scores, but my good friend applied to Harvard for the class of 2011 with a 1940 SAT I score (if I remember correctly). She was accepted early and currently attends. Mind you, she had a plethora of other strong aspects of her application, which I'm sure out-weighed her test scores.) The point is: think positively and hope for the best because you truly never know what will happen! Yale only gives us what a majority of accepted students receive on their test scores; they don't reveal the entire story...that would be too easy for us. (Try to enjoy the challenge that lies ahead.)</p>

<p>Ambitiousmind, your comment about the collegeboard sending ALL scores is now incorrect.
Check the latest news on their site, they just instituted a new "choose whatever scores you want to send" policy. I didn't believe it, but it's true!</p>

<p>Wait, I have a question, I've never understood the argument that SCEA is more difficult than RD. Wouldn't it be less selective?</p>

<p>The applicant pool is significantly stronger in SCEA. Simple as that.</p>

<p>Hookem168 - I wish you were right but the following text is from CB. For this fall's applications, the new policy which begins next spring will not help.</p>

<p>The College Board has approved an important change to the current SAT score-reporting policy. This new policy will give students the freedom to send the scores by sitting (test date) that they feel best represent their ability to colleges and universities, at no additional cost. Designed to reduce student stress and improve the test-day experience, this new score-reporting feature will launch in early February 2009, and will therefore be available to students participating in the March 2009 test administration.</p>

<p>For full text see:
New</a> SAT Score-Reporting Policy</p>

<p>Opps - here is that link for the CDS I promised a few posts ago.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.yale.edu/oir/cds.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.yale.edu/oir/cds.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>I would just add that the Common Application asks you for all scores. On other threads, people have struggled with what to do about that when they don't plan to send certain scores.</p>

<p>I don't know if I am missing something but here are the instructions from the standardized test common ap page:</p>

<p>"Be sure to note the tests required for each institution to which you are applying. The official scores from the appropriate testing agency must be submitted to each institution as soon as possible. Please self-report your
test scores below."</p>

<p>My thought is that D will submit common ap multiple times. I assume that that is an option. Four years ago we used common ap but all through snail mail and edited and printed according to the school. I am expecting to be able to do something like that electronically. If D is only planning to send ACT to a school then she'll put that in and then send to that school. If she has a school that needs ACT plus other, she'll fill that all in and then send. I assume that is how is can work.</p>

<p>PS I don't see any reference requiring student to submit all scores just all required scores.</p>

<p>"(If I didn't know any better, I'd say several people here are trying to discourage you from applying only to boost their chances (karma's a witch)...but, hey, what do I know?)"</p>

<p>oh excuse me, who the f--- are you? i don't think it's anyone's job on CC to be cushy and say that EVERYTHING ABOUT YOU IS WONDERFUL! for you to criticize people who are a little brutal and blunt in their opinions and assume the worst is pretty immature.</p>

<p>"[A]nyone's job"? - When did I ever say it was your job to say wonderful things about people asking for chances - better yet, the OP was only asking whether or not he should apply ED or RD. (This wasn't even a "chance me" thread like everyone was making it out to be. I simply did not understand why people would encourage the OP to apply RD without providing him with some other alternatives to apply ED. Besides, the only thing the OP needs to bring up (which he really doesn't have to for ED) is his SAT score.)</p>

<p>Furthermore, I was not even referring to your post when I made that comment. I did agree with you when you said that the next admissions cycle will be pretty rigorous.</p>

<p>One more thing: just as you have your first amendment right to protect your freedom of speech to be "a little brutal and blunt in [your] opinions", I too have my first amendment right to make sure the OP realizes that there will be people (not saying you) who will try to knock him down along the way....so that's who I am: someone providing another perspective to this lopsided thread. (For you to dismiss this logic is pretty immature.)</p>

<p>I think the instruction: "Please self-report your test scores below." is ambiguous. smoda61's interpretation, that this is calling only for the required test scores, is a reasonable possible interpretation. But it's not the only possible interpretation. Note that the section includes spaces for AP and IB test scores, which, as far as I know, are not required by any school.</p>

<p>This is the line that I actually feel is most important.</p>

<p>"Be sure to note the tests required for each institution to which you are applying."</p>

<p>It is telling you to report what is REQUIRED for an institution. Therefore if "ACT only" is an option at Yale and that is the score you wish them to consider then self reporting any of your SAT I or II scores is entirely up to you because they would not be required (I think that is the key word). In constrast if you were applying to Harvard you would be required to include the minimum of SAT I or ACT and 3 subject tests.</p>

<p>As for the AP and IB that are not always required despite the spaces on the common ap, Yale made it clear in last year's supplement that they are not so optional in the following supplement instructions:</p>

<p>"The Common Application provides space for you to report the results of the SAT I,SAT IISubject Tests, ACT,and TOEFL.Please list here any other
tests you have taken, such as Advanced Placement, International Baccalaureate, AHSME,AIME,Fermat, etc. If your secondary schooling has taken place outside the United States in a curriculum not patterned on the educational system in the U.S., you should request that your school submit the International Supplement to the Secondary School Report of the Common Application in addition to the Common Application’s School Report.
(Both are available on the Common Application Web site or on the Yale site at Welcome</a> to Yale College, Office of Undergraduate Admissions.)
Please list your test results to date. Include the name of the test, the date taken, and the score received for each one."</p>

<p>But that's what has me scratching my head. That language from Yale seems to suggest that you should fill out all the scores including ACT and SAT, while (as you correctly say) they only require one or the other to be sent. What the Common App should say is: "Self-report all scores required by the college, as well as any others you choose to report."</p>

<p>I think Yale is just telling you that the SAT I, SAT II, ACT and TOFL are to be supplied in the common ap and not in this space they are providing in the supplement. Also, who knows if that instruction is even on the new Yale supplement. MB they will expect the AP's etc to be provided on the common ap now. </p>

<p>Keep in mind the common ap provides you options and spaces to provide what is required and/or you chose to provide. If applying to yale and using an SAT I , as most students do, then you would also have to send in the Subject tests. If you apply using the ACT then that is the only thing required. Should you chose to, and it supports your best application, you could send it all as my son did in his applications 4 years ago. His ACT and super scored SAT I were equivalent. We felt by providing it all it would be clear that his "best" score was not an accident. </p>

<p>Lastly, I agree that your suggested Common Ap phrasing would better fit what is expected.</p>

<p>i have a quick question:
If you just send in an ACT (31) score, would the admissions council see that as unfavorable?</p>

<p>^I think it would be unfavorable because most applicants take 2 or more SAT IIs and do well on them. Sure you can just send in the ACT without any problems. But when comparing applicants, you will be disadvantaged simply because others have shown their competence in various subjects. You should try to get in at least 2 tests before applying. I also have a question. I took SAT II Biology twice. Should I list the lower score on the application or just put down the higher one?</p>

<p>I'm going to agree and disagree with hawkphoenix. First, I don't how the number of scores submitted should affect the applicants chances to Yale. Yale states that "ACT only" is an option. There are students across the country that have only taken the ACT test and therefore would only have that score to submit. If Yale held that against them, they would be doing a disservice to themselves by potentially eliminating students from these regions. Second, it would also mean that Yale is being disingenuous in their applicant instructions and I don't see that as being something Yale would do. If they wanted to be able to consider more tests, they would have no trouble requiring them as Harvard does.</p>

<p>The part I will agree on is whether the 31 is the score that joyogunx wants to submit. I began a thread a few months ago wondering if my D's 33 was good enough. The input I received was mixed and can be viewed here;
<a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/527115-act-score-value.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/yale-university/527115-act-score-value.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Since then I have looked at Yale's CDS:
<a href="http://www.yale.edu/oir/cds.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.yale.edu/oir/cds.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>In the CDS, one can see the the 25%-75% ACT range for admitted students is 30 - 34. So 31 is in the range but at the lower end. What that chart does not take into account is the point made to me in my old thread is how location is factored into those numbers.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Yale states that "ACT only" is an option. There are students across the country that have only taken the ACT test and therefore would only have that score to submit. If Yale held that against them, they would be doing a disservice to themselves by potentially eliminating students from these regions.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yale does allow students to submit ACT only, and there are certainly areas of the country where the ACT is more popular than the SAT. But I am not aware of any region of the country where it's impossible to sit for the SAT I or II. Two students in my son's school (in ACT territory) got into Yale this year without submitting SAT I scores. Both, however, submitted SAT IIs along with their ACTs. There is a regular CC poster, though, whose daughter got into Yale on the strength of her ACT (35) only -- no SAT IIs.</p>