Just weighing in - I found CC when my D was a HS Sophomore. I distinctly remember the night I found it - because I didn’t hit my pillow until the wee hours, because I was reading so many back posts. That being said - during D’s sophomore and junior years - I took breaks from CC (especially during decision season - just made me far too anxious!) There is a lot of info here - it is skewed toward what the active posters know - and the active posters represent a tiny subset of the audition pool (although I suspect that more of the pool is represented in the lurkers). I think that as updates are reported for the big list - they are being made - but don’t confuse the big list with the list of schools at the top of the forum… the big list is in a pinned post - and includes FAR more programs than the schools at the top of the page.
For “hidden gems” - I’ve sent many friends heading down this path those articles on “The most underrated theater programs” because I think those are gold mines of information!
Good luck to all… and I’m grateful that CC started buzzing about Baldwin-Wallace a few years ago - because that’s what put it on our radar… and it is, of course, the place where my D is happily in her sophomore year!
@kategrizz … I think in the spring of 2014 I must have read every single thread here in the MT section. It was crazy! (And educational & eye-opening!) And btw, I though the Big List meant the subsection list of schools up there ^. Thanks for the clarification!
@brightstaral , since your D would like to stay close to home, check out U of Alabama Birmingham’s new BFA program. The department head is driven, enthusiastic, positive, and professionally well connected.
@theaterwork , you are ahead of the game. Good for you! It may be good to take a breather for a while–a few weeks or even a couple months. Your D can, of course, keep developing artistically, but you can take a break for a bit and be just fine!
It think part of the conflicting message you got from Muhlenberg had less to do with getting into programs (Muhlenberg is non-audition) and much more to do with what it takes to be a working actor.
When D and husband visited Muhlenberg for D’s talent scholarship auditions, she was also told to get as much dance training as possible and to continue with ballet. Charles Richter made it clear that he believed that the only real way to be an actor who is working with real consistency is to be an actor who can also really dance. He told H that the majority of working roles in theatre are in ensembles and most of those require major dancing skills. He also said that they would always cast a dancer who can sing adequately over a great vocalist with only adequate dance skills. Of course if you score the lead, you might not have to dance at that caliber, but Charles felt that it was unrealistic to expect the lead without years of (ensemble) experience.
I would say that what I see in terms of D’s friends who are auditioning aligns with this theory. Even among males, dancing has been very important. The two male actors from her program who are currently on Broadway have been required to dance well (lead in On theTown) and ensemble in Book of Mormon.
I found CC in the spring of D’s junior year. It was eye-opening to say the least. And at that time, Coastal Carolina was definitely not one of the talked about programs. They were just making the switch from the BA to the BFA. My D’s class was the first to enter as BFA majors. CCU wasn’t even on her list. I asked her to apply because I just got the right vibe, mainly from Ken Martin’s post here on CC, about it being a good fit for her. In the end, it came down to CCU and NYU as her top choices. I can’t tell you how many people questioned her choice when she chose CCU. That’s how off the radar CCU was at the time. But it was a great fit for her and she received exceptional training and support. So keep exploring those lesser talked about programs. Cast a wide net. You never know what you might catch!
@uskoolfish I totally understand the advice from Muhlenberg on the dance training. I know it’s important. I think it was the way it was presented, as if my D , as a 16 yr old junior, should just pack it in and go into another field if she hasn’t been classically ballet trained since age 5. She currently has dance at school from a qualified teacher who has worked on tours, etc. Took tap in middle school and even though it is not a huge strength right now, she does have essentially 5 more years to grow in dancing and improve. I know the triple threat thing is a factor but you can’t tell me everyone working in the industry is stellar in all three from high school! I felt it was discouraging to someone who truly is actively seeking the training. I have to disagree about the “casting of an adaquate singer”. I also think it depends on the show. My D would not audition for a dance heavy show if she thought she wasn’t qualified for it at that point in her career.
@uskoolfish and @theaterwork , both of you bring up a great point…and one that I and others have questioned for years…is it better to be a singer that can dance, or a dancer that sing?
@theaterwork, for what it’s worth, Carnegie Mellon no longer includes dance in its audition - their attitude is that acting and singing are the most important talents to have when you arrive, and they can teach you dance once you’re there. So not ALL schools have the attitude that dance is the most important thing.
The way the rep at CMU explained the decision to drop dance as a requirement when we visited was interesting. First, CMU thinks they can teach anyone to dance well enough to be cast, given four years. Second, the entertaining industry is broad, with lots of opportunities for their students beyond singing and dancing. They are training kids for the long haul–beyond the few years out of school when they might be cast in Newsies-style shows. They want their MT grads to be equally comfortable as straight actors, screen actors, and recording artists. And so, while dance is important, it is not the end of the world if your kid is not classically trained or a demon tapper. Personally, I love the perspective that the industry is growing in all directions into all media. So, in putting together my son’s list of schools, we looked for programs that would give a broad as well as intensive training so that he could look beyond his first couple of years out of college and into the future as an all-round performer. It’s unlikely he’ll beat the odds and end up at CMU, but there are many other programs that offer a similar broad perspective on the entertainment industry and that are trying to keep up with the changes. I’m not saying dance isn’t important, just that it is not a deal-breaker for a lot of schools. Good luck out there, everyone!
@claire74 that is what I’m saying. You have lots of opportunity to learn a ton of dance or improve on your dance in 4 years of school. I know I’ll take heat for saying it but I’ve always thought you cannot teach someone that cannot sing to sing well enough to be cast in a decent part… Just my opinion. I just think you have a lot more control over training your body to do something like dance then you do in getting your voice to sound a certain way and I think it is easier to teach yourself to dance fairly well then to sing . Dance tends to have a lot of gray areas and there are so many styles to choose from and work on . Singing is singing folks and you either can or you can’t…again just my opinion.
While being world class at all three would obviously provide the most opportunities, there’s work (never enough for everyone) for both singers who move and dancers who sing. Our D has been steadily employed for the past year and a half (knock on wood) and she’s not a dancer, but there are of course dance-heavy jobs she’s not well suited for. Also, my observation is that girls (pretty much without exception) who are cast in dance-heavy roles need to have started dancing very young. I suppose, as has often been said, the key is to be the best version of yourself.
How do you find out if schools have good MT programs without them being talked about a lot on here? My family doesn’t have the money/time to travel to a lot of campuses, so without programs being vouched for/spoken of often on the internet, how do I find programs that are “lesser known” but still good? Should I look around the website? What should I lookout for? The curriculum? Staff credentials? Alumni success?
Sorry if this seems like a ridiculous question, I’m new to this crazy process
One of the tools we used was YouTube. You can search “Music Theatre Freshman Showcase” (or some combination of that, or even try adding school names) and watch and compare. We were able to learn a lot about programs just through that. We would always try to find something we liked about each program and things that could have been improved at each. We watched several years of showcases at several schools. Then, for the schools we were very interested in, we tried to find a freshman showcase and senior showcase of the same class and looked to see if there was improvement over the years and we noted what areas we saw the most and least improvement. In addition, you may be able to find clips or even entire videos of school shows on YouTube. Those can also be informative. Not all schools provide these videos, some are posted by parents, students, etc., and for some schools it is difficult or impossible to find any video. But, you will find many easily.
Videos can be great- but be careful. There can be a huge difference in the production values of a main stage vs say a student works production. Also - as mentioned above- many schools do not post videos of shows or showcases.
Just did a very quick search (spent about a minute searching) and found CCM, Elon, Western Michigan, Indiana, Wright State, Ohio Northern, Ball State, Montclair State, Marymount, Alabama, Northern Colorado, CCPA, Rider, Steinhardt, Belmont, Florida State, and Point Park. The majority of the videos were posted by the programs themselves, so the quality is quite good. I’m sure there are more, I just didn’t continue looking through them.
Since main stage vs student works was mentioned, I will say that CCM’s freshman showcase is done entirely by the students from conception to final show. The students choose the concept (title), do all song and monologue selections,blocking, choreography, clothing selection, set, etc. They are responsible for organizing all rehearsals outside of class time. Faculty gives nods of approval throughout the process, but the entire show is the work of the freshman class. I assume many of the other showcases are run in a similar fashion.
I don’t know that showcases give you a strong idea of curriculum and focus of program- though they can be helpful in determining a schools’s “type” (both of kids they accept and perhaps of types of shows they feature based on song choice) Dusing mentioned CCM’s, so I pulled up the 2015 version. I see talented singers -but what else am I learning about the school?
I know WSU has an “official” Facebook page for the Theater, Dance and Motion Pictures Department. They don’t necessarily post videos, but you can get a sense of what’s going on in the department, alumni news, etc. Perhaps other programs do this as well.
