SFS vs Yale - advice from current students?

Colleges & Universities A-Z Georgetown University
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<p>I had been planning to apply to Yale SCEA and SFS regular as statistically speaking, I'll have a better shot at Yale early (17% vs 5% RD). But of course, the people that apply early are stronger applicants, so I'd have more intense competition anyway and the best that I could hope for is a deferral.</p>

<p>Meanwhile, the more that I think about SFS, the more that I think it's my first choice. I have a good chance of acceptance either EA or RD, but it'd be nice to know, by mid-December, that I have been accepted to my top choice.
I also wouldn't have to apply to the other schools that I was going to apply for, though I'd probably still do Columbia and Yale just to see whether or not I get in.</p>

<p>So from what I've said it seems obvious that I should apply EA to Georgetown. But... I still have some misgivings about Georgetown. I dunno if I can deal with the uberpreppiness, for one. When I visited campus, many parts of campus didn't impress me too much, though ultimately I don't care too much about buildings etc, and I also felt way too uncool for the extremely well-dressed beautiful people everywhere. Oh, and I also noticed that everyone was on their cell phone ALL the time - heh, that i was there anyway. But the cell phone thing can't be just at Gtown, right?</p>

<p>And Yale undergrad life beats Georgetown by far - the residential colleges, the extracurriculars, the increased focus (from what I've gathered) on undergrads, etc. But then Georgetown's got the Dip Ball, SFS [heh, Georgetown IS the sfs, according to facebook :D] trick-or-treating on embassy row, DC (!!!), internships, the millions of classes on IR, politics, etc, that Yale has not, and more. </p>

<p>To sum up, Georgetown is better for what I want to study and do - int'l politics and gov't, respectively, but its undergrad life seems less strong than Yale.</p>

<p>So I guess I'm asking all of you already at Georgetown for any information or advice on student life, classes, contradicting/supporting my observations, and general advice. </p>

<p>Thanks!!</p>

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<p>bump...any comments?</p>

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<p>I am not a current student, but an alumnus of SFS, who attended Columbia for grad school and whose roommates at Georgetown attended Penn, GU Law and Cal Berkeley for grad school, so I do have a perspective about a number of institutions. Two things distinguish Georgetown from other schools and they should help you to make your decision:</p>

<p>1) Georgetown views the acquisition of knowledge as a means to make the world better and not an end in itself. At Georgetown, students always ask the so what? question again and again, and do not let issues die. The tone, will obviously affect the experiences you will have in your academic work. At Georgetown, you are surrounded by people with a passion that almost will not die. This kind of passion and search for the greater and practical purposes of knowledge does not exist to as great a degree at Columbia or Cal. The issues in class do not end with the class at Georgetown but affect all your thoughts the entire semester until the class really does end and the ovations are given.</p>

<p>2) Every professor I had at Georgetown really cared about me as a person and student. I had professors at Georgetown actually invite me to their office hours and to impromtu discussions after class. This never happened at Columbia or to my roommates at Penn or California.</p>

<p>My experience is over ten years old so things might have changed but please use what I say for perspective.</p>

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<p>Why would you go to a school that isn't particulary strong in your intended major?</p>

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<p>Vienna - thanks for the info :) Thats basically how I look at knowledge and learning as well. It's fun and all, but it's useless unless something is done with it.</p>

<p>Akajjred - Yale isn't weak in intl studies or political science, it's just not as great as gtown...</p>

<p>any other advice, comments, and whatev?</p>

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<p>I dunno if I can deal with the uberpreppiness, for one.</p>

<p>You learn to deal with it. There's plenty of people that are happy here without being uberpreppy, although (in my experience) you may find yourself becoming a bit more preppy/narcissistic. There's always a niche that you can feel comfortable in, it's just a matter of finding it.</p>

<p>I also felt way too uncool for the extremely well-dressed beautiful people everywhere</p>

<p>Yea, I know what you mean. You really shouldn't care about what people who judge you based on clothes think anyway, though, and in my experience most people aren't that shallow, even among the Lacoste crowd. Wealth doesn't automatically equal vapidness.</p>

<p>the cell phone thing can't be just at Gtown, right?</p>

<p>Nope, it's everywhere</p>

<p>And Yale undergrad life beats Georgetown by far</p>

<p>I dunno about that...can't speak about the residential colleges, but I very much enjoyed my 12-person freshman year floor and some of them are my best friends to this day.</p>

<p>the extracurriculars, the increased focus (from what I've gathered) on undergrads</p>

<p>Georgetown has plenty of extracurriculars and is pretty undergrad-oriented itself.</p>

<p>But then Georgetown's got the Dip Ball</p>

<p>Dip Ball is wildly overrated</p>

<p>*SFS [heh, Georgetown IS the sfs, according to facebook ] trick-or-treating on embassy row, DC (!!!), internships, the millions of classes on IR, politics, etc, that Yale has not, and more. *</p>

<p>These factors, and others like them, are why I don't regret having been rejected from Harvard and MIT. For a certain type of person, SFS is a perfect fit and can't be beat.</p>

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<p>Just to add my two cents - I will be at SFS in the fall, applied EA and got in then. dzleprechaun said "For a certain type of person, SFS is a perfect fit and can't be beat." - and I think I'm that type of person, which is why I don't regret being rejected by Yale (Regular Decision). Now that it has been a few months, I know that SFS is absolutely the right choice for me, and getting into Yale or even being waitlisted would have complicated all of that. I took a summer course at Yale last year, and it was great, but now I get to go further away from home to a school that feels exactly right for me. I can't think of a better curriculum for my interests than what SFS offers. </p>

<p>Yale deserves all of the praise it gets, but my guess is that you shouldn't necessarily underestimate Georgetown's student life compared to Yale's. At the open house I attended, the president of GAAP, a senior, said this: "If you love Georgetown, Georgetown will love you back." That has stuck with me since February, and I think it's very telling of the experience many students have at Gtown. </p>

<p>So like I said, that's my little piece. I have not actually attended college quite yet, but those are my impressions from applying to both schools and getting into Georgetown.</p>

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<p>I turned down an offer by the college this year but I visited a few times just to be sure... and here's what I gathered from my visits: Georgetown has very beautiful girls lol. I'm going to a school notorious for its ugly student body and I must say that the factor I just mentioned was one of the few that made me re-consider my choice a few times over...</p>

<p>On a serious note though, I think that the SFS is one of the few schools out there that can decisively prove that the image it has fostered is truly deserved. I live in DC so I know a lot of people who work in gov't, and Gtown is veeerryyy prominent. From people in the White House to - especially - people in the state department, Gtown has a very strong pull. Gtown has a very strong history of involvement in central-american politics as well. All in all, if making the difference is your thing, I think that moreso than any other school the SFS has the knack to attract talented students with these same kinds of aspirations. I'd pick SFS over Yale...</p>

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<p>Yale actually has a stronger alumni network in politics. Bush, Cheney, Kerry, both Clintons, Lieberman, and many others all went to Yale. A Yalie has been nominated for the White House in every national election since 1972. In terms of IR, Yale dominates as well, with a better representation among the Foreign Service than any other university by far. At one point recently, the ambassadors to the United Nations, Russia, France, U.K., Germany, Japan, and China were all Yalies. Georgetown also does well, but it isn't Yale.</p>

<p>The Boston Globe wrote that "if there's one school that can lay claim to educating the nation's top national leaders over the past three decades, it's Yale." (Boston Globe, 11/17/2002).</p>

<p>Also, according to the National Research Council, Yale has one of the top three political science departments in the country - Georgetown doesn't make the top 40.</p>

<p>All in all, I would apply early to the school you love most - because otherwise you'll regret it, and because you'll do best if you go to a place you really like, socially and otherwise.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
you may find yourself becoming a bit more preppy/narcissistic.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Preppy doesn't mean your narcissistic. Maybe you're talking about fake preps. Fake preps are the AE/Abercrombie/Aeropostale wearing cheerleaders. The real preps are people who wear Ralph Lauren, J. Crew, Vineyard Vines, etc. who are very nice.</p>

<p>:)</p>

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<p>I am 100% sure that Bill Clinton went to Georgetown SFS for college.</p>

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<p>Ah, Jonathan, thank you for teaching us. What exactly are these "goth" people I keep hearing about? And are there "fake goths?" What about "sk8er bois?"</p>

<p>Anyway, if you want to go to SFS, then go. If you don't, then don't. Because once you get there, nobody is going to want to hear you say, "I got accepted to Yale, but I'm coming here instead, just so you know." Go where you will have less regrets. And if you're truly intelligent, going to Georgetown instead of Yale isn't going to hold you back anywhere except Skull & Bone reunions. Just take it easy.</p>

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<p>The last listing the state department published had Georgetown atop the list of new foreign service officers with more entrants than the next three institutions combined, so I don't see how Yale could possibly have more foreign service officers than Georgetown. This listing was from the late 1990s as I recall. If you have more recent information, please share it.
Also, Georgetown SFS has either a current (Jordan, Philippines), future (Spain) or immediate past Head of State (United States) for four of the largest countries in the world. Pretty impressive for a little school with an undergrad class of 350 and a grad class of maybe 100 people per year.
SFS alumni have run the American Labor movement (Lane Kirkland), the American Military(the current Supreme Commander of NATO and the Commander of our troops in Iraq are alumni) and the American Catholic Church (Cardinal O'Connor of New York). The Solicitor General of the US also comes from SFS.</p>

<p>Go wherever suites your heart best, but don't think Georgetown limits your future in any way versus any other college.</p>

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<p>Yale = National Influence
Georgetown SFS = International Influence
Just a thought.</p>

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<p>Agreed. (10 char.)</p>

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<p>I think both produce alumni with international influence. Of course Clinton went to SFS, but all the connections that helped him later in life (such as all his lawyers, cabinet members, advisors, friends, and even his wife H.C. and a guy he first campaigned for named Joe Lieberman) were made through his time at Yale. And to a smaller extent Oxford, where he was a Rhodes Scholar. He kept few friends from SFS. Read David Maraniss's world-famous biography of Clinton (if you can - it's very, very long) and you'll see. </p>

<p>I don't know if SFS alumni ruled over Jordan, but I know Yale alumni have become the President of Mexico and 4 of the past 6 U.S. Presidents. Like the Boston Globe said, no other school can lay a claim on having so much political influence.</p>

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<p>...And an SFS alumn Dick Durbin is the Minority Whip of the Senate. I am sure that he and your guy Lieberman regularly lunch together. </p>

<p>As to Clinton, come on, his whole staff was full of Georgetown people. His Chief of Staff was John Podesta, Georgetown. His Secretary of State was Madeleine Albright, Georgetown SFS faculty member. His legal counsel was Bruce Lindsey, Georgetown, His press secretary, Mike McCurry, Georgetown. His budget director, Jake Lew, Georgetown. His Deputy Treasury Secretary and National Economic guy before Rubin was his classmate from Georgetown, Roger Altman. His Commerce Secretary and early chief Fundraiser was Mickey Kantor, Georgetown. (His soundest political decision was not signing up Robert Shrum of Georgetown to do his 92 campaign.) His CIA Director was George Tenet, SFS. It just goes on and on and on.</p>

<p>I know that if I were President I would have a helluva hard time running a country without a chief of staff, omb director, cia director, secretary of state, press secretary and national ecomic policy advisor.</p>

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<p>and I'd be in especially deep yogurt being both without all those people and not having a Yale degree</p>

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<p>Thanks for all the input :) I don't think that Georgetown will limit me in any way, and quite frankly, though Yale and Georgetown had powerful people in the past, none of them will equal me in the future ;)</p>

<p>Anyways, in all seriousness, I'm leaning (a lot) towards Georgetown, but am looking for a bit more info/anecdotes/experiences etc about campus life before I decide finally. Thanks!</p>

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<p>Good Luck. Make a good choice</p>