<p>I don’t think the videos posted in April were about killing. He talks about being very lonely and depressed and they are described as bizarre. The ones about killing and suicide were posted the day before the murders. They are all available still on his youtube channel so anyone can look at them to see if they amount to probable cause. </p>
<p>^^I would not want to be his parents. On top of losing their son, the guilt over his actions would be too much to bear. And it goes without saying, the parents of the victims have suffered so much and their lives will never be the same.</p>
<p>In one of the articles in the link a few posts back, it says that the young man wrote in his manifesto that when the police came to investigate in April, they asked him if he had suicidal thoughts. That implies that the mom and then the therapist reported that the videos indicated concern with suicidal thoughts. That is why I question why the police would simply take the boy’s word for it that he felt fine!</p>
<p>That’s why I think it was more of a welfare check than an investigation of a planned assault. He didn’t say he felt fine, btw. He reportedly told them he had been depressed and was planning to leave school. Although the school said he was a perennial drop-out so I don’t know what that means, exactly. But, if the threat is suicide it explains why they said they gave him some referrals and called it a day. Again, what can they do about that? A 5150 requires a lot more than depression and in any case he would have been back out in 3 days with nothing changed. It’s an awful quandary. But, it’s not a new one. Sigh. </p>
<p>In April there were 22 videos, according to the SJ paper. A number of them have been taken down. I forget where I read it but the disturbing ones that triggered the police check mentioned suicide and murder, apparently. </p>
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<p>No.
That only implies that the therapist was concerned that he may have suicidal thoughts.</p>
<p>Anyone seeing the videos (perhaps others were taken down) would likely think that he may harbor suicidal thoughts. </p>
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<p>Did the manifesto mention that the police asked about threats of violence towards others?
If not, it is likely the police weren’t told that since I would expect they would ask that before asking about suicide.</p>
<p>As someone mentioned, the family may be CYA or may have thought he was going to hurt someone but did not mention that to the police.</p>
<p>I only know what was reported. And in many articles, it mentions that the mother alerted the therapist who alerted police because the videos (which are not the ones you can view online now) did mention suicide and killing. I would imagine they had to give a REASON to police as to why they wanted them to investigate. </p>
<p>A lot of news outlets are very confused about the videos. Several are clearly referring to the Retribution video and the manifesto as if they had been available longer than they had. I haven’t seen anything definitive that earlier videos talked of murder and suicide. As a parent seeing how lonely and depressed he was, even in the ones that are just him riding around listening to sad '80’s music, I’d be really concerned about his well being. </p>
<p>A threat to self and others reported CAN get someone in psych lock up for 72 hours. Whether that would do any good or not, who is to say? If the mental health workers see disturbance in that time period, whatever interventions staged at that time, whether it’s meds , therapy, admissions to a psych unit, anything,might have prevented the melt down. </p>
<p>I don’t know precisely what happened here with the parents’ reports and why the young man was not admitted when the parent feared suicide. Sometimes when you want someone locked up, you have to push the point and let the authorities know that if something happens, you will make a stink if you have evidence that would make them look bad. . You cannot be wishy washy or reluctant about the whole thing. </p>
<p>The problem is that there are a lot of episodes that border and cross into the psychotic fringes with people, and most places do not have the capacity to lock up everyone so reported. So one has to be firm about the fear and danger when reporting a loved one in such a case. The problem is that most of us hesitate to do so,and the authorities do not encourage this action when reporting to them. </p>
<p>So, the mom called a counselor who called a mental health agency who called to the police. That sounds wishy washy.</p>
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<p>Wishy washy? Not to me! The mom was concerned and she called the professional who was familiar with her son’s case and who she could turn to for advice. That person suggested alerting police to have them check on the young man. Sounds pretty logical to me. In fact, I am impressed that parents would go so far as to have police get involved with their son, something not all parents would do. It sounds like they had valid concerns and did not sit idly by.</p>
<p>Soozievt - We don’t know who this counselor is or how familiar or not they are with this person. We just don’t. Then the counselor called an agency and then the agency called the police and requested a welfare check. How much info the police got is a big unknown. It seems logical that if they knew he was suicidal and had weapons they would at least question him about that. It didn’t happen. Maybe, because they were incompetent or maybe because they were not told these facts. We don’t know. Meanwhile, some reports say the young man had been refusing treatment since he turned 18 so who is this therapist people keep referring to? It’s LA. There are a lot of therapists.</p>
<p>To be clear, I am not at all blaming the parents. It’s a just tragedy all around.</p>
<p>The Sheriff’s Department says they were not aware of any videos until after the shootings.</p>
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I actually could not tell he is partly Asian by his picture, till I noticed the name of his mother.</p>
<p>One of the girls in the suite next to DS’s suite in college is a mixed Asian/white. She looks more Asian than white. When another student thought she’s Asian by mistake, I heard she would be very upset and sternly correct that person’s mistake. It is her “hot button” you had better not push by mistake. (BTW, I heard her family is extremely wealthy; I am not sure whether their wealth comes from her father’s side or her mother’s side, or both.)</p>
<p>A sad fact…in the case of Weihan “David” Wang (slaughtered roommate) and Christopher Michael-Martinez (boy killed at deli)…both were only children. Their parents lost their only child. Makes their suffering even worse! :(</p>
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<p>Well, they could ask if they could have a look around because you don’t need a search warrant if someone grants permission. He could have said no, but that might have raised concern. A common intervention with people who are suicidal by mental health professionals is to remove means. The police could have asked if he had a plan and if he had means. They could have contacted an emergency psychiatric team and requested that he be visited for further assessment. Handing someone who is actively suicidal a list of referrals is not that proactive. </p>
<p>I’m not criticizing the police who went to visit this young man in April. But apparently there is an internal investigation now reviewing that visit/intervention. And even if all protocols were followed, perhaps it might cause some review of such procedures in the future. mimk6, you make some good points in your post.</p>
<p>When parents are so deeply concerned to go to the extent of contacting police about their own offspring, it is pretty serious. </p>
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<p>Most of my nieces and nephews who are Asian/White would pass as White unless you knew one of their parents is Asian-American or they revealed that fact…which most are proud of doing. They would regard your S’ dormmate’s behavior as sad and pathetic based on how they viewed classmates and others they’ve encountered who exhibited the same behavior. </p>
<p>I had a brief period when I was ashamed of being Asian-American like your S’ dormmate…at the age of 5-6 due to racist bullying in first and part of second grade. Thinking about that still makes me cringe in shame at how pathetic it was to be cowed in such a manner. </p>
<p>Thanks to some counseling from caring teachers and a counselor and having the gumption to confront my much older and larger bully and giving him a stoning he’ll never forget, I got over it not too long afterwards as a 6 year old second grader. :)</p>
<p>I do feel for the parents. A couple of weekends ago, my son wasn’t doing well. Nobody else probably would have noticed it, but I’ve learned to look for subtle signs. So I asked him directly, and he mentioned the “s” word. 9:30 pm on Saturday. I literally held the phone in my hand, wondering whether to call 911, the crisis hotline, or his doctor (of course my husband was out of town!). I decided to call the doctor, who was very helpful. He had me ask my son for his three biggest stressers, then we addressed each one of them. It turns out that his end-of-the-semester projects were making him anxious, so we had him request extensions for two of them. It was a rough couple of weeks, but he turned in the last project at the end of last week. An anti-anxiety med was particularly effective, so that will be a tool we canl use in the future.</p>
<p>If he had been living away from home, things might have turned out differently, because I wouldn’t have known he was struggling. Mental illness is MUCH tougher than I ever realized. My son probably could have convinced police officers he was perfectly fine, even when he was at his worst.</p>
<p>ML, I am glad your son is OK. That must have been terrifying. I hope he continues to feel better.</p>
<p>Some of this does go back to “how well do you know your kid?” If the IV shooter’s parents knew how at odds he felt in the world of the “beautiful people,” maybe allowing him to live in Santa Barbara wasn’t the greatest idea. I have a hard time believing they hadn’t heard his rants for some time, as his list of injustices seems to have been formed some time ago. I also wonder what effect spending time in a very different place (i.e., Asia, Africa) might have had on him. I am not suggesting that anything would have cured his mental illness but he might have gained just a tiny bit of perspective.</p>