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<p>And how do you get the health care professionals in that clinic, hospital or doctor’s office to treat that person? I’m just wondering how this works. Suppose I got three of my son’s burly friends to carry him into a psychiatrist’s office. What happens then? I’m pretty sure the psychiatrist would tell them to let him go.</p>
<p>CTTC - No, they expect nothing. And, they know it’s all about feelings which is another way of saying nothing changes but’s lets pretend until all we feel better. Some are insulted. Some are angry. Some are sad. But, I don’t think there are many that actually expect anything to change. And, I’d be very surprised if many start reaching out to the creeps. That’s too much to ask. imho.</p>
<p>A simple thing if you don’t trust your creepy roommate: Bedroom doors with good locks. Either these roommates didn’t think he’d kill them in their sleep or they were careless or the doors didn’t have locks. If he’d had to break down the bedroom doors the noise would have given them a fighting chance.</p>
<p>“I’d be interested to see how the murderer could have been prescribed that medication and yet, not be entered into the database considering the types of disorders it’s supposed to treat would have necessitated the MH professional to enter his name into the statewide database and legally precluded him from owning firearms.”</p>
<p>Perhaps the prescriber was not aware of that requirement. I know I am not, and I prescribe that and similar meds daily. Sometimes to 5 year olds. Are you thinking there is an age requirement for the gun data base? I am aware of the requirement for those who were 5150’d, but I am not aware of how the information gets entered. But I don’t do inpatient psych, and do not have 5150 authority.</p>
<p>One other point I’d like to make. Many think protecting rights of those with mental illness is just as much about “managing” spending. I think those of you who hold the “mental health system” responsible for preventing mass murder should take a look at what their county, state, and medical coverage pay per member, on mental health benefits. If this is the first time youv’e looked, think about why. </p>
<p>Shrinkrap, can you give us a feeling of who gets prescribed Risperdal, and why you’d prescribe it? I got the impression it wouldn’t be the first medication tried, because it’s got a lot of nasty side effects. Is that correct?</p>
<p>Risperdal is definitely not the first medication tried under normal circumstances. It falls in the category of atypical antipsychotics, which are used for schizophrenia, bipolar, and some off-label uses such as for Tourette’s, obsessive-compulsive disorder, and agitated autistic patients. When prescribed, it’s often used to calm down highly agitated people. Because the side effects are severe, it’s not used lightly.</p>
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<p>Actually, risperidone has been prescribed “off label” for years for conditions as inconsequential as insomnia. It’s only more recently that its black label warnings have made it a drug that is only prescribed to people with more serious mental health issues.</p>
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<p><a href=“Possession of Firearms by People With Mental Illness”>Policy Research;
<p>Unless the law has changed or there is something that supercedes the statute quoted in the link above, there was nothing in ER’s background that would have disqualified him for gun ownership. </p>
<p>TatinG, good point about the roommate situation. I’d like to know more about how he leased the his share of the suite. I imagine that privacy laws prevented the landlord from disclosing any information about Elliot’s mental health issues, if she/he knew anything about them at all. That’s a good question; what were the others legally entitled to know about their suitemate? Particularly one whom has no arrest record or other legal infractions on file?</p>
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<p>Some drs may be prescribing alot of off label meds, but it pretty much seems like overkill to prescribe an anti psychotic for insomnia.
The same drs probably prescribe antibiotics for a cold & ADHD medication for every kid who thinks hell get better grades with it.</p>
<p>So, I don’t know the specifics of that building but most these off campus apartments rent you a room with random roommates unless you apply as pre-selected group… Every bedroom is locked until a new tenant arrives. They rent bedrooms, basically. S is in one of these at a school not far from UCSB. They are very common living arrangements at many if not all of the CA schools.</p>
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<p>I’m sure you’re right, as regards the doctor’s office. (Part of my point was that one cannot compel a person to go the doctor, much less check themselves into a hospital. 
) In the hospital situation, the person brought in by the police will, in my limited experience, be taken into the locked psychiatric ward and assessed. In this state, they can be held for perhaps two to three days in the hospital if it is found to be medically warranted, and then transferred to the psychiatric hospital if “blue-papered.” (And if a bed is available, which is not always the case.) I don’t think the psych hospital can FORCE a person to participate in therapy, though, and I’m not even certain if they can administer drugs against the person’s will. And the person is entitled to a legal hearing on a weekly basis before a judge, who decides whether to keep them for another week if it is against their will. It is very, very difficult to keep someone who doesn’t want to be there in a psychiatric hospital. </p>
<p>Right, Consolation, and bringing someone against their will to a locked psychiatric unit requires intervention by the justice system. A parent can’t just check their adult child into a hospital against the child’s will. </p>
<p>Right. It’s very difficult and at best temporary anyway. Given what we know about ER I doubt it ever came up. The parents were in denial and living on hope by the end and whatever he was getting in terms of treatment sounds spotty and extremely ineffective. You cannot just send an unwilling adult to the psyche ward. Anyway, completely loony people who are picked up on the streets mumbling and disoriented are back out the next day. He was not insane. He was crazy and evil. And, lock-up would at best have delayed the retribution. Heck, he delayed it in April because he had a bad cold.</p>
<p>My son takes risperidone (Risperdal). It is the only med that has worked. The side effects are manageable. We hoped that clozapine would work for him, but he had a very rare side effect (esinophilia) on it and had to stop. He has schizoaffective disorder, a combination of schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. For some reason, the prognosis for SAD is better than that for pure schizophrenia.</p>
<p>NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) issued a statement on the Santa Barbara tragedy: <a href=“http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Section=press_room&template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=168540”>http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Section=press_room&template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=168540</a></p>
<p>One of its main points is that police officers are being asked to make determinations that should be done only by mental health professionals.</p>
<p>One problem I see with “the system” is that the word just doesn’t get out about available resources. I learned about NAMI, for example, through a family friend. Doctors and therapists should tell EVERY client and family member about this group, and the free classes and support groups they offer.</p>
<p>I went to a NAMI conference last month and found out about adult case manager services. Why hadn’t I heard about this before now??? My son has been ill for 3 1/2 years! Since he’s on MaineCare, the service is free. A NAMI staff employee told me about the best agency in the area for the service. I called them today and have an intake appointment already scheduled for my son. The case manager will meet with DS periodically and come up with a long-term plan for employment and living arrangements. He or she will also be available when DS has concerns or is in crisis.</p>
<p>So in our state, at least, there ARE resources available, but I feel it’s like a game of Super Mario to find them. Or maybe it’s like a treasure hunt. And DS is lucky. My husband and I both have advanced degrees and also the time to help him. Most patients aren’t that fortunate.</p>
<p>@Consolation, a hospital can administer drugs if it declares a “psychiatric emergency.” I’m not sure what all qualifies as that, but I know that they can administer an anti-anxiety drug to bring someone out of a catatonic state, since catatonia can be fatal. You can probably guess how I know about this. 
It was scary.</p>
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<p>He was not insane, he was crazy? Um, what?</p>
<p>The parents were in denial???</p>
<p>Yea, I don’t think so. You need to find the article written called, “I Am Adam Lanza’s Mother”. Google it and read it. It will teach you a lot about what parents of kids like this go through trying to get help for them. </p>
<p>What were the parents supposed to have done?</p>
<p>I can’t see that the parents had much at all that they could have done, and what they did try was for naught.</p>
<p>Interesting that someone with untreated TB can be institutionalized against his will, and forcibly treated, but those with psychiatric disorders that are wildly uncontrolled are allowed to roam at will, inflicting damage where they choose. </p>
<p>Well, for one thing, they could have required that the checking account and the credit cards be joint with a parent. At least they’d know that he was spending the money they gave him on guns. It’s unfair, but parents of mentally ill non-self-supporting 22 year olds need to practice extra vigilance. They were worried he would do ‘something’. </p>