<p>Here is a snapshot of my DD:
-3.97 GPA UW/4.66 weighted
-All Honors curriculum. School doesn't offer AP classes
-Very small school with 17 in Junior Class and the school does not rank
-She is very involved with sports in school playing 3 sports every year, but not a strong enough athlete to be recruited.
-She just took the SAT for the first time and will take ACT next month, however PSAT score was 207 and PLAN was 27.
-Strong leadership with team captain and school leadership positions
-Accepted into several selective programs including a full-scholarship archaeology summer field study, the Naval Academy's summer program and NASA's women's STEM scholars program.</p>
<p>Her first choice for college would be to go to one of the Service Academies and we believe she could have a very realistic shot, but they are very competitive and are definitely reach schools.</p>
<p>Besides that, she is considering schools who have engineering programs, Army ROTC, an Honors Program and are in the western US. With the combination of her wants/desires, she has narrowed down her choice of schools to several state universities in AZ, CO, WA, OR and a few Catholic Schools in WA/OR. Other than those schools, the only other "reach" school is USC, which she is really not fond of. </p>
<p>It will be imperative that whatever school she goes to will have strong merit scholarships, as due to our complicated family financial situation we have a very high EFC, but cannot put much toward her college expenses. We are also not fans of taking on high school loans for that "dream" school. Here safety schools are our state flagship schools that all offer the programs she is looking for and where we know she will qualify for a full-tuition scholarship.</p>
<p>She has a fabulous college guidance counselor who is trying to get her to expand her search to include more competitive schools in the Midwest and East and believes she is selling herself short. There are so many schools that I have great reputations that I believe could offer great opportunities. Do you think I should push her to consider other schools? Or should I allow her to move forward with the search parameters she has established for herself and support her? She does not have her heart set on any of these schools and is touring many of them to get a good feel for them and the programs they have to offer.</p>
<p>Thanks for your advice. While my husband and I both went to college many years ago, we never had all of these choices open to us.</p>
<p>In my opinion, if she goes to a reach school, you are likely to have to pay more out of pocket. If you are looking for significant merit aid, you want to be closer to the top of a school’s stats (GPA and grades). kip linger magazine puts out an article each year on best value schools, and it includes a column on % of students getting merit aid, and avg. Amount of merit aid. You may want to check it out. There’s also a thread on schools with good merit aid. My son with pretty good stats wound up only applying to a handful of schools, and not applying to a dream school, simply because that school gives a very low number of scholarships and he wasn’t in the running to get one.</p>
<p>I agree. A reach school would be one where your daughter is NOT at the top of the applicant pool. That being the case, her chances for significant merit aid are reduced. There are many wonderful colleges that are NOT reaches where your daughter could get an excellent education and could garner some merit aid as well. </p>
<p>I would suggest that you check out the financial aid area of this forum. There are a couple of threads about merit scholarships…but these would NOT be reach schools.</p>
<p>In my opinion, your daughter has enough reach schools on her lost already. The service academies are reach schools. As an FYI, for USC, their best merit awards are for NMS winners.</p>
<p>If you’re going on a merit aid hunt, OOS publics are not really the best route; private colleges that give merit aid where your D is in the top quartile of applicants may be better. These may not be admissions reaches for your D but they will suit your budget. There is an inherent tension between seeking reach admissions and needing merit aid. If you are not eligible for need-based financial aid and/or you can’t really afford your EFC, high selectivity is a luxury you may have to forgo. It’s all relative, though; there are many fine colleges that would offer merit for your D’s stats.</p>
<p>I agree with the other posters that you are unlikely to score big merit at a reach. I also wouldn’t have her apply to a reach she doesn’t like. </p>
<p>Did you choose these schools because they have merit for which she would qualify? Usually, out-of-state publics are not generous with aid but there are exceptions. I’m not sure how low you need the contribution to get but Case Western-- which I realize is outside of her preferred area-- can be generous with scholarships, particularly partial ones. Has she considered University of New Mexico? [Undergraduate</a> Scholarships :: | The University of New Mexico](<a href=“http://scholarship.unm.edu/scholarships/index.html]Undergraduate”>http://scholarship.unm.edu/scholarships/index.html)</p>
<p>MidwesternHeart, Is she applying for an Army ROTC scholarship? Her stats and sports participation and being a female would really give her a leg up. An AROTC scholarship would open the doors to many universities for her plus the military education she’s interested in.</p>
<p>My S went to college on a NROTC scholarship. It paid full tutition,books,fees,uniforms and a monthly stipend that increases each year.</p>
<p>(You did not mention your price limit or state of residency, which would help others suggest financially realistic options.)</p>
<p>Most midwestern state flagships are considered good for engineering, so if she is sure that she is in with full tuition scholarship that makes it affordable, she may not need many (or any) other schools on her application list besides the academy.</p>
<p>But it does not hurt to look at others she may consider more desirable than the flagships if ROTC scholarship or other large merit scholarship is a possibility at such schools. However, as otherwise noted, reach schools are unlikely to offer big merit.</p>
<p>What is considered “reach” for a female engineering Army ROTC candidate is different than what it would be for the rest of the population. With that said why not add 1-2 reach schools in the mix – if she gets in and gets an AROTC scholarship there, it would not be a financial burden. Is there some reason she’s considering the service academies but other colleges must be in the West? Is it that she will make the sacrifice to come east for an SA but otherwise would rather not? Because you could add 1-2 eastern reach schools that fit your criteria.</p>
<p>Just make sure those eastern reach schools GIVE merit aid. There are a bunch of reach schools in this the east that give need based aid only and that will not help this student.</p>
<p>The student sounds like she wants to stay in the west. If the service academy she wants is the Air Force Academy, that is not in the east.</p>
<p>The OP wanted to know of more reach schools should be added. I suggest adding ONLY schools that this student LIKES and would consider attending which will also give her sufficient aid to attend. If you are adding reaches for the sake of adding reaches, I would say…don’t.</p>
<p>Does your daughter WANT to go to a highly selective school (other than the service academies, which are a special case)?</p>
<p>Not everyone does. Some people are more comfortable being in the top half or even top quarter of the class, especially if they’re planning on a relatively difficult major such as engineering.</p>
<p>^^Right. My S took his NROTC scholarship and marched straight to our big state u.<br>
It didn’t matter that he could have gone across the country or applied to a “reachy” school. He knew where he wanted to go and stuck to it. He ended up with two merit scholarships to add to the NROTC scholarship which added up to a full ride.</p>
<p>I’m not that familiar with engineering schools in the West, but I know her stats and profile could get her some serious merit awards at STEM-focused schools in the east. You might want to give a few of those a shot just in case. They may prove to be cheaper than many of the OOS schools on the list.</p>
<p>Here are a few answers to some of you who have kindly responded:</p>
<p>1) DD really only would be willing to the service academies in the east, as we do live in the west and she would prefer to be a bit closer to home, although if she had her druthers, not In-state.<br>
2) She will absolutely be applying for ROTC and, realistically, many of the schools she has attended will only be remotely possible, if she does get one of those scholarships or other hefty merit scholarships.
3) Outside of the ROTC scholarship option, we are only looking at schools that have the possibility of very generous scholarships, even though the school may only offer a few of them.
4) I am from the midwest, originally, and there are so many fabulous schools for her to consider there, compared to out west. It’s like night and day, when it comes to the selection, IMHO.
5) We are using Naviance to narrow down the list to the original criteria of engineering, Army ROTC and merit aid. She is not concerned with the school size, nor if it’s urban or rural.<br>
6) With all honesty, I believe the most we can afford to contribute to her college annually will be about $7500, which is why we have all come to conclusion will be doable at the Flagship State Universities with the scholarships they will offer her and a few others that she will most likely get from my employer. She will certainly still try for the other schools/scholarships, and the good news is I know she won’t be crushed if that is where send ends up.
7) She will be below the NMF cutoff score in our state, but she will most likely be commended. We’re hoping for a bit of a lift on the SAT and ACT tests to improve her credentials.
8) I like Case Western Reserve alot, but even with their best scholarships, there would still be too much of a GAP for us.
8) I’ve not quite figured out if she really doesn’t want to go to a more selective school or if deep down she doesn’t feel that she is good enough to get in. I know she has no aspirations to go to the Ivies, which I know don’t give merit aid anyway. Her Guidance Counselor seems to feel it is the latter. I just personally wish she would open up to considering WASH U-STL, Notre Dame, Rice, etc. which if she DID get an ROTC scholarship to, would allow her to go. </p>
<p>Advice for ROTC scholarship…Have her start early. It’s a long involved app. S had an interview for the NROTC scholarship right after school was out in June of junior yr. Make it a priority to get the AROTC application in as early as possible. I believe my S submitted his NROTC app. in early Sept. of senior year. He was notified in late October that he had gotten the scholarship and was admitted to big state u. a few weeks later.All done before Christmas. Made for a much more/enjoyable relaxed senior year.</p>
<p>There is a lot of FA money at some “reach” schools, but it is hard toguage without SAT scores. For ROTC and Engineering, she might want to look at Virginia Tech and Texas A&M. She should also look at Tulane. Sounds like a great kid - best of luck!</p>
<p>If she wants to stay in the west, then look for schools in the west. I’m from the Midwest too…sure, there are some great schools there, but there are tons of good schools west of the Rocky mountains too.</p>
<p>The grass is always greener…my kid applied to colleges in CA and we are from the northeast.</p>
<p>Thumper 1, You are so right about the “grass is always greener.” Our state public schools are ones that kids from all over the country are clamoring to get it in. But our DD sure has the desire to get away, but not too far away. She’d at least like to be within 1 time zone of us. Personally, in her situation, I see no benefit of going to an OOS State School when our own In-State, State Schools may have an even better reputation for her major. At least she has always know what our parameters for ability to pay have been from before the start of this journey. I think there would be nothing worse than for her to fall in love with a school and then tell her there is no way that could pay for it. I just can’t see taking out $40k/year in college loans. There are so many quality schools that I don’t think she would really be at a disadvantage in going to an In-State public school and leaving with no debt when all is said and done.</p>
<p>There are hundreds of ways to get from your starting point to the ultimate destination…</p>
<p>One is to go to a ‘reach’ school.
One is to go ton LAC.
One is to go to a regional university, either state of private.
One is to go to your state flagship or land grant.
One is to go to another state flagship or land grant.
etc etc</p>
<p>In the end, ignore most of the chatter on CC, and make the best decision you can for your family. That is all that matters. The reality is that it probably won’t matter one bit if your kid graduates from U WI or U Washington or U Iowa or Tulane or Colorado College. If she is driven and active and does well at school; nobody will care where she went.</p>
<p>My son wanted the big time sports experience. Some we threw out right away…Boston College, Wake Forest, Syracuse, Tulane…they were going to be way too expensive for us (run the NPC for each school) and not all that much better than our instate options. We then looked at schools where he could receive good merit even as an OOS student…Alabama, Ole Miss, Montana State, Arizona State…</p>
<p>In the end, he chose our instate Land Grant. The cost savings will be used to fund study abroads, summer trips, etc. Things we would not have been able to afford had he gone OOS. All of us will be debt free. He can do a double major and take an extra semester or 2 if need be and it won’t be a problem.</p>
<p>Noted your interest in Catholic schools, and offer an excellent Lutheran LAC instead - St Olaf in MN, 45 minutes from Minneapolis/St Paul, in same charming small town as Carleton College. Olaf has great financial aid, and excellent merit aid for outstanding students (ACT 32+), while Carleton has great financial aid but little merit aid because everyone is outstanding. We loved Olaf, which is academically strong, has a beautiful campus and great food, and has about 3200 students. A Catholic student would feel welcome and happy here.</p>
<p>Sounds like you need financial aid and merit aid to pay for college. If so, you should target schools were your daughter is at least in the 85% Percentile of applicants for access to merit aid, and look for schools with “meets need” financial aid commitment. Pursuing true “reaches” seems counter-intuitive. There are many great schools where your DD could get both great education and college experience, and the aid needed to realize it.</p>
<p>I think that it’s good for students to “get away” for college, to experience another region and locale, all things being equal.</p>